Multi-Channel rendering

Robert Larcher wrote on 8/12/2012, 9:48 AM
I Use Vegas mainly for Multi-Channel audio processing (VST),
The Project Audio Properties allows the user to use a 2 or 5.1 channels setting,
When it comes to music, I mostly work at 24/96, 4.0 or 5.0.

When comes the time to Render the project, I never use Dolby Digital as it's
quite comparable to MP3 in terms of quality.

Nobody in any audiophile community uses Dolby Digital or DTS,
unless one can afford a 2k$ DTS-MA encoder !!!
Its mostly FLAC or WAV 24/96 or 24/192.

My finished product is always Multi-Channel FLAC.

I noticed that Vegas only allows for 1 or 2 channels FLAC rendering,

Why the limitation ?

I also noticed that in the "Microsoft Wave" template settings, one can chose up to 32 channels Wave rendering, WOW...

Anyways, since there is no option for 4.0 nor 5.0, I selected 4 or 5 channels,
then I got this pop up saying:
"The custom template you selected is not valid with the current project settings..." !?!?!

So for now, I have to render in Multiple Mono files,
Use another software to Merge and FLAC the files, available here:
www.surroundbyus.com/pub/audiomuxer/images/AudioMuxer_00e.gif
www.surroundbyus.com/sbu/viewtopic.php?p=788#refdownload

My question is: why give so many options if there is no way to use them in the first place ???

Perhaps allowing for more options in the Project Audio Properties, like 4.0 or 5.0, would be nice.

Thank you for reading me,

Robert Larcher.

Comments

musicvid10 wrote on 8/12/2012, 5:34 PM
1. Vegas does not support VST on the Master 5.1 mixer. We've been after them for years to fix this; so far not a glimmer that they will ever do so.

2. With your Vegas purchase, you got a license to a fully configurable Dolby Digital Pro Encoder, that turns out Dolby Digital 5.1 AC3 along with stereo and PL variants. 2/0, 3/0, 2/1, 3/1, 2/2, 3/2 are available options. AAC surround is also available in some templates. Those are what most of us use, not an external audio encoder. As far as negatively comparing DD to mp3, I'll just caution you to not believe everything you read on hydrogenaudio. Given everything you've stated, protools might just be a better solution for you.

3. You can also render 6ch discrete PCM direct from a Vegas 5.1 project. By properly configuring your buses, many more combinations are possible. Basically, you assign an appropriate number of busses in your project, enable multichannel mapping, and assign specific channels to specific busses in the map. 4.0 or 5,0 should be a snap.

4. One thing that most independent producers (as differentiated from hobbyists) spend a lot of time worrying about is compatibility and playability. It's pretty much a slam dunk that delivering material that does not meet near-universal delivery criteria is going to put you out of business. Given the limited support for playing flac under Windows or streaming services, I see little reason to go there at this point in time.
Robert Larcher wrote on 8/13/2012, 11:58 AM
Musicvid,

I use VST on a per track basis,

The idea of comparing DD to MP3 may have been harsh, but the fact remains that it is a lossy format unless you go for TrueHD, which doesn't seem to be available in Vegas.

The main idea in using Multi-Channel FLAC is to reduce the file size of HiRes audio at 96 or 192KHz, and insure compatibility with HTPC audio players such as Foobar, and because multi-channel WAV tend to confuse most players.

Also a FLAC file can be brought back to it's bit-for-bit original WAV format for HiRes audio Blu-Ray authoring for example.
Pink Floyd's Immersion BoxSet HiRes Audio BluRay comes to mind.

My original question was, since native FLAC encoder allow for Multi-Channel encoding, why imposing a 2 channels limit in Vegas ?
musicvid10 wrote on 8/13/2012, 1:48 PM
Unfortunately, I don't have an answer for that because I haven't gone down that path.

Even though we both have a lot of experience in digital audio, I can see that we work on different sides of the audiophile/producer paradigm, although the direction you are heading may foretell the future of audio delivery.

Except for BluRay production, there is relatively little interest in lossless audio for mainstream media delivery at the present. Indeed, the trend has been steadily toward more compression efficiency, often at the expense of some temporal quality. From my viewpoint, AC3 falls somewhere in the middle of that debate. AAC is more universally playable (Flash, Apple devices etc.), but the encoders available are often truly awful.

The lack of multichannel support in the Vegas flac encoder may result from licensing or legacy issues; a search of the forums and/or a note to Tech Support or a Feature suggestion may turn up more information for you.

Sony .pca (a lossless compressed format) supports discrete multichannel iirc. Finding a player it will work with is another question altogether.

Best of luck.