The recurring theme that has repeated itself over and over is YOU Douglas and your supporters going out of their way, thread after thread to try to discredit anything I say, regardless the topic, regardless how minor our differences. Its getting old.

If you were just nitpicky and dragged out your magnifying glass everytime ANYONE said something you didn't agree with totally, then I'd simpyl write you off as an excessive nitpicker. That's isn't what's been happening. Week after week, you or your pals find some excuse to find fault with the opinion I've expressed in one or more threads. After a time, anyone would resent that. I'm no different. Heck, you've been doing it for well over a year now!

Here, in this thread you find fault with me saying if given a choice I would have cropped a tad more off the torso rather then hairline. A very minor, trival difference of opinion.

However, you simply can't let it pass. Instead you have to attempt to paint what I said as not following the 'rule of thirds' and go on to imply it wouldn't be right to add a lot of space above the performer's heads. I never suggested any such thing, yet you use words to suggest something along those lines. Again, you go out of your way to make it look like I suggested someone do something I didn't tell them to do. One more time... YES I resent you doing that.

Again in your last comments, by inference you suggest things I didn't say to do. Like you now using 'far out of the norm that it looks amateur' . I guess you meant to say amateurish.

So again, by inference, you imply I'm suggesting somebody do something "amateurish", so of course I resent the constant inferences others (mostly me) are offering amaterurish advice and you also by inference are so much more professional which is what I mean from the 'emanating from Utah' comment. Again, if my email is any indication, I'm not the only one that feels your constant pontificating is inappropriate. You share this forum with LOTS of knowledgeable people. Trying to silence opinions you don't like or attemting to make it look like somebody said something they didn't isn't very professional.

You see Douglas, that IS the problem I have with you. Done deliberately or not you seem to have an unquemchable need to correct opinions you don't agree with, especially if they are my opinions. Like I said eariler, over time, one naturally tends to resent it. Especially in a forum where different opinions is what makes the discussion. If we all agreed totally on everything then there is little point in having a forum.

You own words are the most telling: Lets continue to agree to disagree and move on. When do you think you can actually do that instead of seaching for posts I make to try and nitpick what I've said?

Along with that shaky cam stuff (ie "Law and Order" "reality" TV shows" etc).

The truth be known, and for what it's worth to you cinema history buffs, that "shaky cam stuff" actually started long before many of you were born (and long before Law & Order and reality t.v.). It started with the La Nouvelle Vague (French New Wave) in 1958. Two of the more well known directors from this movement were Francois Truffaut and Jean-Luc Godard.

You might be interested in learning more about this and view some of their films. Very enlightening!

In fact, Godard's Masculine Feminine is being re-released here in the U.S. You might want to keep an eye open for it.

I saw Masculine Feminine recently and didn't think this was exactly Godard's finest moment.

Afterwards I learned that his life was in 100% turmoil when he meade this movie, and it showed.

Some fine acting performances though.

About the rule of thirds: a very good basic rule. Those who truly understand it are also capable of seeing the extraordinary cases when something else would work better. This is not part of academic geometry, but about human perception.

It made me think of one composer (Povel Ramel) who showed music talent in his teens, so he was sent to a conservatory to learn all about music. He found himself chafing at the rigid forms and rules for how to compose music, so he couldn't wait to get out.

A few years later, he composed a piece that broke every rule he had learned. It sounded absolutely great.

I am thinking he could not have been successful in breaking the rules if he hadn't fully understood them.

In film and video, many new kids have appeared and said "the old fogeys are clueless, I'll do it my way." If they then didn't have an innate understanding of what was behind the old ideas, they couldn't go beyond them or even match them.

Hey guys, did "Jackass: The Movie" follow the rule of thirds?

Seems like most of the review comments so far have focused on visual composition which I think is secondary to the audio, especially in this case. The audio works well IMO, and at least one of the selections should resonate with the intended audience. The video elements support the audio nicely. Not sure if I would have had Phil Collins in there, twice.

JL

I think Jackass, the movie broke all the rules of human dignity. Still it was a funny movie in places, crude and vulgar in others. Oh alright, is was crude and vulgar 90% of the time, title kind of gives it away. So were others, like Porky's, Animal House, South Park to name three.

Back to the commerical, yes the audio portion was done well which is why probably nobody was critical of it. It seems the author understands since he asked for a critique, and surprise, some of us actually did CRITIQUE it. Simplistic comments only saying they thought is was wonderful or whatever praise they heaped on missed the point of what the poster asked for...namely, what if anything was "wrong" with it, ie how can I make it better.

While some here for sure are super thin skinned, to his credit the person asking for the critique was not offended when he actual got critiques.

Others apparently think the only right response is like answering "the right way" when your wife asks two loaded questions: honey, does this dress make me look fat or how was dinner? Sometimes, the truth hurts. However when someone asks for a truthful critique, that's usually what they want.

Yup, it does through most of the movie. Or appears to by fast forwarding through scenes. (I've got it on my Dishnetwork recorder)
Good catch on the audio, JL. I hadn't realized Collins was in there twice.

Wow - lotta comments...
so I guess I'll throw in some, as well -

First I liked the spot- it was professional looking and the VO and music mix were fine. I don't think any client would fault you for it.

Now - biggest mistake?? It's only 29 seconds long -whoops (easy fix - but UNBREAKABLE rule - a thirty is 30 seconds to the frame - no exceptions

Next?? Well (and now we're getting into style... I'd prefer a more exciting concept - "Tired of the same old radio?" or "Grow UP - listen to radio like you mean it" or "Who understands honey, better than a Bee?" or something else...

Next?? (Style again) - you've got enormous names here - but not everyone knows them by picture - I'd make those titles Zoom back from huge full screen to where you've got them and I'd make them semi transparent at the start of the zoom.
I also think I'd add a SFX whoosh to each new title ala Fox News.
Voice over guy is too middle of the road - for this kind of music and a name like B 100, I'd get a very sexy - close miked woman like Allison Steele or Demi Moore ( i KNOW you can't get them - neither can I - but that's how you ask - and then don't get hung up - let your talent be her OWN sexy self.

I'd also mention just WHAT B-100 is... I know it's obvious but I can't imagine the station manager wouldn't want to hear "B100 on your FM dial."

And I'd end the spot with a gag of some sort to cement the product brand name into the viewers mind - (thinking along the SEGA ad where the guy just screams SEGA! maybe.... (character voice) Buzzzzzzzy BEE 100 or "More music - less BeesWax"
All the above is concept.
The Vegas part is fine but you're definitely good enough to start stretching.
If you're looking for work and this is a sample, try doing it again and reach for absurd - amazing - infuriating - hysterical -
your best bet is when the guy watching it immediately yells up the hall - "Bert - get over here - you've GOT to see this!"
What you've done is technically excellent - but it ain't THAT spot.

It doesn't mean that they will let you DO the absurd concept - sometimes, but not generally - It DOES mean that they'll remember you. You're already good enough to hire -
Remember:
They hire you on extremes - then they force you to make a spot like the one you've presented.

Maybe it's a local vs national thing
May be, the two stations I submit to arepretty podunk (Amarillo, TX and Roswell,NM)...and there is indeed dead air at times...that is when I can force myself to watch them (to check out the competition's work).
Randy

We never run over 29;15

Vicmilt
While I agree that a 30 is SUPPOSED to be a 30, if I delivered a 30 to the Fox affiliate and the CBS affiliate that most of the clients in my area use for advertising, the last 1 second would be history....they ALWAYS cut the last 1 second. Same goes for any cable insert commercials in our area. A 30 is a 29...
David Bird

Now - biggest mistake?? It's only 29 seconds long -whoops (easy fix - but UNBREAKABLE rule - a thirty is 30 seconds to the frame - no exceptions
I guess it depends on who you deal with then because the two local network affilliates I sometimes submit to (CBS and NBC) want 29-30 seconds.
Randy

Huh???

What do they do with the last second?
TV time is rigid - shows that start at 10PM - start on time.

Maybe it's a local vs national thing, but I've shipped maybe a thousand commercials during the course of my career. a 30 is a 30 -
but I may retract this on Monday, after I call my time buyer...

Even in the bad old days of film - we'd ALWAYS faded up a half second, and faded out a half secone (playing length 29 seconds), to allow the projectors a little slack, but the total length of the spot was 30 seconds

The beauty of working with Vegas is that shortening the spot by one or 25 frames is easy, and the viewer won't know that he's seen it sped up, nor hear that it's slightly sped up. So, if the client wants 00:29:15 or 00:30:00, or whatever...Vegas can nail it in seconds.

Acutally guys whenever I end the spot with a jingle like this one (as opposed to a music fade), I always leave it at 29 and a few frames. If not it seems it's dubbed with the jingle cut off at the end by the tv stations. So, this was intentional. We have never had an issue with the stations locally here in Philly.

Thanks again for the comments

Guys...one additional question if anyone would like to respond:

I do not have a beta recorder. So, I need to submit to a local house to have the actual broadcast dubs made. Can someone tell me the best file format to render. Do I just put the spot on a data CD and deliver to the house to make dubs?

(I have done this once. I sent them a .mov file dubbed in full animation mode/720X486/29.70). The file was about 625mg. It looked great. Is there a better way to do this. What is the format/status of most spots as they are dubbed to tape for the tv stations?

Unless you want to carry gear over, rendering to QT in animation or other lo/no compression format for print is best. If they have a Matrox Media Server or Pinnacle 'Caster system, they won't even need to print.

Overall I thought the spot was pretty good, I do alot of this type of CMs where you have to put it together with footage & images from all kinds of different and uncontrolled sources. Sometime the $$$ and time indicate just how much polish these get.

Wish I had a website to post some of my spots, so I could hear all your comments. "The 2 Phils caught my eye and ear"

The 30 sec thing. In my broadcast days I must of played, digitized and dub 2 million comercials, (abc, nbc, fox, WB, UPN, Ind) The hard rules were to make the spot the time it was alloted, if more than :30 we cutout the fades, if still too long the end was chopped, if less than :30 we put in black so timing in & out of Network/programs ran true.

All CM playback systems are automated these days, so if you see your work is getting upcut or downcut I would call and complain. If anything it should get you another airing!

Phil