Mixing Media - need advice on mixing 60i with 60p

Kevin Mc wrote on 3/25/2014, 2:31 PM

I shoot with three cameras and need to mix them into the same timeline, but each shoots at a different frame rate or resolution:
* Panasonic AG-HMC70 @ 1440x1080i 14Mbps (renders sharp clean images at 1920x1080i)
* Canon Vixia HF-100 @ 1920x1080i 17Mbps
* Canon Vixia HF G30 @ 1920x1080 i or p 3Mbps(i) to 36Mbps(p)

The Pani and the HF-100 footage mix perfectly at 1920x1080 60i - no problems or adjustments needed there... example:

When doing a 3-camera shoot (weddings), I need to mix the footage for editing. I don't know if there is any advantage to setting the HF G30 to shoot at 60 frames progressive, when it needs to be undersampled during editing a multi-cam project.

1) Is there any advantage to shooting at 60p in this situation? i.e., could an argument be made for 60p?

2) Is there any way to retain the high quality of the 60p footage when mixing it with 60i footage? (no, I don't mind that the shots look a bit different. The 60p is used to shoot the bride before the ceremony - this allows me to slow it down without loss for glide-cam shots)

Thanks!
--Kevin

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Comments

Rainer wrote on 3/27/2014, 7:43 PM

"60p delivered at 30p looks as good as 30p delivered at 30p"
On the G30/XA20 footage captured at 17Mbps 30p is identical to 60p footage displayed at 30p.

If you're delivering interlaced, I don't know how Vegas converts the 60p to 60i - you may know or someone might chime in, easy enough to test if you want to go through the rigmarole - does it (a) drop a frame and display odd/even lines as fields from the remaining frame, in which case you get a better image recording 24Mbps 30p, or does it (b) drop even lines from one frame, odd lines from the next and combine the two (which would be equivalent to shooting 60i in the first place). If (b), I'd be shooting 60p on the G30 to deliver 60i (well, if I wasn't in PAL land).

OldSmoke wrote on 3/27/2014, 9:44 PM

Maybe your PAL camera is different. I see absolutely no difference between 60p at full bitrate and 30p at full bitrate; again, provided that you have sufficient lighting.

Vegas converts 60p to 60i by dropping the even and odd lines but not dropping frames. 30p only makes sense if you deliver for Internet and nothing else.

Kevin Mc wrote on 3/28/2014, 10:43 PM

musicvid10 said:
Nobody asked, so I guess I will . . .
What is the intended use for your video?
How will it be presented?

--------------

My initial question was a general question. I do a ton of shooting both pro and personal and I am working out the details of how-to and when-to use various frame rates, especially when mixing with other footage shot on different cameras with varying differences. Some projects will be rendered to DVD AND uploaded to YouTube. Others to Blu-Ray AND Vimeo. This depends on the client's intended use. So if I may flip the question, based on the various presentation methods available, what would you suggest for (keeping in mind the original premise of mixing different types of footage together):
DVD
Blu-Ray
YouTube
...etc.
?

OldSmoke wrote on 3/28/2014, 10:56 PM

Kevin

With respect to your original question: 60i. Keep in mind that there is no 30p DVD or BluRay and 60p converted to 60i will look exactly as original 60i. On top of that, you get 30p from 60p that will look like original 30p. For Web delivery I suggest converting the 60i with the Handbrake method to 30p.

Can your other cameras do 1280x720@60P?

DVD and BluRay are 60i or 24p. If you want smooth slow motion from your 60p footage you would have to do it in a 24p project for your discs and 30p for Web.

Rainer wrote on 3/29/2014, 3:06 AM

Agree, but perhaps I could be forgiven for thinking OldSmoke's original responses
(" 60p does everything" "60p all the way") indicated you always should shoot 60p. I wasn't going to comment further and since you're now shooting 60i it won't matter, but if you do shoot 60p you may need to be aware of storage. I did check, mainly for my own benefit: for an identical 8 secs (PAL), 50p 33.8 MB, 24Mbps 25p 22.8 MB, 17Mbps 25p 16.1 MB. Just in case, I also tested how Vegas does interlacing, it does take odd and even lines from consecutive frames of 60p to convert seamlessly to 60i.