midi time code sync to external sequencer software

UmbilicalBungee wrote on 12/29/2007, 1:10 AM

Ok since Vegas doesn't support rewire, I've been trying to get it to sync to Cubase with midi time code. I've made some head way on it so I'll post what I've done in case it helps any one and then the part I haven't figured out at the end in case someone out there can help me.

Downloaded midi-yolk here: http://www.midiox.com/myoke.htm

In Vegas:
Options>Preferences>MIDI tab
check "Out To MIDI Yolk : 1" and "In From MIDI Yolk: 2"
Under Sync tab for Generate MIDI Timecode settings
set Output device to "Out To MIDI Yolk: 1"
Under Trigger from... set to "In From MIDI Yolk: 2"
Click Advanced and MTC Output tab
check "For all cursor position changes"
then OK and OK again

now choose Options and make sure there is a check next to "External Control" (if not then click it)
Then choose Options>Timecode>Trigger From MIDI Timecode
Then choose Options>Timecode>Generate MIDI Timecode
You can right click the transport time in the top left corner of the vegas screen to choose to see the MIDI Time In or Out

In Cubase:
Choose Transport>Sync Setup
under Timecode Source check MIDI timecode
under MIDI Timecode Source select "In from MIDI Yolk: 1"
Under Application change Lock Frames to 0
change Drop out frames to 3 (I wish it would go to 0)
Change Inhibit Restart ms to 0
under MIDI Timecode Destinations check "Out to MIDI Yolk: 2"
Click Ok
then Transport>Sync Online

Now when I press play in Vegas cubase will sync. The other way around doesn't work so well. Vegas seems to need to be set to wait for sync from cubase with the Options>Timecode>Trigger From MIDI Timecode command.
Then when I press play in cubase Vegas does nothing for a second, then starts to sync and then looses sync and everything stops.

Anybody have any suggestions or questions?

Comments

Kennymusicman wrote on 12/29/2007, 4:35 AM

I have a question. Why?

why are you wanting the two to work together?

cchoy wrote on 12/29/2007, 2:59 PM

UB-

I've tried some similar things. One suggestion is that instead of CUBASE as your rewire driver that you try REAPER (www.reaper.fm). I've had a lot of luck with reaper because of it's lightness (small program file, little muss little fuss), and I've heard that they just added midi TC triggering.

KM-
Vegas has a much more intuitive editing environment than ACID. I've tried to switch on several occasions over to ACID for music, but I just like the VEGAS GUI so much better. UB is probably having the same issues as me: we love the VEGAS GUI but find that its audio feature set is missing just one or two things that would make life a lot easier. However, it's SO CLOSE that it drives us insane that it's not there yet.

Here's to hoping for more audio improvements for Vegas!

-C

UmbilicalBungee wrote on 12/30/2007, 12:36 AM

-C and KM

That's part of the reason that I want to sync Vegas and Cubase. I do like Vegas alot. If only it had midi capabilities. I haven't used Acid, but if I understand correctly it would have to sync to Vegas through MIDI timecode same as other apps. Also I haven't been impressed by the midi feature list for Acid, and I'm not really interested in working with loops. I want to WRITE music. The main reason I'm doing this is actually because I want to score and edit video at the same time. Everyone who I tell this to seems to think it is crazy, but I think it would be a great way to build a project. I'm surprised that no company is putting out a single peice of software that will allow this. If I found some DAW software that would allow video editing I would probably be using that. I've heard that Pro Tools HD might.

I have looked at Reaper. I like it, but last time I checked it would only do MIDI timecode sync one way. I forget if it was in or out. Those guys seem to update pretty often so they might have added the other by now. The other thing about reaper is it doesn't have a notation/score view. I suppose I could live without this, but its nice to have and I do actually use it in many projects.

Thanks for the suggestions.

ChristoC wrote on 12/30/2007, 1:53 PM

Do you have both Vegas and Cubase set to same framerate and samplerate?

UmbilicalBungee wrote on 1/11/2008, 2:49 PM

Good thinking ChritoC. I still haven't been able to get it to work by setting frame and sampling rates the same, but interestingly if frame rates are mismatched by drop and non drop then the Vegas timecode box turns red and says MTC Input Wrong Format. Also if I change the frame rate settings in Vegas under Options>Preferences>Sync then cubase will automatically detect the change and ask if you want to change settings.

UmbilicalBungee wrote on 2/19/2008, 7:39 AM

I small update here. I have now been able to get Vegas to slave to Cubase. The problem, I discovered is that Vegas doesn't like to be set to both slave to MTC and be set to send it as the master at the same time. I assume that this was creating some kind of loop and causing it to stop playing.

So the solution is to have to hit F7 to turn off master syncing and then Ctrl-F7 to turn on slave sycing in Vegas before you hit play on Cubase.

It would be a nice improvement if these settings could be changed automatically so that every time you hit play in Vegas it sends master MTC and when you stop it it is ready to sync to incoming time code as a slave. I'm pretty sure that Cubase does this.

I've had some timing issues with cubase, and had to do some frustrating off setting to make it work better, but still not perfectly. You can offset Vegas in the advanced menu under sync. There are also settings here that let you decrease the sync delay to a minimum when Vegas is syncing as a slave device.

I think I'll have to go with a different midi sequencer. I've already tried Temper, and the sync and midi timing is better than cubase, the only drawback is it will not slave sync only master, and of course there is no notation.

This ReWire thing is sounding better and better. Why is it that Vegas doesn't have this? Is it just Sony's proprietary business model?

Does anyone have suggestions for midi sequencers that do a good job with MTC syncing both In and Out?

reberclark wrote on 5/30/2008, 1:21 PM

Instead of MIDI yoke has anybody tried Virtual MIDI Router from Sony (free download from Vegas Support). I am thinking of using it to sync Vegas to SONAR or to sync SONAR to Vegas. Any ideas?

Stevebol wrote on 8/11/2008, 6:05 PM

I can't get VMR to show up as an option in either Vegas or FL Studio which I'm trying to sync to Vegas. When I check it's properties it says that it's not working properly.

ChristoC wrote on 8/11/2008, 8:28 PM

Even better would be if Vegas used APP (Asio Positioning Protocol) which is used by some sequencers etc (eg Cubase) - this provides sample accurate sync which is a vast improvement on sloppy MIDI timing.

Stevebol wrote on 8/13/2008, 1:49 PM

I can record audio into Vegas from midi synths in FL Studio as long as the 2 programs windows don't overlap. As far as syncing the way some midi/audio DAWs can, I'm not sure.