I'd agree that the record companies don't get it but I don't think I've heard the correct answer here. ... What I suspect has hapeened is that this whole morras has damaged the publics perception of music ... I just don't think music generates the level of passion that it used to. ... none of them seem in the least bit interested in music.

farss,

I think you are quite correct: we haven't heard the answers either, both to the question as to why music sales have declined, nor how to fix it.

All your points are valid. With the Internet, portable audio, hundreds of satellite TV channels, DVD rentals, etc., the radio no longer has the primal influence on culture that it did in the 60's. A "payola" scandal would be impossible to duplicate today, simply because the DJs (or their central programming equivalent) have absolutely no influence on what gets purchased. There is no longer any point in trying to bribe them.

Ravel once wrote of his Bolero that "I have written only one masterpiece. That is the Bolero. Unfortunately, it contains no music."

This applies to much current pop "music," much of which lack any harmony, lyrics and, in the case or rap, melody. Pretty much just curse words set to a beat.

>This applies to much current pop "music," much of which lack any harmony, lyrics and, in the case or rap, melody. Pretty much just curse words set to a beat.

I agree that most pop music is lacking. But the problem isn't whether it has harmony, melody, or lyrics, or whether it is composed entirely of curse words (even nonsense words spoken to a beat can be good - curse words can be too - often I can't understand the lyrics in songs and yet I like them - and there are reams of pop songs with melody, harmony and good clean lyrics, that simply falls flat and does absolutely nothing for me). No the problem cannot be defined as any technical problem with the music. The problem is much simpler. Pretty much everything on pop radio and MTV stinks! :) I can only assume that the bulk of the pop music market is supported by teenagers.

Oh and I love bolero. I consider it classical trance music. :)

This applies to much current pop "music," much of which lack any harmony, lyrics and, in the case or rap, melody.

John, that's what my parents said back in the 60s. Now, I'm guilty of doing what I swore I'd never do--I making the same complaints they did! <shudder>

I really do believe that a great part of the decline in the music industry is due to the lack of talent, to put it simply. My kids, all now grown, would rather listen to my music than what they grew up on or what's playing today.

J--

I've always considered it to be my fault if I come across music I don't like. As though there is no good/bad music, only appreciated and unappreciated music, the inability to appreciate being a shortcoming of my own self.

That said, my inability to appreciate does seem to be growing lately---- :)

I really do believe that a great part of the decline in the music industry is due to the lack of talent, to put it simply.

My grandfather visited me a few weeks back. He said that rap is bad music because the lyrics are so dumb. I say, if you aren't listening to good music, you have to wonder about your sources. Let's face it, the pop music industry has never been about good music. Dial up your local community radio station if you have one. There you may find people who love music and are volunteering to share it with others.

Now finding a way to pay the artists you discover can be a bit more challenging! I think that's the real problem with the music industry. I would never expect the best of the best to be spoon fed to me on TV / commercial radio, but I would at least like to be able to buy the obscure stuff that I discover a little more easily. I think that's the direction we're heading with the Internet. It will take a long time for the channels and the networks to form.

Ben, I guess what I was thinking was there have been no groups or individuals recently (past 20 years or so) that have had the impact that some recording artists of the past have had. Elvis and the Beatles are the first to come to mind.

J--

I know what you mean... it's similar in the jazz scene. Why aren't there any Miles Davis's in the present day, trailblazing new, deep, sounds that impact the entire scene? There are a lot of factors at work, one of which is the inability to keep a band together in today's culture. At least, that's what Chick Corea says.

In support of that theory, I have seen many examples of ground breaking musicians with lots of talent and new sounds - but the group only makes one or two albums and then breaks up for whatever reason.

>>>I sure know plenty of teenagers yet none of them seem in the least bit interested in music. It used to be the thing that defined a generation but it seems not anymore.<<<

I think you need to go into areas where teenagers listen to undergroud music more - and in paticular the "goth" scene. It is hard on a singer/songwriter level perhaps to go out there ala 'folk music' and get to teenagers that are into the 'bling-bling' and the beat more than anything. But there are certain scenes where music is still actually listened to and I know for a fact one of them is "goth". And I don't mean the mainstream idea of what it is now- Evanescence and going into Hot Topic and buying a look off the shelf. I mean the 50 or so kids in almost every town that sit and listen to the words, that go to the one goth night held at a club 40 miles away. Thing is that this music is not being pushed by MTV and not being pushed by Clear Channel so thusly it is not being 'heard', let alone being seen. And when something like Columbine happens, just because the kids might have listened to some main stream shock metal act that the 'industry' markets as "goth" suddenly everyone who wears black and looks 'goth' are killers.

The teenagers of today do listen to music, but they have also been raised on MTV and they don't so much "listen" to it as they do "Watch" it. Ironicly if you look outside of the obvious pop icons, things are less image than they were in the 80's yet more people look at videos now and use that to set radio airplay. In turn what do film makers do? "Wow I would love to make that Avril song into a film! How much can we buy up the rights to 'Sk8r Boi' for?" On the other hand you have a film that does use little known bands and can turn a relativly unknown band like Wheatus into a 'hit' because their song 'Teenage Dirtbag' was used in an otherwise forgetful film.

And than we have "Glitter" and "Gigli"

*sigh*

1965 was almost forty years ago (shudder). When we grew up in the '60s, forty years before that was 1925. How many tunes from 1925 were played, or listened to in the 1960s? For that matter, did any of us in the 1960's ever listen to swing music from the 1940s? No way. Yet my kids (teenages) regularly listen to music from the 1960s and 1970s -- not just covers of those songs, but the original artists. This supports what you are all saying, namely the creative well has been pretty dry for quite awhile.

This happened before. For instance, quick, try to remember any significant popular songs from the 1950 to 1955 era (post swing, pre-Elvis). I actually have a CD of the top songs from 1952. Not one recognizable tune in the bunch.

Filmy,
I hadn't thought about the goths!
You're right though there's still many teenage cultures that are heavily into music but I don't think it has the impact on the mainstream teenage culture that it used to. I guess music vids have played a large part in that with everyone wanting to 'watch' music.
As an aside best MTV I've seen comes out of India.

Probably what we need is an unpopular war where you could feel OK about supporting the other side.

Yet my kids (teenages) regularly listen to music from the 1960s and 1970s -- not just covers of those songs, but the original artists. This supports what you are all saying, namely the creative well has been pretty dry for quite awhile.

Yep that's a good point... when I was a teenager I listened to classic rock - never cared for the pop stations. My dad would say... Why are you listening to that old music - that's what I listened to when *I* was a kid! And my younger siblings listened to classic rock as teenagers... and I know many teenagers now who listen primarily to classic rock. That music just keeps resonating with young people. Maybe the music of the 60's / 70's was kind of like the adolescence of pop music. The music was growing up and it was exploring - drugs, new ideas, freedom... I wouldn't say the creative well has run dry - at least not exactly... but once you grow up you can't grow up all over again (even if the industry keeps trying to pretend). Pop music has grown up and just like us, it can never be that way again. Now you can still find a wealth of creativity, but it is fragmented into all the different scenes like Goth, Metal, Electronica, Rap and Hip Hop, etc... We'll probably never see a musical movement that resonates so universally with teenagers again... but hey it’s just my crack pot theory.

But I like the underground music scene now too. I'm listening to Hip Hop Flavors on WMNF 88.5 TAMPA and it's a blast... even at 11khz. (hey it's community radio whaddya want!) Best way to find good music? Probably any listener sponsored radio between 1am and 4am.