Douglas its a FUNNY story. The guy that preaches about copyright and shakes his finger at everyone else is caught using pirated software then is dumb enough to call up support and ask for help. You prove again you have absolutely no sense of humor. Call me a troll if you like, you're just a stuffed shirt with a giant ego that can dish it out, but you keep proving you can't take it. I remember when you weren't such a braggart.

And BB, I remember when you had something more to add to these forums than just pointless digs at Spot.

- Ray

www.undergroundplanet.com

First, a quick (political) aside with a point…

I could never figure out why it is that so many people place so many more demands on Israel than they do the Palestinians. Generally speaking, the rhetoric towards Israel is harsher and more critical than that towards the Palestinians. Then one day it struck me, more demands are placed on Israel because Israel is reasonable. After all, you can not expect to reason with people who are willing to strap themselves to bombs and then blow themselves (and innocent children) to pieces. Thus, most of the criticism is directed at Israel because we can expect them to respond to reason.

Recently, Sony has taken the stance that those who respond to BB’s unprovoked (and occasionally racist) attacks are worse than BB’s initial assaults even if the responders are merely trying to prevent their name from being sullied. This didn’t make any sense to me until I remembered the Israeli contradiction I outlined above.

As such, I am not going to waste my time asking BB to stop the unprovoked and unnecessary attacks. I will not ask him to stop acting as the self-anointed “forum police”. And I will not ask him to just SHUT UP! Why not? Because to the first, he will claim HE is being attacked. To the second, he will say I am the pot to his black kettle and, to the third, he will just titter about exposing my “true colors”. You see, there is no point in even trying to reason with him.

So, to everyone else, please, just ignore him. (Accept those who are directly attacked because, unlike Sony, I believe they have every right to defend themselves.)

Some day, someone at Sony will have the courage and good sense to end the problem once and for all. Until then, have fun with V6 and, please, just ignore the troglodyte.

**Edited to correct spelling mistake**

Well said, Matt.

I just feel sorry for people like Shawn, who started this thread. Here's a prospective Vegas user who asks a perfectly innocent and legitimate question, only to see his thread quickly degenerate into another mean-spirited flame war.

Wouldn't surprise me if this sends Shawn running from Vegas as fast as he could go.

Thanks for using Vegas Shawn, you made a good choice and we appreciate your business. Now go out there and make a movie (or a CD, or a DVD, or a web video...or all of the above), and let us know how we can help you as you go.

When you get to the wrap point we'd love to see a copy of your finished piece.

cheers-

Sony Vegas Engineering team.

You are so right. Its a shame a certain little clique thinks they can impose their view and everybody else is suppose to shut up.

A few days ago somebody thought it was cute to start referring to me as the angry guy. I guess speaking the truth about things gets under the skin of the prima donnas in this forum. Again, I cut through the bullsh... and reminded people you can't force a company to write plug-ins. Spot of course, as he always does with me, needed to be both dismissive and condescending.

"I see a lot of sour grapes in this forum, yet I'm often called the "angry guy", I simplly see things more clearly. That's a pretty subjective statement. According to *you*, you see things more clearly. But that may not be the general consensus.

In much of the rest of your post, you're correct."

The FACTS are these:

Its beyond simply my opinion. There ARE a lot of sour grapes in this forum recently. You don't have to look hard to find a handful of posters always whining about what Vegas doesn't have in the way of features some think it should.

I simply pointed out that you can't force any third party company to offer plug-ins. I further went on to explain when plug-ins are more likely to be introduced. Douglas needed to preach, adding nothing but fluff saying that Sony offered a SDK. Well surprise, surprise, so does just about every other software company.

So you see I don't object what Spot says or his right to say it, rather I object to how he and his little clique always try their best to attempt to discredit what I or anyone that dares to disagree with them say. So anytime Spot or his gang gets dismissive, I may use humor to show Spot or his gang in a light they don't liked shown in their face.

I don't know, I would think the average person would think it damn funny that they guy that endlessly preaches copyright laws gets caught deliberately breaking them himself.

I don't know, I would think the average person would think it damn funny that they guy that endlessly preaches copyright laws gets caught deliberately breaking them himself.

==============================================

When I was in college, I don't think I paid for any software. Most of us that are honest would admit to it. But, most of us would also agree that we don't do it anymore. Including me. Get over it. People change.

sn

BB: "I may use humor..."

It's never happened before, so when might we expect this to begin?

I never paid for any software in college either. Of course there were no personal computers back then - darn I feel old.

Shawn, two years ago I was in the middle of production of my first project, a documentary. When I say 1st project, that's what I mean---I'd done no short clips, no student films, no nothing. I was essentially a complete newbie.

Research led me to Vegas over Avid, Premiere, Ulead, etc. Everyone raved about its ease of use and essential stability. I also liked the price (admittedly it was less $$$ then, but I'd buy it again in a minute.)

So I took the plunge and have NEVER regretted ANY purchase less. It works like a charm.

Further, I spent a few months teaching myself Vegas before buying DSE's book, which was/is an excellent resource. Even without the book or Gary Kleiner's DVD set, which I also later bought, I learned enough about Vegas to get up and running. Is that possible with the other products I mentioned, or FCP? I dunno. I've never touched them.

My intention is to work as an indie filmmaker, not as an employee of an editing house or a indie cutter for others. Therefore, industry standard means not a damn to me. I like what works and what FLOWS, if you forgive a brief Zen/Taoist reference. Name brand crap means nothing.

Check my website for clips if you want. If you like what you see, Vegas was instrumental in it. If you don't like what you see, please blame my inexperience with filmmaking and Vegas, not the program itself!

I'm not knocking other programs, because as I say I have zero experience with anything but Vegas. All I can say is Vegas took a guy with no experience to a finished documentary in no time.

"So you see I don't object what Spot says or his right to say it, rather I object to how he and his little clique always try their best to attempt to discredit what I or anyone that dares to disagree with them say."

Just who are members of this suppsoed clique? I have read this time and again and just would like clarification who BB really has a problem with.

>>
"So you see I don't object what Spot says or his right to say it, rather I object to how he and his little clique always try their best to attempt to discredit what I or anyone that dares to disagree with them say."

Just who are members of this suppsoed clique? I have read this time and again and just would like clarification who BB really has a problem with.
<<

Who cares? Why not just join the growing clique of people who completely ignore anything BB has to say. Finding useful nuggets in his posts is at least as hard as panning for gold.

Rex, the reason I am curious is because there has been several times I have agreed with Spot and then get a backhanded comment from BB. Personally, I know I am not part of the clique as Spot and I have not always seen eye to eye on various subjects but I still have respect for the man. It also leads me to believe that the members of this "clique" that BB refers to are those that have had some sort of success in this idustry. Spot, Cline, Meyer, Gladwell, Bob, to name a few.

Looking back through old posts, BB hasnt always been this way. There was a time where he contributed more postively to the forum than he currently does. I think that's the reason for the "bitter angry old man" tag that he's been hit with.

I have no anger or animosity towards anyone on this forum and greatly respect everyone for anything they offer whether it be worklfows, plugins, or simply just friendships and conversations. Everyone here contirbutes something to this forum and I feel that many are frustrated that the BB that used to offer greatly to the forum and many wish he would return to do so.

You have no anger or animosity?

Darn, you sure could have fooled me. I simply call it like it is. Some can't handle the truth. There was a time when this forum was mostly free of noise. There was a time when it was rare to have 10 of the top 15 posts off topic. There was a time when a handful didn't have some need to be snobish, elitist, condescending and dismissive.

Over the past year this forum has become infested with threads about cameras, contests, trade shows, copyright issues, anything and everything except what this forum is suppose to be about. Vegas it seems more often than not is the minority topic.

You're right about one thing. I haven't changed. This forum has. I simply report on the happenings. As far as me returning to the days when I was more helpful, the days when I wrote tutorials, many of you said you benefited from, you can forget seeing any more anytime soon if ever. The clique destroyed that. You have a question, ask them. You'll get a bland, cookie cutter type answer. There's little point in me offering alternatives if everytime I do the same clique has some need to attack my answer. Just remember how viciously I get attacked everytime external monitors comes up. I'm not jealous of anyone's success. Remember, I retired at 41, over 18 years ago. I think its the other way around. I tried to help here not because I pretend to know more than anyone else, rather because I had the time to share what I did know. Now I use that time for other things. Can anyone blame me? I've seen many forums and newsgroups grow then prosper then start a march down that slippery slope to ultimately turn into just another noisy, spam infested mutual back slapping good old boys club where distent is frowned on, people get told read the manual or search old posts, when one or two elects themself as king. That's started to happen here. Well, it used to be a good forum. It had a decent run.

>"As far as me returning to the days when I was more helpful, the days when I wrote tutorials, many of you said you benefited from, you can forget seeing any more anytime soon if ever"<

I dont get it ......if you are not going to be "helpful", then what are you going to do here?
Just askin'

BB: "There was a time when a handful didn't have some need to be snobish, elitist, condescending and dismissive.."

Yes, you should stop doing that.

"The clique destroyed that."

BB, you sound like the little fat kid in school who refused to contribute because you were not included in the "in-crowd." So instead, you piss all over everything that doesnt pertain or benefit you.

If Spot and others bother you so much, why not ignore them? Refuse to respond and play the game. It seems more like you sit and look for the opportunity to make every issue and post personal.

The reason yo have so many off topics etc is because this forum has grown and matured and gained a lot of new members over the last year or so. Communities are not stuck discussing one thing. OTs about cameras, filming, and things that pertain to productions, deliveries, distribution are more on topic than you give them credit for. The way you spew, one would think that these forums are filled with "what did you have for breakfast?", "schiavo death: right or wrong?" or "BillyBoy: jerk or not?". Havent seen any threads like this. I know myself have posted something that was totally unrelated to Vegas, video, etc...But as you would have us think that these type of threads come up daily, even hourly.

Don't like the top 20 topics? Change it. Post something useful so that the "dribble" that is so unimportant to you moves down the page where you don't have to be annoyed with reading it (yet it NEVER stops you ever from posting in it.)

"It is in the character of very few men to honor without envy a friend who has prospered."

Aeschylus, Agamemnon
Greek tragic dramatist (525 BC - 456 BC)

When Vegas 6 is launched, new questions will show up.

Yep.

==>

Okay BB....

41 + 18 = 59

You're creeping up on 60. No offense, but if you're retired, spend some time with family, kids and grandkids. Get off the computer and go do the grumpy old man things you need to do. One of them isn't to keep pretending we're hurt if you go away. Truth be told, you bring nothing to the table without some sort of argument in it. If you do post sans argument, your post consists of "back when I was a kid, we didn't have microwave ovens..."

either put up or... well you know the rest.

As for where this topic was originally...

Dont you know Cheno, BB had to walk through 12 miles of 10 feet of snow and six feet of ce just so he could post here and brighten all of our days.We should be thankful because back then, he had to post before the sun went down and that was after workign in the fields for 12 straight hours at $.08 a day and $.02 of that bought him a hamburger and a soda pop.