Media Bin Question

dust wrote on 4/26/2004, 4:13 AM

Hmm thanks for the tip, that actually works and seems to be better than renaming clips!

About thumbnails... what you can do is activate Auto-Preview that shows you the selected clip automatically in the preview window. Then just mark one of the comment fields, move up and down using the arrow keys, watch the preview window, and make your comments with "sort prefixes". It can all be done without using the mouse. Unfortunately you must re-click the comment-title-bar to refresh the new sorting.

Note that I adapted the sortEvents and proxyEvents scripts for Vegas 5 (the page contains links for both version 4 and version 5). As they include .dll that differ between the 2 versions (namespace), I had to keep 2 versions.

proxyEvents I think can help sorting in timelines (eventually in a new Vegas instantaion): you can mark arbitrary events in a timeline and "collapse" them, meaning they are all together moved into a new track and replaced by a placeholder event (event and new track are internally linked using event-named and track-names), the placeholder being of a predefined length, which makes selecting and dragging them around easier (they can substitute very short or very long sequences). The placeholder event can then be treated like a separate unit and at any later moment expanded again. It is a bit like collapsing/expanding subdirectories in a file browser.

sortEvents just "fills" specific events (event on active track under-or-left-of-cursor) subsequently into specially named tracks that can be used like stacks or queues. Useful to cut long events into clips and directly sort them into named "stacks".

PeterWright wrote on 4/26/2004, 4:15 AM

>"Peter, I do not know your workflow"

As it happens, the only time I ever use the Media Pool at all is to find generated media I have already created, if it's not nearby on the timeline for a Ctrl/Drag copy.

For long projects, I use 63 minute clips, with named and sorted Regions from the Trimmer, listed and sortable in Explorer. Each Region name contains an alpha/numeric reference followed by brief description.

I can find any clip I want in seconds. What more could an editor want?

Wolfgang S. wrote on 4/27/2004, 12:09 AM

>Descriptions make sense - the more the bigger a project is. Imagine you >have lots of shots which look very similar or of which sound is more >important than video. In these cases thumbnails would not help.

Well, I did not say that comments and descriptions do not make a sense at all - but what I said is that I do not want to be foreced to add comments for some 100 clips - simply to sort them.

Thumbnails would help off course - if you organize the material after the szene separtion by capturing in the bin structure in a first step in a rough way (for example according to major part of the movie); and then rearange the clips in a second step *within* such a bin structure, simply by sorting the thumbnails by using the mouse.

Frankly spoken, with such an approach I never had to use comments up to now.

@ Peter
means, that you do not activate the automatic szene detection during capturing - but oganize the material in regions. I am sure that is another good workflow - I perfer to apply the automatic szene detection and organize the material in bins, and do not use the Trimmer at all. Hmm, are really very different ways to approach the material organisation.

PeterWright wrote on 4/27/2004, 3:57 AM

>" Hmm, are really very different ways to approach the material organisation."

Exactly, and it pays to be aware of every possibility, so you can apply the best method at the appropriate time. That's why I suggested ways of using the Media Pool, even though I don't usually use it myself.

>"I do not want to be forced to add comments for some 100 clips - simply to sort them."

To sort 100 clips, you need to know what's in 'em. Thumbnails don't always do this - a quick preview followed by a Comment or Rename can make it much easier to sort clips.

Costis wrote on 4/27/2004, 7:54 AM

Wschmid,

Your workaround for rearranging clips in explorer, is not bad at all, the problem is that the new order is maintained for the first 2 clips on timeline, the rest is sorted automatically. You have to move the clips 2 by 2 only. Did you notice that? Have a test with 10 clips to see.

Were in Germany?

Wolfgang S. wrote on 4/27/2004, 12:08 PM

Monika,

I am located in Austria/Vienna - but I am part of the team that runs the German spoken Vegas forum www.vegasvideo.de/forum, that is hosted in Germany.

Funny, I have tested it now with 15 clips. I have sorted them in the explorer, in a random sequence. Then I have marked all - and have drawn them with the mouse to the timeline. And no, for me it is not re-sorted automatically at all, even not for 15 clips and even not if I move them all together.

Could it be a question of calculation power maybe - I use only my old 1.8 GHz P4?

And we should be aware that there are limitations, off course - it is still only a workaround. That is why we need a true storyboard, true?
:-))

Wolfgang S. wrote on 4/27/2004, 12:21 PM

>To sort 100 clips, you need to know what's in 'em. Thumbnails don't always
>do this - a quick preview followed by a Comment or Rename can make it
>much easier to sort clips.

True - but that is much simpler if you use the automatic scene detection. At least for most of my videos, the clips are not so long - means that the content will be linked very well to the tumbnails. Could be very different if one has a clip of 30 minutes - then the thumbnail is meaningless maybe.

The workaround works only if you do not use the media bins, by the way; but if you sort the clips in the explorer - and copy the thumbnails to the timeline directly (you also cannot copy it to the media bin from the XP explorer).
Then I sort my small clips to the media bins - and then I wish to sort the selection within every bin.

PeterWright wrote on 4/27/2004, 6:15 PM

I still think you're overlooking one of the shortcomings of thumbnails. Whether the clip is 30 mins or 30 seconds, you can have lots of thumbnails which look very similar, so the only way of telling which is which is either by Name or Comment.

The sorting by name or comment can now be done either as Trimmer Regions in Explorer, or as Sub-clips in the Media Pool.detailed view. Either way you can take the clips/regions in their newly sorted order straight to the timeline.

Wolfgang S. wrote on 4/27/2004, 11:16 PM

That is also a more theoretical issue - given the fact, that the picture on the thumbnails look different, but also the fact that you have the information about the original sequenze in the name "clip0001.avi, clip0002.avi" the system is manageable typically (at least with my type of movies).

StormMarc wrote on 4/28/2004, 3:51 AM

I was pretty disapointed that this basic NLE feature was missing as well and was really expecting more media managment updates (although subclips is nice, thank you Sony). Also, I am finding that the clips appear to take up more space vertically room now in the media pool, has anyone noticed this?

Hopefully they'll give us this shortly in an update because a year is a long time to wait for a basic function that I have already been waiting a year for. I was also hoping for picture icon views in the explorer window among other basic media management features on par with other competing NLEs. Vegas is really close to being the ultimate NLE but leaving out some of the basics must be turning potential converts away.

Marc

Costis wrote on 4/28/2004, 11:09 PM

Stormac,

I second that, i couldn't say it better.I am just waiting, like you.

Wscmid,

Your workaround (the best of all proposed) is working in one of my 3 pcs! laptop and an older pc(with xp home) refuse to work with. Strange! Thank you anyway.

Wolfgang S. wrote on 4/29/2004, 4:35 AM

That is really strange - could it be a question of settings in the explorer?

Cheesehole wrote on 4/29/2004, 10:37 AM

Maybe try making sure you click / drag the first clip in the selection? I know with drag/drop operations, even if you have multiple items selected, Windows will "drop" the item that you clicked on to perform the drag operation first. That's all I can think of.. as long as you are all using the same version of Windows the behavior should be the same.