Frustration extracting DVD files.

farss wrote on 8/17/2009, 6:38 AM
I have a 55min program on DVD that I need to edit. All other DVDs from the same client that I've authored no problem. Several others that he's got from our national archive no problem either. I'm simply stuck and somewhat frustrated by this one 55 min DVD.

As the program is split over 4 VOBs I ran it through VOB Merge to get one VOB. Drop that into V8 or V9 and I get only the first 29.970 seconds. I also tried just the last two VOBs but same outcome. I inspect the media properties and find the streams are 29.976 seconds long? What a strange number.

So in desperation I try PPro CS3. Now it gets really wierd. At first PPro tells me the frame rate is 29.976 and when I drop the clip onto the T/L....there's only 29.976 seconds of it. Then after a few minutes of Ppro thinking about it, bingo, it decided it really is 25fps. So I drop it onto the T/L again and heavens above, the clip is 55 minutes long. Only problem now is no audio, yish.

So I try using DVD Shrink to merge them VOBs, no joy, same result.

Next effort, renamed the VOB to mpg and dropped the file into DVDA. DVDA says the video is only 29 second long however the resulting DVD will be around 4GB!

PGCEdit reports only one minor gripe about this DVD, there's no first play entry, doubt that's significant.

Final effort. Open V8 and try Import Camcorder disk. V8 finds 19 VTS Objects and proceeds to import them. Start dropping these onto the T/L and it looks and seems to sound OK. Only wierdness now is the waveforms do not match the actual audio. They show and the meters read a big glitch where the VTSs join but the audio sounds OK, this gets wierder by the hour.

Another intersting thing. I only need the first 4 minutes of this DVD so I figure I don't need to merge the VOBs anyway, the first one has go to contain at least the first 4 minutes so I drop just it straight from the DVD onto the T/L. Well Vegas thinks it's only 29.976 seconds long but the audio plays at the wrong speed.

Unless someone has any bright ideas I'll simply playout this DVD in a STB and capture it. This is a freebie job anyway. Why are they always the ones that cause the most grief :)

Bob.

Comments

PeterWright wrote on 8/17/2009, 7:07 AM
> "This is a freebie job anyway. Why are they always the ones that cause the most grief :)"

Thank heaven for small Murphys. And the Law they left behind.

Sorry, no solution Bob - old fashioned capture sounds the answer.
Former user wrote on 8/17/2009, 7:21 AM
IF you want to spend some money, TMPGEnc MPEG Editor is great for ripping DVDs and creating an MPEG file.

Dave T2
UlfLaursen wrote on 8/17/2009, 7:22 AM
I have had the same some times with apparnetly the same methoed of making the DVD's - some just messed up.

If you have a Set Top DVD-recorder, you could record a new DVD and then capture it. I have done a lot of recording from VHS to DVD this way and capturen in V7 with the build in import util and then edited.

/Ulf
johnmeyer wrote on 8/17/2009, 10:36 AM
I wasn't going to post much anymore, but I really want to help Bob. More important, it looks like Sony may finally have taken some steps to limit the posting by some of the fanboys and trolls that have made it tough to post without getting into nasty exchanges. So, let me see if I can propose a way to get around the problems that Bob and others are having without having my head taken off.

I have several methods for editing VOB files. I've posted the simple method before here in this forum:

How to edit VOB files in Vegas using DVD Shrink

This uses DVD Shrink, rather than VOB Merge, to create a single VOB file while also copying the files from the DVD to the hard drive.

However, this doesn't always work, and you sometimes get a truncated VOB or truncated audio.

There is another technique, however, that works perfectly every time, but it takes a little more up-front work (about five minutes). One side benefit of this is that the VOBs will edit on the timeline like they were DV AVI files (i.e., really, really fast).

To use this trick, you'll need DGIndex:

http://neuron2.net/dgmpgdec/dgmpgdec155.zip

and VFAPIConv:

http://www.afterdawn.com/software/video_software/codecs_and_filters/vfapi_codec.cfm

Copy your DVD to your hard drive. You don't need to combine any of the VOB files.

Run DGIndex and click on File -> Open. Select ALL of your VOB files. You'll get an intermediate dialog that lets you add more VOB files. If you've added them all, simply click on OK.

Click on the Audio menu and select an output method. I used to simply demux the AC3 track and use that, but I kept having problems with that approach, so I now select the "decode AC3 track to WAV." I then go to the next option in the audio menu and select the track I want to decode (if the DVD has more than one track). If you must use a 5.1 AC3 mix, then you will want to demux and then use that file, using the trick I posted about remixing the AC3 using DVD Architect.

If decoding to WAV, I then go to the Dolby Digital Decode menu and select Prescale Decision [F9]. This is an optional step and takes about five minutes for a full DVD, but it gives the program the min, max, and average audio levels, and lets it scale the audio correction. For the remaining menus, I turn off the 48 -> 44.1 kHz transform, and I set the normalization to 90 but DO NOT check the "enable normalization" box. It turns out that this normalization value IS used when you select the prescale decision, and this value seems to produce good results.

Under the Video menu, make sure that "Honor Flags" is selected for "Field Operation." Leave everything else alone. If you are editing 23.976 footage, then change this to "Force Film."

You are now ready to create a signpost file and decode the audio file. Go to the file menu and select Save Project [F4]. This will create a small project file that has information about each GOP, in text form, and will also create a 48 kHz WAV file. This process will take about the same amount of time as the Prescale Decision, or about five minutes for a two hour DVD. Ignore any flag violations you may get from DGIndex.

When you are finished, fire up VFAPIConv and select the little signpost file you just created. If you get an error message when you load the file, try to load it again. This is one of the few cases where doing the same thing several times actually will produce different results. VFAPIConv is a very, very old hack, and it is a little flaky around the edges, but in the end it works every time. Once you've loaded the file, select a location for the output file. This output file will be a signpost AVI file. Then, click on the "Convert" button, It will take under two seconds to create the signpost file (perhaps ten seconds for a really long DVD). If it doesn’t convert, try again (see above comment).

All you do now is put the AVI file on the video timeline and the WAV file on the audio timeline. Make sure to check the field order, interlace options, and PAR for the AVI file once you've imported it into Vegas. The PAR often gets reported incorrectly, and you must adjust this. You can either edit the signpost file created by DGINdex (it is just a text file you can edit in Notepad) and change the header there to change the PAR. If you do this, you'll have to re-do the VFAPIConv step. An easier alternative is to just change it within Vegas (right-click on the media in the media pool and change the PAR from 1.000 to the correct PAR).

Set your Vegas project properties and then edit.

You will be AMAZED at how responsive Vegas can edit MPEG-2 formatted material using this technique. Try doing a fast forward scan at 20x using Best resolution in the preview window and compare what you get with the same material in native VOB format. This shows how much better the MPEG-2 code within Vegas could be.

So, for the investment of about 5-10 minutes, you will solve all the problems you are having, and will end up with something that is really fun to edit.

Good luck!
NoBull408 wrote on 8/17/2009, 11:16 AM
John,

THANKS!
This will help with the problem I just posted about. I couldn't get Youtube to recognize the DVD, so I'll just do what you recommend and go from there.
farss wrote on 8/17/2009, 2:04 PM
Thanks John,
I'll give this a try, nice to still have you around.

Bob.
musicvid10 wrote on 8/17/2009, 4:21 PM
Bob,
Another possible solution is to download the generous (45 day) trial version of VideoRedo.
Copy your VOBs to your hard drive, run them through its QuickStream Fix and join them. It's proved to be a swiss army knife for me with all types of mpeg-2 source problems.
NoBull408 wrote on 8/17/2009, 4:37 PM
I downloaded VFAPI from afterdawn and for some reason it's all in Japanese. Does anybody know how to turn it into English?
NoBull408 wrote on 8/17/2009, 5:15 PM
MusicVid,

I used Quickstream Fix and the file came out great. I put it on the Vegas timeline and still no sound. Any ideas what's wrong? I played the video mutiple times and there sound is perfect.

I don't have the plug-in for Mainconcept MPeg 1 & 2 standard. Could that be the problem?
farss wrote on 8/17/2009, 5:56 PM
Unfortunately not having much joy with Johns method and no, I too noted VFAPI is all in Japanese.

Going back to DGIndex, all goes well as far as the Save Project.
This creates a d2v file which appears to be the signpost text file that John mentions however nowhere can I find the audio file that it should be creating <sigh>

One thing I did realise from running DGIndex, the timestamps in the ac3 blocks only count up from 0 to 29.

By trial and error I did manage to get VFAPIConv to create an AVI file from the signpost file however no audio in the file and still not sign of the wav file.

Looking at the d2v signpost file it only lists one stream, the video stream. HELP!

I'll try to persue this further however it is using up a lot of time that I don't have, so far capturing from the one STB player that'll play it working for me so far.

Bob.

<edit> I should mention that this DVD was created with a STB DVD recorder. These devices are an abomination.

fldave wrote on 8/17/2009, 6:16 PM
Try copying the DVD to a hard disk folder, then try the import camcorder disk in V8 from the HD folder.

Be sure to wait a LONG time to copy the disc. The Vegas disc extract use to take a very very long time

Sounds like it may be a disc corruption error. Clean the disc before you copy it to HD.

Or ask for a new, clean disc.

Are you sure it isn't CSS protected?
johnmeyer wrote on 8/17/2009, 8:43 PM
OK. Two things.

First, here's a link to an English translation of VFAPIConv (good for seven days):

VFAPIConv (English)

Second, I'll try to do a rough tutorial and post it to YouTube. I don't plan to spend more than five minutes on this, so it will be just a video of the computer screen.

johnmeyer wrote on 8/17/2009, 10:01 PM
OK, here's the really crude (I ain't proud of this ...) tutorial on how to do what I described above. Hopefully, between my description, the links, the link to the English version of VFAPIConv, and this tutorial, you'll see how it's done. If nothing else, note the playback speed I show at the end of the tutorial. It is an amazing treat to be able to take MPEG-2 or VOB material and play it back at full speed, backwards and forwards, with no hesitations, on pretty much any PC you've got and any version of Vegas.

The only caveat in all of this is that I did this on Windows XP Pro (SP2). I suspect that this might be difficult on Vista or W7.

Here's the video:

farss wrote on 8/17/2009, 10:41 PM
John,
a million thanks for all the time you've put into this.

I suspect the version of DGIndex you've linked to might be different than the one you've used in the video. When I try to select the audio tracks I simply get a dialogue box that asks me to "List desired audio id's separated by commas". Or maybe even DGIndex is having issues with this particular DVD, at least one of my STB players refuses to play it.

For what it's worth the version I've downloaded from your link is 1.5.5.

I'm running under WinXP Pro SP3

Bob.
johnmeyer wrote on 8/17/2009, 10:48 PM
I don't think the version difference is the cause of your problems, but just to check, here's the link to the site that has all versions:

Neuron2.net

I am using version 1.4.9.

Also, make sure only one audio track is selected before proceeding. A quick search of the Internet shows that a few people got the message your report above when they selected more than one audio track. I went through that pretty quickly on the tutorial, but go back to Audio -> Select Tracks and make very sure that only ONE audio track is selected. If more than one are selected, you will get the error message.

Grazie wrote on 8/17/2009, 11:31 PM
John! Wow . . even I followed that. Thanks for your clear work on this. I'm always astounded when I see a true pc professional wend his/her confident way through the maze of file manipulation you just demonstrated.

And good to see you back here, while you assisted Bob out.

Best regards

Grazie

farss wrote on 8/18/2009, 1:54 AM
Working fine now with 1.4.9. I now get the option to select the audio track and it is now creating the .wav audio files, phew.

So a big thank you to JM, I could have solved this another way, I probably could have bugged the client for the master tape that he must surely still have but time is tight. I could have simply captured from a DVD player. I wanted to get this method working because I feel certain more of us are going to face this same challenge and might not have anything to fall back on.

Bob.
Warren Hedges wrote on 8/18/2009, 3:47 AM
Bob even though you have a working solution to this problem, an alternative is to use a program called [b]mpeg streamclip[ available from www.squared5.com

Simply open all the vob files and then go to -->edit --> fix timecode breaks
Then --> file --> convert to mpeg (or what ever format you need)

I've had a lot of success using this program where others have failed.

Hope this helps

Warren
Richard Jones wrote on 8/18/2009, 4:06 AM
John,

Thank you so much for your clear, informative and articulate instruction film. It was extremely helpful and I am certain that many people wil be grateful to you.

It really is good to see you back on the forum. Your wealth of knowledge and willingness to share it has been sorely missed. I can understand your reasons for not participating but don't let those twerps get you down - they're not really worth bothering about but you are most certainly worth listening to and reading at any time and on any subject (so feel free to call me an admiring and appreciative "fan" if you wish).

Every Best Wish,

Richard
craftech wrote on 8/18/2009, 6:03 AM
John,

The amount of time you have put into helping others on this forum over the years is absolutely amazing. I have many mini tutorials printed from this forum, most of them yours. I cannot tell you enough how valuable you are to this forum. I have added this one to my archive.

Thank you.

John
UlfLaursen wrote on 8/18/2009, 6:34 AM
The amount of time you have put into helping others on this forum over the years is absolutely amazing.

Absolutly - sure thing. Thanks a lot :-)

/Ulf
Sebaz wrote on 8/18/2009, 6:40 AM
VideoRedo is the way to go. When you export, set it to export the audio as PCM.
johnmeyer wrote on 8/18/2009, 7:09 AM
Thank you all for your kind words. I'm glad I could help Bob, and perhaps others.