well i am wondering about the price a bit. wondering if the quad or 8 core macs would do just as good for less

http://store.apple.com/us/browse/home/specialdeals/mac/mac_pro

I'm thinking with 16GB RAM i'd skip the cache drive and make a RAM drive for it instead. Half a GB of it should be more than plenty.

JHendrix wrote:
"well i am wondering about the price a bit. wondering if the quad or 8 core macs would do just as good for less"

The quad core Mac Pro will not beat an I7-3930K computer; only the 8 core and 12 core machines will. And even then, their video cards are not nearly as good as the GTX570. They use a Radeon 5770.

Before I changed computer, I replaced the 5770 that was in my old machine with a GTX570. A render that would typically take 2 1/2 hours was cut down to 50 minutes. And now that I have an I7-3930K with the same GTX570, they only take 8 to 10 minutes.

Nice. And I am looking at 14 hours left on my render right now with my lowly P4 running Win7 64 bit using Vegas 8!

I'll catch up one of these days!

Wot, no mouse?

" I replaced the 5770 that was in my old machine "

was you old computer a mac and then you put the card in a pc?

also...

according to this poster the mac quad core is the same as an older mac 8 core

https://discussions.apple.com/message/17495965#17495965

so maybe the quad core could beat or compete

I always had PCs except for a short (few years) stint with Amigas. I had purchased the ATI 5770 for my PC a few years ago after my previous video card had died.

Of all benchmark applications, I like Cinebench because it doesn't do any gaming tests. The CPU test is done using all cores to create a 3D image. All such test results show that you need a double Westmere CPU MAC to beat a single CPU (I7-3930K) PC.

Furthermore, Apple does not like to give out the precise CPU names they use in their computer (at least on their web site). You have to be careful about what chip is involved.

You have to remember that there are quad cores and quad cores. If you are talking I7 and I5 chips, they can't touch the I7-3930K. The difference becomes almost nil when playing games but I believe that's not what you are looking for.

XEON CPUs are a totally different story. The W3530 Nehalem used in some Mac Pros easily fall behind the I7-3930K. And then you've the Westmeres. But again, there are Westmeres and there are Westmeres. I don't remember all models but they are the Xeon 65XX series. From what I understand, and I am not an expert - just an enthusiast, the X5690 blows everything out of the water.

To make a long story short, it's not just a matter of cores. One particular quad core does not equate another quad core. There is just too many complications.

I just run the pricing for a new computer at CyberPower and here is what I was looking at:

Case: * Coolermaster HAF-X Gaming Full Tower Case w/ 1x230mm Fan, 1x200mm Fans, 2xFront USB 3.0 Port [+30]
Noise Reduction Technology: Sound Absorbing Foam on Side, Top And Bottom panels [+29]
CPU: Intel® Core™ i7-3930K Six-Core 3.20 GHz 12MB Intel Smart Cache LGA2011 (All Venom OC Certified)
Performance Tuning Protection Plan by Intel: Intel® Core™ i7-3930K Performance Tuning Protection Plan by Intel [+39]
Venom Boost Fast And Efficient Factory Overclocking: Extreme OC (Extreme Overclock 20% or more) [+49]
Cooling Fan: Asetek 510LC Liquid Cooling System 120MM Radiator & Fan (Enhanced Cooling Performance + Extreme Silent at 20dBA) (Single Standard 120MM Fan)
Coolant for Cyberpower Xtreme Hydro Water Cooling Kits: Standard Coolant
Motherboard: (SLI Support) Asus Sabertooth X79 Intel X79 Chipset Quad Channel DDR3 ATX w/ TUF Armor, UEFI BIOS, SSD Caching, 7.1 HD Audio, Intel GbLAN, USB3.0, SATA-III RAID, 3 Gen3 PCIe X16, 2 PCIe X1 & 1 PCI [+129]
Memory: 32GB (4GBx8) DDR3/1600MHz Quad Channel Memory [+6] (Kingston HyperX)
Video Card: AMD Radeon HD 7970 3GB GDDR5 16X PCIe 3.0 Video Card (Major Brand Powered by AMD)
Power Supply Upgrade: 800 Watts - Standard Power Supply - SLI/CrossFireX Ready
Hard Drive: 120GB Corsair Force GT Series SATA-III 6.0Gb/s SSD - 555MB/s Read & 515MB/s Write [+82] (Single Drive)
Optical Drive: LG 12X Internal Super Multi Blu-Ray Rewriter [+31] (Black Color)
Sound: HIGH DEFINITION ON-BOARD 7.1 AUDIO
Network: Onboard Gigabit LAN Network
Keyboard: Xtreme Gear (Black Color) Multimedia/Internet USB Keyboard
Mouse: XtremeGear Optical USB 3 Buttons Gaming Mouse
Internal USB Port: Built-in USB 2.0 Ports
Operating System: Microsoft® Windows 7 Professional [+31] (64-bit Edition)
Ultra Care Option: CoolerMaster Thermal Fusion 400 Extreme Performance CPU - Thermal Compound Optimized for Thermal Dissipation [+10]
Professional Wiring for All WIRING Inside The System Chassis - Minimize Cable Exposure, Maximize Airflow in Your System [+19]
Service: STANDARD WARRANTY: 3-YEAR LIMITED WARRANTY PLUS LIFE-TIME TECHNICAL SUPPORT

Price: $2494

I didn't spec a data drive because I have an iStar trayless cage and several big drives already. And I already have a media tray with USB 3

According to their numbers, the GTX570 would be $161 cheaper than the card I selected.

Looks like you could get your system from Cyber Power much cheaper.

Kirk,

That sounds like a great deal but I'd ask them to replace the Asetek 510LC with a Corsair H80. It's much better.

>Asetek 510LC with a Corsair H80. It's much better.

Noted, there are so many variations and I don't know what advantage there is to one over the other. I will change that on my saved configuration. Wait, that one is not available for the configuration I have they have the "Corsair Hydro Series H60 "

I am struggling with the video card part. Should I go for broke and get the very best single card. $600+ or should I get two lesser cards and run in SLI?

Here is the current system that I have configured:
http://www.cyberpowerpc.com/saved/1DX653

Thanks,

Kirk

The Corsair H60 is not as good as the H80 but still better than the Asetek. As for using SLI, I intended to do just that. But I found out it probably doesn't work. About 2 or 3 weeks ago, I asked the folks at SCS if SLI was supported for GPU acceleration and I haven't heard back from them.

As for using the AMD 7970, it's probably the most powerful card you can get without moving to the workstation type cards. And they cost a whole lot more without necessarily giving that much of an improvement. If you check the GPU accelleration page for VP 11, you'll notice that they tested two workstation cards against two gaming cards.

The NVidia Quadro 5000 got its butt kicked by the NVidia GTX 570 both in terms of rendering improvement and playback performance. The AMD FirePro V8800 was also beaten by the GTX 570 when rendering video. However, it offered the best playback performance of the bunch.

The AMD Radeon HD 6870 (the second gaming card) offered similar rendering and playback performance as the FirePro.

Since the card you are considering is the fastest gaming card on the market, it should give better rendering and playback performance than anything else tested. The only problem is that the 7970 has probably never been used with Vegas Pro. In theory, it should be a killer. But it's a brand new card using brand new driver software.

Will there be compatibility problems? I have absolutely zero idea. In all likelyhood, it will work. The second best choice is an NVidia 580. It is not as powerful and (I noticed) your provider is charging a few more dollars for it. But don't get a lesser card like the 570 or something similar and hope to use SLI. That is the worse gamble you can make because, as of now, it doesn't look like it does work.

Where is the GUP Acceleration page? I will look for it.

So as far as anybody knows, running two cards in SLI will gain nothing for Vegas rendering speed?

http://www.sonycreativesoftware.com/vegaspro/gpuacceleration

As far as anybody knows, running two cards in SLI does not bring any gain in rendering speed.

The $3995 price tag is really high. I would also not use Cyberpower...had a bad experience with them in the past. Since I did not have time to stop and build my own...I went to a very reputable builder, had them build 2 towers and a laptop and they were workhorses for 6 years without issues. I am about to take delivery on the next build. It is an i7 3930 close to what you spec'd out but with a 1200 watt pro gold 90% power supply as I am adding 3 rapture drives for a raid and another as a graphics drive. The ram is also 1600Mhz and the SSD drive is 240 Gig corsair Series 3 6Gb/s and with all that is $1300 less. The company is: xi computer

Thanks. :)

Thanks, I didn't know anything about Cyber Power, but someone else recommended them.

I would have a local guy build this, but he won't touch it because "That CPU doesn't have an Intel cooling fan".

Tried to use XI Computer's online configuration to select a similar system to what I have on Cyberpower, and it is $1000 more right now and I don't even have everything selected yet. How could you get it cheaper than Cyberpower?

What type of bad experience did you have with Cyberpower, if you don't mind me asking?

Thanks,

Kirk

Kirk, I said it was $1300 les than the almost $4000 stated in the original post. Cyberpower was $2500 which is $200 less than xi

Cyberpower will be less...around $200- $400 less, but they backordered parts and moved the delivery date a month! I was going to pay a $50 rush fee for 5 day delivery...they said that could not be done and moved it to a 10-12 business day delivery and that turned into over a month as stated. Some reviews showed hardware issues if you search the company. I must admit...Cyberpower promptly refunded my money in a reasonable time. I simply did not want to pay for something and then wait a month for delivery. They charged my card right away.

We are a returning customer to xi and they offer discounts for that. The system I mentioned is $2650 and they do not charge your card until it ships.

Also...only having them install the 240Gig SSD drive. I already have the WD Raptors that I am adding....

Mike

Thanks, Mike.

I have had 2 Cyberpower custom builds, and their service has been good. My Q6600 never had any problems. My i7-950 had a DRAM module go bad, and they replaced all 3 modules. Then the Sata controller on the mobo went and they replaced it after working with me over the phone to resolve the problem. I did have to pay the freight back to California (from Michigan).

Thanks, I guess there are good and bad experiences from most companies.

Kirk

" he won't touch it because "That CPU doesn't have an Intel cooling fan".

That excuse is pure bull manure. Yes, Intel used to add a fan with all their CPUs. So what if they don't any more? Most people installed their own fans anyway. And because of its nature, it is preferable to water cool the I7-3930K.

As a side note, Intel does sell a water cooler designed specifically for the 2011 chipset (3930K, 3960X as well as the upcoming 3820 cpus). It goes by the elegant name RTS2011LC.