@lenard Haven't tried. Waiting for the tutorials.

@lenard It can use GPU

The GPU tab in Preferences - Mocha Pro 2021 OFX:

That's good to hear, that powermesh has so many tracking points it would likely be a lot slower on cpu only

What is the Preview Rate for their REMOVE RENDER, back in VegasPro?
 

On my MONSTA PC, with MP2020 it is glacial, like frozen molasses. No, I won’t lift a dime or penny or Euro until I hear much better Preview times. Great software. Great GUI on the OFX. But IS this Preview rate that is the sucker-punch for me. I’ve been on the Forums about this. I travelled to IBC last year to quizz the BORIS Team about this and still no assist on it.

So, will some kind VegHead test the MP2021 Remove Render Preview back in VegasPro18. And yes, the GPU is acknowledged by the MP Preferences.

Oh yeah, nearly forgot: Is there Contour Shuttle Pro options? The Transport Controls are “whimsical”.

@Grazie ... I'll give it a shot tomorrow.

@Dexcon - Can't ask for more! Thanks 😎

They seem to be about equal in speed , they may essentially run the same engine now, working outside the editing software. The unlicensed version on left is Vegas Pro, on the right is Stand alone version. This is a major upgrade for ofx version

@lenard - Inside for Remove Render Template AND using a GPU.

I tried, but the plugin made vegas unstable and kept crashing. From what I could see with a ram pre-render. It's hellishly slow, uses a lot of cpu, Not sure if it was using GPU, but it's not even relevant, it's not useable in vegas. Using the Mocha UI removal is lightening fast in comparison, but by the sounds of things it always was, the problem was within vegas. Doesn't look like anything has changed.

But get another opinion, My vegas did not like that plugin at all and might not have been running properly.

@Grazie what do you mean by "Remove Render Template?"

I have a working version of Mocha 8 but haven't used the remove module yet. I can try a test in VP 17 what exactly you were trying to do

@michael-harrison - Sure, after having completed a Remove session in the OFX MP and leave, and return to the MP Control Panel there’s a DropDown to allow us to Select the Remove Render.

@michael-harrison - OK, here yah goes:

@Grazie it's taking about 3 seconds for Vegas render each frame on my machine. Same result in Resolve.

so it *could* be an OFX issue or could simply be an optimization that Boris needs to do.

It strikes me though that almost universally, you'll be better off doing the remove in Mocha and rendering that to an intermediate format for further processing. It's just yet another example of nailing down the results before moving on.

@Grazie On the other hand, AE renders the remove at nearly real-time speeds.

It strikes me though that almost universally, you'll be better off doing the remove in Mocha and rendering that to an intermediate format for further processing. It's just yet another example of nailing down the results before moving on.

In my short time with the ofx version, I"m not seeing the advantage, If it was possible to playback on vegas but pause until each frame from mocha until rendered resulting in no dropped frames I could see that as being useful when combing multiple video tracks. You could ram precache although most have set that to 0 due to vegas crashing, but mocha ofx is pulling out hair slow. I would never use it knowing how much faster the popout GUI is, and that's something I never knew about, having the option to use removal in mocha or editor, which is a big positive given how poorly it works within vegas

@lenard Well, to be fair, the lack of a render cache is really on Vegas. Mocha can't know what video source it's going to be handed when you start previewing in the Vegas UI, so any cache Mocha might keep is useless at that level.

You *could* go straight from the Mocha UI back to Vegas and immediately render a composite of the remove with some number of other tracks or fx. You'd just have to be confident that the remove was done and walk away during the render.

@Grazie  ... I've just given it a go using a 6 seconds MP4 (3840x2160x25fps from a Sony AX100) which was then stabilised in Merc 5 SAL and exported in Merc recommended medium quality. The Mocha Pro task was to remove a person walking R to L across the frame:

In Mocha Pro 2021, the tracking went quickly though because I placed the splines very wide of the man, I had to regularly manually move the splines to follow him - it didn't take long though. Organising the second layer was easy of course. I didn't specifically time the Removal Tool process, but it took less than 60 seconds - more like 30 seconds.

Playback on VP's timeline was semi-successful only when using Preview (auto) or less - about 12fps with Preview (auto). Draft (auto) returned 25fps.

Render choice in VP was MAGIX AVC/AAC MP4 UHD 2160p 25fps resulted in the following stats:

Average frame rate: 0.79fps

Render time: 3 mins 09 secs

CPU Usage: 92.80%

Memory Usage: 13.37GB

My overall impression: Working in Mocha Pro 2021 is easy going. Preview on VP's timeline is sluggish (to say the least) and MP21 has not improved over MP20 in this regard IMO.

More movement would probably be seen when watching the Jakobshavn Isbrae glacier in Greenland as it has been recorded as advancing by more than 46 metres a day in summer.

Because rendering Mocha Pro, Neat Video and some BCC FX is so time consuming, I usually individually render the affected video events as intermediates as Michael-Harrison mentioned earlier on.

I think Mocha's days are numbered. This is a face track, fully auto that comes with Resolve 17, no fixes. 38 seconds to track. Original clip was 90 seconds and 50fps, so it's processing at over 100fps

I chose this clip from twitch because it's low quality (low bitrate/resolution), it's tracking her face but she turns her head around so face is fully obscured, she walks infront of onscreen text . All of these things will make life very hard for Mocha, and will never complete without intervention and tracking fixes, but Resolve is using AI, and Mocha still isn't with 2021 version

It's a limited use example. This doesn't have the accuracy for much of the work that Mocha is used for, but it is an example of something Mocha can't do

@lenard  ... I assume that you are referring to this (from Resolve's user manual):

Resolve FX Refine
‚ Beauty: (Studio Only) Allows you to selectively smooth detail that falls above a
particular threshold, while preserving detail falling below a specific threshold.

There's nothing particularly new in that approach, NewBlueFX has had an equivalent function in ColorFast for many years. This NBFX tutorial is from February 2013:

https://newbluefx.com/tutorials/skin-preservation-mask/

It should be noted that this approach affects any other elements in the image that are the same or similar color tone to the skin tone unless the face can be masked.

BorisFX has had a similar BCC Unit for some years called Beauty Studio which does allow for masking by using its inbuilt Mocha if needed. This BCC Beauty Studio tutorial is from December 2015:

https://borisfx.com/videos/bcc-beauty-studio-tutorial-skin-smoothing-retouching-overview/

@lenard  ... I assume that you are referring to this (from Resolve's user manual):

Resolve FX Refine
‚ Beauty: (Studio Only) Allows you to selectively smooth detail that falls above a
particular threshold, while preserving detail falling below a specific threshold.

This is the description for it. It's intended for auto reframing such as 16:9 video to 9:16 or square etc but in my example i use it for tracking the face to make a zoomed in stabilised version in the same aspect ratio.

@lenard