Yes, playback performance can be an issue when you have plug-ins loaded. I can suggest the following tips for improving playback performance:

• Reduce the preview resolution to Half or Quarter
• Create proxies for your videos, and then set the preview quality to Draft or Preview
• Do your color correction last, after you finish editing
• Disable or bypass FX when you don't need them

Sure, I know all those tricks but I am not sure this time if it will be enough. With the proxy workflow maybe.

Is it possible to use other LUT plugins? looks3/4 for example, or Hitfilm, which are better in the playback performance?

There is also the alternative to use those plugins in the 8bit mode only; edit the footage, use LUTs correct luminance and chrominance; and switch Before the render process to 32bit floating point only. I wonder if we would loose here anything compared to your workflow?

But as said, thank you very much to share that again with the community for free. Highly appreciated! It is good to have the choice!

Logarist for Vegas Pro was developed specifically for the VisionColor LUT Plugin. I would need to test the other plug-ins to see how they behave. LUT plug-ins all have different capabilities and few of them fully support the CUBE format.

Logarist requires 32-bit floating point (full range) mode. If you switch to 8-bit mode, the colors and levels won't be right. It's fine to edit and preview in 8-bit mode, but you need to switch to 32-bit mode for color correction and rendering.

I will test Logarist with my 8core system when I am back home. Your systems have been great in the past. Keen to see how it works!

Just downloaded the Logarist and I have to say, so far, the color correction and reproduction are simply spectacular. I just had a couple of questions if you'd be so kind to answer.

First, when you are rendering out of Vegas, under the Customize Template > Project Tab >

What are the differences between the options Rec 709 Full Range, Video File, and Still Image File? I was thinking maybe Video File is Broadcast safe, 16-235? But I think I might be confusing these settings from before with Logarist? Is the output LUT enough and I just leave Project Template on default?

If you shot in 8 bit Codec, do you really have to set your Pixel Format to 32-bit floating? How does 8-bit translate to 32-bit? I was always under the impression that you'd only use 32-bit floating if you were working with a source codec of 10-bits or higher?

And last, I am shooting with FS7 now and was curious what your recommended camera settings are for that? On your website, you mention HyperGamma 4, which on the FS7 is HG446009G33. Do you still recommend that? And for Matrix Pre-Sets, the choices are Standard, High Saturation, FL Light, Cinema, and F55 709 Like? This would be in Custom Mode.

In Cine EI mode, you mention the Logarist supports S-Log3 with S-Gamut3.Cine color space but you don't really make any recommendations against it, just to be wary, but I'm naturally wary any way. Do you have any recommendations for or against S-Log 2 or 3 versus HG 4 or even HG 8? Just curious.

Really appreciate your work on this. It is really great and definitely takes a lot of the guess work out of color correction and I don't want to say that it is almost fool proof, but it almost seems to be.

Hi, karma17. Thanks for your feedback.

Regardless of the input and output formats, you want to work in 32-bit floating point. Working in high precision ensures that the color correction process won't introduce any color precision errors (banding). If you worked in 8 bits, each new filter you add could introduce banding.

The render template color space setting has no effect when you're working with Logarist. That setting is for Vegas's OpenColorIO ACES config, which is only enabled when you set the project View transform to something other than 'Off'.

On the FS7, HyperGamma 4 or 2 are fine choices, equally good. I'd pair either of those with Standard matrix. Try all of the matrices and pick your favorite. Each one renders colors a little differently.

If you are recording in a 10-bit format like XAVC-I, then you could use Custom mode with S-Log3 and Standard, or Cine EI mode with S-Gamut3.Cine/S-Log3 or S-Gamut3/S-Log3. S-Gamut3.Cine and S-Gamut3 are wider gamuts than Standard matrix. That won't help you much when delivering in BT.709, but it could help you down the road for HDR.

In theory, all of the different modes should look about the same when used with the corresponding Logarist input transform. But do some tests to confirm. Every camera has its quirks, and even Sony screws up sometimes.

If you are recording in an 8-bit mode, e.g. XAVC-L UHD, then stick to the HyperGammas. S-Log3 has bad banding when recorded in 8 bits.

Awesome! I really appreciate the work you are doing. I see that Da Vinci Resolve is moving toward trying to be a full fledged NLE with no need for round trips, but I'd love to see Vegas now beef up its color correction tools. I've invested a lot of time in learning Vegas and really love the interface. Programs like yours really help me stay in Vegas versus needing to go outside. What happens in Vegas should stay in Vegas! LOL.

I believe I followed the installation instructions properly "C:\Logarist for Vegas Pro", but don't see the VisionColorLUT in the 32 bit floating point events folder or any folder for that matter. Could it be the installation directions for VP13 which I have is different than for VP14?

Apologies in advance if I did something stupid. Installation instructions were pretty clear.

Rich

Rich, make sure you are following the instructions at logarist.com. The VisionColor LUT Plugin needs to be downloaded and installed. It's the same for Vegas Pro 13 and 14.

I found my installation problem, I didn't realize I had to install two software packages (Logarist and VisionColor LUT Plug), Logarist is now working, thanks.

I have a question, assume I have 3 cameras, but only one camera supports a LUT. Logarist will only be used on the LUT camera, but how does the Pixel Format Project Properties of 32 bit floating point and Compositing Gamma of 2.222 affect the project as a whole.

In other words, changing Project Properties is good for the LUT camera, but is there a disadvantage or side effect that changing these Project Properties have on the non-LUT camera clips or still images?

Thanks,

Rich in San Diego

Hi, Rich. Even without Logarist, 32-bit floating point (full range) is the best pixel format to use in Vegas. With this pixel format, levels are mapped correctly for all of Vegas's inputs and outputs without the need to add any levels filters or change any other project settings. That includes video clips on the timeline, still images on the timeline, the preview window, full-screen preview, saving snapshots to files, scopes, and rendered output. None of Vegas's other pixel formats do that. When not using Logarist, the one exception is reading full_range video files like from an iPhone or Canon DSLR: those need a "Computer RGB to Studio RGB" levels filter to be applied. (They would need that regardless of the pixel format.) Using Logarist, you never need to use a levels filter: the LUTs compensate automatically.

Setting the compositing gamma to Video just means Vegas directly composites the working RGB color values. It's the default setting, and probably how you are used to working. When you set the compositing gamma to any other value, Vegas applies gamma curve before compositing and filtering operations, and then the inverse curve after.

What spec of machine are you using for your editing workstation? Two visioncolor LUT effects in 32 bit brings my system to its knees.

The VisionColor LUT Plugin is too slow for real-time playback at full resolution, if that's what you're thinking. I always reduce the preview resolution to half or quarter. UHD 25 fps, for example at quarter resolution of 960 x 540, I get 20 fps playback with two VisionColor LUT effects, Brightness & Contrast, and Channel Blend. That's on an i7-3840QM at 2.8 GHz. When I need real-time playback, I bypass FX.

Just wanted to tell everyone that I was given a chance to test Logarist workflow for delivering HDR10 (Rec. 2020) in Resolve. I must say I never used LUTs as I found RCM /ACES better - but with Jacob's LUTs it might change! I am sure the Vegas version will be available soon - and with better GPU acceleration in Release 15, grading experience will be as great as it is with Resolve.

Piotr

megabit,

Perhaps I misunderstood your comment, but Logarist already works with Vegas. Am I missing something?

What is RCM /ACES?

thanks,

Piotr was referring to HDR delivery. I've done some tests for Resolve.

ACES is a color space and format standard for motion picture production. RCM is Resolve Color Management.

I did some tests, and I do not see any meaning in it.

Hi, AlesCZ. Which camera and color space did you try?

Piotr was referring to HDR delivery. I've done some tests for Resolve.

ACES is a color space and format standard for motion picture production. RCM is Resolve Color Management.

Yep. One more important thing that current VP release lacks is ability to set HDR flag - let's hope this will come with VP 15 along T/L speed increase as the two most anticipated features (at least by myself)...

Piotr

I'm sorry I'm using the cheap D5100 camera. This camera probably does not have a good codec for these purposes. If I set my project to 32bit full range, sometimes clipping occurs. I still have one old Panasonic NV-GS320 camera (3CCD, standard DV resolution). When switching to 32-bit full range, the record from this old camera does not change anything.

AlesCZ, Logarist works best when your camera records to one of its supported color spaces. Since your cameras don't support any of those color spaces, you can use the BT.709 to Logarist input transform, which approximates the color space of a typical HD camera. Logarist won't be able to undo the unique effects of your camera's color processing, but it will enable basic color correction in a way that you might find useful.

With any camera, you can extend the highlight range and reduce clipping by reducing the exposure in the camera. Then you can compensate in Logarist. You can use a HighComp or LumaComp output transform to extend the effective highlight range of the output without clipping.

balazer,

Would you care to share how you develop a LUT for a "new" camera. Is it a matter of reverse engineering or guessing? How scientific is it? Do you contact the camera manufacturer for technical LUT specifications? Do you have to purchase the camera to create the LUT?

For example, if I wanted a LUT to my DJI Phantom 4 Pro drone camera that uses D-Log, what would you do? It is a matter of a few hours of work or is it a complex task that takes weeks.

As an engineer, I'm interested to understanding what goes into making a LUT. I'm not looking for details, just an overview of the LUT creation process. Feel free to ignore this question if you feel I'm asking for sensitive information.

Rich