I'm not sure - warning, negative post.

paul_w wrote on 11/11/2011, 6:53 AM

So having gone through every update and upgrade since v9, I find myself wondering if this is a great way to spend time rather than editing! I think what i am trying to say is, I feel all these upgrades and updates send out the wrong signal to potential clients. And with so many issues with v11 being reported on here you have to ask the question, is this really ok?. Some have suggested we are paying beta testers and i have to agree to a certain extent with that. Dont get me wrong, bug fixes ARE welcome, but why so many bugs in the first place, where are the testers?. Oh thats right, i think its us.
Ok, moving along, last night i needed to do a quick multicam project. About 5 minutes worth. 3 cameras all 7d and 5d. Now i have had issues before and it turned out to be faulty quicktime code. I fixed that before using the QT alternative. So thats a working fix in 9 and 10. However, with 11 b425, i was editing and got half way through and got a full on Vegas crash. Lost the project. Had to start again from my last save point. I did get there in the end but felt annoyed and saddened. Luckily these are not paying clients so time was no real issue.
I'm not sure... We don't even know where to set our RAM preview setting to, it changes for everyones system and project. QT is variable too, why do we need to use an alternative plugin and not use the latest updates. And then comes the fact that plugin manufacturers dont really take Sony Vegas seriously with one or two exceptions. Red Giant only just got in on the act recently but only offer ONE plugin, Looks for vegas. A bit sad. And after initially stating we Vegas users are not important enough...
All in all, I am a great Sony Vegas fan and always have been. The timeline is one of the simplest and effective i have ever seen. But,.. I feel the gravity from other NLEs pulling me away (yet again). After all, if a client asks what NLE i will be using for their project, they expect some response like FinalCut. But what do they know. You say Vegas and they go, what is that?
I once submitted a music video to the LAVA music Sky channel in the uk. They needed a Mac Mov. There were so many issues trying to get the rendered footage to work on their system. It did work in the end, they asked me "what NLE did you use", Sony Vegas i replied, "whats that?" they said. Final answer from them was great video, but please use a Mac. :(
Forgive me, maybe its just a bad day.

Paul.

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Comments

Richard Jones wrote on 11/14/2011, 8:15 AM

"Act in haste, repent in leisure."

Richard

paul_w wrote on 11/14/2011, 8:25 AM

Whats that supposed to mean

paul.

MUTTLEY wrote on 11/14/2011, 12:10 PM

Paul, just to be clear my comments weren't directed at you, hope you caught that. I don't necessarily agree with all of your points but I understand the frustration about things going fubar mid-project. I never have a problem with people who experience problems and post about them (not pretending that my opinion matters), only those who seem to thrive on jumping on such threads with nothing constructive to add.

Bringing issues to light on the forums not only may help bring something to the attention of Sony who might just find a resolve in a future release if it is a Vegas issue but it helps me tremendously in being educated about the problems I may run into or perchance can avoid now aware.

- Ray
Underground Planet

paul_w wrote on 11/21/2011, 3:45 PM

After a long break and some calm reflection, I just checked the thread.
Ray, no problem. No harm done.

Now my latest problem with v11 - crash on exit. I'd say it happens about 50% of the time. I have sent in a "phone home" crash report to scs.
So currently, my main two gripes are:
Multicam crashing during playback on timeline.
Crash on exit.
both reported.

Just finished a 100 photograph slide show thingy with CC and fades etc. I could not use v11, kept crashing. Ended up using v10 to finish the project and it worked fine. Think i have to stick with v10e until v11 is sorted. Most annoying because the rendering times and preview speed is way better in v11 and GPU on. But of no use if its unstable. Release date for v11.'a' anyone? fingers crossed.

Paul.

Red Prince wrote on 11/21/2011, 6:07 PM

Some have suggested we are paying beta testers

No! We are paid beta testers, as we get a big discount if we upgrade early. And then we get the fixes for free. That is how I look at it: I get it cheaper, I get to play with it early, I get to report the bugs in return. In the meantime, continue using v.10 for any business projects until v.11 is stable.

I think we get the best of both worlds!

GenJerDan wrote on 11/21/2011, 9:06 PM

There is no way SCS can make a Vegas that will fit everyone's machine and still have the features and performance people want. There are just too many variables. If you asked everyone here, it is highly doubtful that any two would have exactly the same setup. How could SCS' internal testers duplicate that? How could the outside beta testers do any more than tell how it works on *their* machine(s).

Software for the Mac is much easier. By and large, a Mac is a Mac is a Mac, so a software company can optimize for what 99% of the users have sitting on their desk.

[r]Evolution wrote on 11/22/2011, 4:21 AM

Software for the Mac is much easier. By and large, a Mac is a Mac is a Mac, so a software company can optimize for what 99% of the users have sitting on their desk.

So true. In Mac Land it's "What model do you have?" as apposed to "What are your system specs?" NOTE: There are only a few Mac Models & an uncountable number of varying PC System Specs. It's for this reason that Avid software used to only support a few PC Models (Compaq/HP Workstations).

Although I had seen/barely used Adobe Premiere 4.0 PC, Sonic Foundry Vegas Pro was my first owned 'Pro' NLE. Funny that it originally had the PRO moniker. I did a brief stint with a company on Mac/Media 100 before completely jumping ship to Mac years later after leaving a PC/Avid facility and all the jobs seemed to want FCP editors. I kept my HP XW5000 (never could afford an XW8600) just so I could run Vegas to get me out of binds with Avid/FCP. I began using WindlowBlinds just so I could change the UI of Vegas as I've never liked the Blocky/Squared Windows '98 look of it.

When Mac went Intel and you could install Windows I swapped my old Mac for an Intel Mac, installed Windows, installed Vegas. I've always ran the 32bit version as it just seemed more stable for me, plus the plug-ins were readily available or already owned. I've never built a PC and have always gone with pre-built/name brand systems. Their cost may be a bit more but it was worth it NOT to have the headaches of troubleshooting various problems & errors. I'm NOT a 'tinkerer' so I don't go 'under the hood' to 'optimize' or change settings just to see what it does.

On my Mac I currently run:
OS X - Avid Media Composer, Final Cut Suite, Adobe Master Collection, + many other Creative apps & plug-ins
W7 - Vegas Pro

I'm not sure what the computer future holds for me though as Mac begins to abandon the Pro Market. Maybe in a few years I'll be back on a PC?

I've never understood why people get mad that an NLE chokes up on multiple layers and effects of High CPU/GPU intensive footage. Especially when they're using some crazy configuration with goofy settings that they conveniently forget they changed, or have installed some dumb@$$ CoDec pack, conflicting software/hardware, or just simple User Error. Figure out YOUR workflow based on YOUR needs then Just Do It. If you need to edit an intermediate... Just Do It. If you need to swap computers/hardware... Just Do It. If you need to move to another NLE... Just Do It. All in All... you've got to find/use what works for you at your price point and knowledge level then...

But don't expect your Pentium II, or wacky configuration, to cut multiple layers of AVCHD with every effect applied.

In short:
I've used Vegas since it's inception and I simply can't recall ever having any of the major troubles that I've seen mentioned in the forums.
- My only problem is NewBlue Titler Pro won't run... but I think a swap out of my video card would solve that.

I've got more to say on this topic but feel a lot gets lost in translation of me writing and you all reading so I digress.

paul_w wrote on 11/22/2011, 4:21 AM

Hi Red, of course, i do accept that not ALL bugs can be caught in the beginning. It would be crazy to think they could. But i never said that. I was saying however that bugs that are across the board could have been identified and fixed before release. Things like eg. v10 projects not loading correctly into v11 which has caused many many threads of complaints. This is nothing to do with hardware.
Im a software writer too. I have wrote applications for download and with success. I was the beta tester for my own products. Ok no where as complex as vegas, but still, taking time to test and re-test paid off. Very few initial bugs on release. No complaints!! That allowed me to sleep better at night. But, you do expect at least one problem at release, but my initial point was, is 30 ok? And still counting apparently reading around here.
If it was me, i would be paying a team of editors and run real world tests for at least 1 month before release. using different hardware variations and workflows. That would be considered normal practice - if it were me... If that had been done, you can absolutely say the 10 to 11 bug would have been found, amongst others.
Anyway, this sounds like Vegas bashing, and actually thats not what i was trying to do at all. I still have it, i still use it, but its 10 not 11 at this time.

Paul.

Red Prince wrote on 11/22/2011, 9:24 AM

V10 projects not loading in v11? I have never experienced such a problem. If you did, that does not mean SCS did not beta test, only that none of the testers experienced such a problem.

Steve Mann wrote on 11/22/2011, 10:03 AM

"Things like eg. v10 projects not loading correctly into v11 which has caused many many threads of complaints."

I think I've seen three. Does that make it "many, many, many" threads of complaints? Does the same one or two people complaining on all three threads count as a multiplier? Do unrelated vents on the initial thread add another "many"? Does cross-posting on other forums make the rant any more "widespread"

Yes there are a lot of complaints - by a handful of users and a few "me too" followers. We see these on the forums with EVERY new release of Vegas. The only difference here is that by adding CUDA support, older hardware and drivers are more likely to be a problem.

This is exactly what I predicted on this forum a couple of years ago as users kept asking for GPU support.

paul_w wrote on 11/22/2011, 10:39 AM

"I think I've seen three"

I think i've seen many many more.. lol

Paul.

Rv6tc wrote on 11/22/2011, 11:03 AM

Quote SteveMann: "The only difference here is that by adding CUDA support, older hardware and drivers are more likely to be a problem."

What about the new hardware and new drivers? i.e. EVGA GeForce GTX 560/latest NVIDIA drivers? How about a Asus P8Z68PRO/i-7 2600K?

Steve Mann wrote on 11/22/2011, 12:17 PM

"

Count them.

paul_w wrote on 11/22/2011, 12:50 PM

No! I refuse! hehe.

But seriously Steve, i am including posts within threads that talk about this, and there are many many (sorry, ok, just many).. And its not all from the same small number of people. And this thread is not just about 'that' bug.. Now lets be friends and buy each other a beer. :)

Paul.

Steve Mann wrote on 11/22/2011, 12:59 PM

"What about the new hardware and new drivers? i.e. EVGA GeForce GTX 560/latest NVIDIA drivers? How about a Asus P8Z68PRO/i-7 2600K?"

First, I avoid ATI/Radeon whenever possible because historically I have had nothing but problems with ATI drivers.

On nVidia/GeForce: If you use the nVidia "auto scan", it will likely report that you have the latest version.

http://uk.geforce.com/drivers

You probably don't. Well, you do have the latest released version, but the 285.79-Beta driver seems to fix a lot of problems in Vegas installations.

http://www.nvidia.co.uk/object/win7-winvista-64bit-285.79-beta-driver-uk.html

Download it, install it and run Vegas. check for your "Vegas Bug" and let us know your results. You can always roll-back the latest released driver.