m2t files should not be giving you any difficulty at all, unless you system is quite old. The AVCHD files will require more horsepower in Vegas, but low power machines and quality conscience folks use an intermediate such as Cineform for that.

That said, my machine with VP9 handles AVCHD with no difficulty and will preview GOOD/FULL on an external HD monitor with layers and CC.

We really need to see what is going on with your system. Even so, my system did not cost $4,600. Ask anyone here. My machine will smoke most and it didn't cost that.

You would probably be happy with a properly built machine based on the Core i7 930 or 950 processor. I can build a machine on that which will handle your AVCHD quite nicely. I know, I built one last month.

Before putting out money, lets look at what is going on first.




Remember that those beauties, and they are strong, reliable beauties, come with all the software. If you have the software, then pricing a similar system should be less. They are built on a SuperMicro MB, which in my opinion is a strong way to go.

If I were outfitting a post house with multiple seats, a would buy these packages. They have the software, the strength of hardware, and the 2 year support.

For a one machine shop like me now (used to be 17) I built my own. I have unlimited tech support from the system builder.

If you are rendering to Sony AVC, then a CUDA enabled Nvidia card is supposed to speed up rendering in Vegas 10 (we'll see). That being said, here is what I would build with $3625 (about the middle point of your 2 computer prices).

Prices from Newegg...

- Intel Core i7-980x Gulftown 3.33GHz 6 core processor (MOST IMPORTANT PIECE) = $1000
- ASUS Sabertooth X58 LGA 1366 Intel X58 SATA 6Gb/s USB 3.0 ATX Intel Motherboard = $200
- Antec P183 Black Aluminum / Steel / Plastic ATX Mid Tower Computer Case = $155
- Kingston SSDNow V+ Series SNVP325-S2B/256GB 2.5" 256GB SATA II MLC Internal Solid State Drive = $685 x 2 = $1,370
- ASUS ENGTX470/2DI/1280MD5 GeForce GTX 470 (Fermi) 1280MB 320-bit GDDR5 PCI Express 2.0 x16 HDCP Ready SLI Support Video Card = $300
- CORSAIR CMPSU-750TX 750W ATX12V / EPS12V SLI Ready CrossFire Ready 80 PLUS Certified Active PFC Compatible with Core i7 Power Supply = $110
- CORSAIR XMS3 12GB (6 x 2GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1600 (PC3 12800) Desktop Memory Model HX3X12G1600C9 G = $290
- Windows 7 Ultimate = $200
TOTAL PRICE = $3,625

OR you could just buy one of these...

http://cgi.ebay.com/Barebones-PC-Intel-Six-Core-i7-980x-ASRock-X58-Extreme-/370432048733?pt=Desktop_PCs&hash=item563f787e5d#ht_8429wt_1122

Either way, make sure you spend on the PROCESSOR. I have used multiple PC's in the last 4 years with Vegas, and the i7's from Intel, especially the 980x, make the biggest difference. Well worth the cost.

I had not looked at the Sabertooth. It looks like a good value.

The one thing that I did not mention was that I saw the best improvement in .h264 playback performance when I increased my memory speed. It is not enough to have fast memory, you have to actual make the system use it at the higher speed. Moving up to 1600MHz helped a lot. I wish I had bought faster RAM so I could have pushed it farther, but 1600MHz gives good results.

Here is the Desktop and the laptop i have.

The systemax has been a pain in the butt...bought it for $2600 when vista first came out. The techs there said i was crazy to buy it (after i had to send it bacK) said never buy anything when an OS first comes in.
Nice to hear that after you buy their best machine!
It still grinds memory all the time and chugs along

My FX gateway specs are below that...but it too spits and sputters with vegas 8.c...other than that its a great laptop!

Systemax:

Systemax Venture VX2 Intel Core2 Quad Q6600Systemax Venture VX2 Intel Core2 Quad Q6600 / genuine Windows Vista® Ultimate /4GB / 1TB / DVD±RW/ Combo / NVIDIA 8800GTS 320MB Video / Intel D975XBX2 Motherboard / 3 Year On-Site Warranty
Operating Systems: Genuine Windows® Vista™ Ultimate
Platform: PC
Orientations Allowed: Vertical
Form Factor: Mid-Tower
Bays: 2 - 3.5" Drive Bays
3 - 5.25" Drive Bays
Internal Bays: 4 - 3.5" Drive Bays
Available 3.5" Drive Bays: 3
Available 5.25" Drive Bays: 1
PCI Slots (Total): 2
PCI Slots (Available): 2
PCI Express X16 Slots (Total): 3
PCI Express X16 Slots (Available): 2
PCI Express Slots (Total): 3
PCI Express Slots (Available): 2
Expansion Slots: 7
PS/2 Keyboard Connectors: 1
PS/2 Mouse Connectors: 1
Serial Communication Ports: 1
Parallel Ports: 1
USB Ports: 6
FireWire Ports: 2
LAN Ports: 1
Audio Out Jacks: 2
Line In Jacks: 1
Microphone Jacks: 2
DVI Video: 2
S/PDIF Connectors: 2
Processor Brand: Intel®
Processor Class: Core 2 Quad
Processor Number: Q6600
Processor Speed: 2.40GHz
Processor Interface: Socket LGA775
Processors Supported: 1
Processors Onboard: 1
Additional Technologies: Intel® Extended Memory 64 Technology
Virtualization
Quad-Core Technology
Memory Type: DDR2
Memory Size: 1GB
Total Memory: 4.0GB
Memory Speed: DDR2 800 (PC2-6400)
Memory Slots (Total): 4
Memory Slots (Available): 0
Maximum Memory Supported: 8.0GB
Interface: SATA II
Capacity: 1TB RAID 0 (2x500GB)
Speed: 7,200RPM


Gateway:`

Processor Intel® Core™2 Duo Processor1 P7350 (2.0GHz, 1066MHz FSB, 3MB L2 Cache)6
Operating System Genuine Windows® 7 Home Premium (64-bit)7
Memory 4096MB 1066MHz DDR3 Dual Channel Memory (2-2048MB modules)8
Hard Drive 500GB 5400RPM SATA hard drive3
Chassis Chassis with NVIDIA® GeForce® 9800M GTS Graphics with 1GB of GDDR3 Discrete Video Memory and Intel® PM45 Chipset8
Battery 9-Cell Lithium Ion (7800mAh)
Wireless Network 802.11b/g/n Wireless LAN9
Weight 9.05 lbs. (4.11 kg) system unit only / 10.8 lbs. (4.9 kg.) box
Adapter AC Adapter
Application Software Microsoft® Works 9.0, Microsoft® Money Essentials & Microsoft® Office Home and Student 2007 (60-day complimentary trial period)2
Battery Life Up to 3.6-hours4
Color FX Premium Design with brushed metal keyboard surround and high-impact composite finish
Digital Media Software Cyberlink® DVD Solution™ featuring PowerDVD™ & Power2Go™
Dimensions (Box) 14.6" (H) x 19" (W) x 6.5" (D) or 370mm (H) x 485mm (W) x 165mm (D)
Dimensions (System) 1.3"-1.70" (H) x 15.75" (W) x 11.75" (D) or 33-43mm (H) x 400mm (W) x 298mm (D)
Display 17" High-Definition Widescreen WXGA+ Display (1440 x 900)10
Expansion Slots ExpressCard™ Type 54
External Ports (3) USB 2.0, VGA Connector, IEEE 1394b, eSATA Port, HDMI
Keyboard and Mouse Full-Size Keyboard, Synaptics Touchpad with Vertical Scroll
Media Card Reader 5-in-1 Digital Media Card Reader (Memory Stick™, Memory Stick™ Pro, Multi Media Card™, Secure Digital™, xD-Picture Card™)11
Memory Capacity Maximum 4GB
Modem 56K ITU V.92 ready Fax/Modem (RJ-11 port)
Multimedia Buttons Illuminated Metal Precision-Touch Multimedia Buttons
Network 10/100/1000 Gigabit Ethernet LAN (RJ-45 port)
Optical Drive 8x DVD-SuperMulti Double-Layer Drive
Security Software Norton Internet Security™ 2009 (60-day trial)5
Sound High-Definition Audio Support, Built-In speakers, microphone, headphone/SPDIF Audio Out
Warranty 1 Year Parts and Labor Limited Warranty12
Web Camera 1.3 Megapixel Built-in Webcam

I am probably going to sound like an egotist, but there is a Vegas "rendertest" file floating around and I am pleased to say my machine as of 3 weeks ago is the winner of the rendertest at 125 seconds.

My machine is way over the top, but since you ask. I have dual Xeon L5640 chips for a total of 24 logical CPU. Cost for the machine was $5000. Each of the CPUs was $1,000.

Memory and fast hard drives are nice, but if you want a screaming renders, you want as many cores as possible, even if they are slow. Vegas uses 24 cores (logical CPU to be more exact).

Rich

@Rich

Sorry to be an egotist but I bested you at 104 seconds recently. I dialed mine back due to a cooling issue and came in at 112 seconds even dialed back.

Just over $3,300

I get lifetime support from the builder as well. OK, that means I have to fix it, but it sounds good.

Man both of those numbers ( the two previous posts) are blazing fast!

Did you say what machine you had?


I am thinking about the FX 480 as opposed to the 470

i will be curious to see if Vegas 10 can get close to the Adobe Mercury Engine
watching you tube videos of it got me excited about editing again.
I have waited not to buy Adobe to first see what Vegas 10 will do.

The other option i was thinking of was (2) of the new Phenom 2 6 core processors. They are like $300 each and the I7 is 6 core at $1000.
Can i link them and use all 12 cores and save $300?

Great answers!!!

Thanks

$2000 Machine i am considering having built......the $4600 machine specs are under that.

INTEL I7-930 2.8GHz 8M 4.8GT/S PROCESSOR
18 WIN 7 HOME 64BitsYour browser may not support display of this image.
19 2TB SATA 7200RPM 64MB HARD DRIVE
20 12GB DDR3 1333MHz MEMORY (6 DIMM, 24GB max)
21 10X BLU-RAY BURNER SATA OPTICAL DRIVE
22 22X DVD RW SATA SECONDARY OPTICAL DRIVE
23 GEFOREC GTX 470 PCIe 1.25GB GDDR5 SDRAM VIDEO
24 802.11N PCI WIRELESS ADAPTER
25 GIGABIT LAN
26 19 in 1 MEDIA CARD READER
27 PORTS: 2 PS/2, 1 Esata, 1 IEEE1394, 6 USB, 1 RJ45, 1 x 6 AUDIO
28 PS/2 KEYBOARD/MOUSE
29 ATX CASE w/ UPGRADED 600W POWER
30 1 YR WARRANTY


$4600 Machine

INTEL EXTREME EDITION i7-980X HEXA-CORE 3.33GHz PROCESSOR
18 WIN 7 HOME 64B OS
19 WD BLACK SERIES 2TB SATA 7200RPM 64MB HARD DRIVE
20 24GB DDR3 1333MHz MEMORY (6 DIMM, 24GB max)
21 10X BLU-RAY BURNER SATA OPTICAL DRIVE
22 22X DVD RW SATA SECONDARY OPTICAL DRIVE
23 GEFORCE GTX 480 PCIe 1.50GB GDDR5 SDRAM VIDEO
24 802.11N PCI WIRELESS ADAPTER
25 DUAL GIGABIT LAN
26 19 in 1 MEDIA CARD READER
27 GIGA-BYTE GA-X58A-UD7 MOTHERBOARD
28 LOGITECH WIRELESS USB COMBO
29 COOLER MASTER HAF X ULTIMATE FULL SIZE GAMING CHASSIS
30 ANTEC TRUE POWER QUATTRO 1000W POWER SUPPLY
31 1 YR WARRANTY

" Especially the ability to render and scrub with my Sony cameras NXCAM x5 .mts .m2ts and my Z5U with .m2t files."

This is where CS5 seems to outperforms Vegas, realtime playback. especially with mixed media on the T/L.
If you want to built a PC to run both you can largely ignore Vegas, whatever will run CS5 will run Vegas. Both like lots of RAM and a 64bit OS obviously. Adobe are upfront, their code is optimised over no more than 4 cores. If you want to make use of Adobe's Mercury engine then you need a compatible video card. The list of supported cards is on their website. The FX4800 is probably not a bad choice as it also give you 10bit video output, nice if you're into color grading and have an expensive monitor.

None of this apart from the high end video card will be wasted on Vegas. Adobe seem to be backing the high end HP machines and I suspect the beast I looked at with 192 GB of RAM would have V10 screaming along quite nicely. The machines spec'ed by SCS are also nice. I've had a dual Xeon Supermicro system for years and it's still quite fast. Build quality is excellent.

Bob.

Thanks Farss...this is what i suspected.

With the overwhelm of information in this changing environment of GPU processing i figured i had better ask just in case i was missing something before i spend that kind of money.

Now the question for me is...do i spend 2K or 3.6K or 4.6K

Decisions decisions decisions !!!

You may want to look at a Mac Pro running Vegas and Adobe CS5.
DSE is running Vegas on a Mac using NXCAM camera.

However...vegas does ingest, edit, output 3D.
Your MACHINE may struggle with it. My MacBookPro does not.
I'm playing back dual streams of AVC and AVCHD at the same time (sourced from NXCAM and GoPro's).
I'm experimenting with two EX1's as well. They decode more easily, of course.

My video editor has Mac and has FCP on one part and can switch it over to Adobe CS5 and use both.
He is begging me to get a Mac.

I just cant do it!
I can get so much more machine (that i am familiar with) for the same money.

The idea of adding something new to learn on my plate.....arrrrggg!

When i used to direct another editor i used a few years back making TV commercials...he had a state of the art Mac...and it was great telling him what i wanted done in real time. FCP and Motion was great to direct...but learning it???

Years later i can see that NLE is fairly similar and i could probably make the transition smoothly....but am afraid to take the chance:-)

My current video editor does say that Adobe works 10 times better on his Mac than his PC.
I find this very interesting and wonder why?

Back in March 2007 I built my first editing computer online from
CyberPowerPc.com and was very happy with the purchase.

Today this computer is way too slow for editing AVCHD and needs to be replaced.

This passed labor day weekend I ordered a new computer from CyberPowerPc.com. My goal was to stay under two thousand dollar and I did.

Here's what I got.

Case: Xion Predator 970 Gaming Series Mid Tower Case w/ 2 External Removable HDD Bays

CD-1 LG WH10-LS30K 10X Internal Super Multi Blu-Ray Rewriter

CD-2: 24X Double Layer Dual Format DVD+-R/+-RW + CD-R/RW Drive

CPU: Intel(R) Core™ i7-950 3.06 GHz 8M Intel Smart Cache LGA1366

CS-FAN: Maximum 120MM Color Case Cooling Fans for your selected case

Asetek 570LX Liquid Cooling system w/ 240MM Radiator and Dual Fans (Extreme Overclocking Performance + Extreme Silent at 20dBA)

HDD #1 1TB SATA-III 6.0Gb/s 64MB Cache 7200RPM HDD (Single Hard Drive)

HDD #2 1TB SATA-III 6.0Gb/s 64MB Cache 7200RPM HDD (Single HardDrive)

IEEE-CARD: IEEE 1394 CARD AND DRIVER

KEYBOARD: Xtreme Gear (Black Color) Multimedia/Internet USB Keyboard

MEMORY: 6GB (2GBx3) DDR3/1866MHz Triple Channel Memory Module (Corsair Dominator)

MOTHERBOARD: Asus Sabertooth X58 Intel X58 Chipset

MOUSE: XtremeGear Optical USB 3 Buttons Gaming Mouse

NOISEREDUCE1: Sound Absorbing Foam on Side, Top And Bottom panels

NOISEREDUCE2: Power Supply Gasket

NOISEREDUCE3: Anti-Vibration Fan Mounts

OS: Microsoft Windows 7 Home Premium (64-bit Edition)

OVERCLOCK: Ultimate OC (Ultimate Overclock 30% or more)

POWERSUPPLY: 950 Watts - CyberPowerPC Gaming 80 Plus Power Supply

NZXT Sentry-2 Fan Touch Screen Fan Control & Temperature Display

NVIDIA GeForce GTX 470 1.2GB 16X PCIe Video Card (EVGA Powered by NVIDIA)

CASUPGRADE: 12in Cold Cathode Neon Light

Professional WIRING Inside The System Chassis - Minimize Cable Exposure, Maximize Airflow in Your System.

CoolerMaster Thermal Fusion 400 Extreme Performance CPU - Thermal Compound Optimized for Thermal Dissipation

Coupon: SPRING0410 (5% Discount) $-99.10 SUBTOTAL $1,882.90 + ups 3 day shipping $85.00

Hopefully this unit will be good for CUDA in the future and powerful enough for AVCHD editing.

"CASUPGRADE: 12in Cold Cathode Neon Light"

The photons from this will make the electrons travel faster :)

Bob.

i heard the 12in cold cathode neon lights will speed up the rendering time but only with AVCHD. If you want faster rendering time with HDV you need to use the 6in cold cathode neon lights but they must be red.

Jerry's system seems to be quite good. It could even take an 980X later if he wanted to push it up a little. Nice price point for a nice combination of hardware.

Keith

Keith: you know a lot about computers - one question: can the 980x be used in a 2 processor machine - or must it be the Xeon version of the 980x ? .. and which motherboard would you use ?

I am not an expert. I have just been doing a lot of messing around lately. To the best of my knowledge, the Core i7 980X will not run in a dual processor configuration.

There is a 6 core 3.0GHz Xeon made for that purpose. I have never overclocked a dual rig, so I do not know what the potential is there.

I haven't researched who offers what at the moment but, for dual rigs, I would start my research with Supermicro and Intel MB's.

Thanks!

I have been talking to someone from ZT systems.
He has been very helpfull.

i think you bring up a good point about expandaBILITY.

i think i would rather get a system i can expand than one that is at the end of its life cycle.

Does that change what i might get?

Mark

From that aspect you have a problem. As Intel rolls out new CPUs the mobo also has to change. Once you decide to change that then you start to rethink everything else.
That said the gear that targets the professional market does seem to have a longer usable lifespan. Businesses that may have 100s if not 1000s of computers running in racks don't upgrade them every 12 months unlike gamers. Investing in rock solid systems from companies like SuperMicro will give you a better investment over the long term in this business.

Bob.

Thanks Bob!

Shasta-

I have to say I got lost in all the options you're looking at. My (lone) thought for the day is to consider how you're really going to use this system and when the next time you're going to upgrade is. If you need the editing power for your business, then I think the consensus of the pro users on this board (I'm not one) is that time is money & get the best system you can afford.

If it's more for personal use, then perhaps you're on a different part of the price/performance curve. Are you really getting DOUBLE the performance for more than double the price? The $4600 system will crush the $2000 system now, but if you can't afford to replace that for 3-4 years, how will you feel the last couple years of that? If a $2000 system is pretty damn good right now & another brand new $2000 system purchased in 18-24 months (half your full-price replacement cycle) will crush the now "old" $4600 system, then your AVERAGE utility over the product lifetime is better with 2 x $2000 systems than 1 x $4600 system.

I'm not familiar with any of these rigs, so can't comment on specifics -- just throwing some food for thought in here. I've wasted too much money buying some theoretical future benefit that was N/A by the time I wanted to/could afford to use it. All of my stuff is personal use, though, so I don't see a huge benefit to being on the bleeding edge.

Brian