Newbie to Vegas

Marchgale wrote on 12/12/2006, 1:00 PM

I'm a part-time wedding videographer (since 1981!) and recently took delivery of new Sony V1E camcorder - came bundled with Vegas 7.0. Up until now I've been happily editing weddings with Pinnacle Studio 7/8/9/10, filming on Sony VX2000. I'm going to be using the Sony HDR-60 HDD unit for tapeless recording.

At first glance the Vegas scene looks disparate and not very well integrated (there's Vegas 7, then there's Cinescore and finally DVD Architect). Is the procedure to first edit in Vegas, then bring the whole project into Cinescore for music, and then out again into DVD architect for DVD authoring? Do I even need Vegas at all if I can edit in Cinescore? (notwithstanding that as I understand it Cinescore will not support HD yet).

Apologies for the dumb questions, but it's probably time I "grew up" in the editing world and in view of the great reviews of Vegas I've been reading I'd be grateful for any advice.



BrianStanding wrote on 12/12/2006, 1:18 PM
Welcome to Vegas! Boy, after Pinnacle, you're in for a treat! Vegas is by far the best editor I've ever used. And welcome to the forum, too.

Actually, I would not recommend editing in Cinescore. That's intended primarily as a music soundtrack creation application. However, Cinescore works as a plug-in to V7, so you should be able to stay on your Vegas timeline. The preferred workflow would be this:

1. Capture and rough-cut edit in Vegas
2. Use Cinescore as a plug-in to create your soundtrack
3. Close the Cinescore plug-in and complete your fine and final cut in Vegas, including adding regions for DVD subtitles on the timeline
4. Render out MPEG-2, AC-3 and subtitle files from the Vegas timeline.
5. Author the DVD, including menus, playlists, etc., then burn the master DVD in DVD Architect.

That's about it! The online manual's pretty good, and you can do a search on this forum for anything that gets you stuck -- many of us have seen it all before.

Happy editing!

vicmilt wrote on 12/12/2006, 1:45 PM
Welcome home, Marchgate...
we've been waiting for you.

You've got three great programs there.
Vegas is for Video Editing and sound mixing - it's complete as it stands.
Cinescore is for making music - it's amazingly easy to do.
DVD Architect is where you put your mixed movie onto a DVD - you can even insert chapters and all other kinds of great stuff.

If you have any questions - someone here will be able to help you.

Marchgale wrote on 12/12/2006, 2:05 PM
Guys, thank you, your enthusiasm is infectious!!

I've printed out the manuals and am keen to get going, big learning curve... just one question - will Cinescore support HD and will it seamlessly integrate into Vegas when downloaded?

Thanks again for the welcome!

zcheema wrote on 12/12/2006, 2:26 PM
Cinescore is more related to making an audio music track and the visuals are for reference only. You can use CC in V7 as a plug in and the audio you create is added to an audio track..

So CC does not need to support HD as it is basically an audio program
Grazie wrote on 12/12/2006, 2:36 PM
Cheemie? CC? Isn't that CS? Or is that CinesCore?
DavidMcKnight wrote on 12/12/2006, 3:36 PM
Welcome, Marchgale. There are many former users of Pinnacle Studio on this forum, I daresay almost all of us are here because of Studio's unstability. If you never experienced that, you're lucky.

But no matter - there are some amazingly talented and prolific members on this forum - movie and TV folks, commercial and corporate pros, authors, musicians, trainers, full-timers, part-timers, hobbyists - an incredible bunch to be around.
Tech Diver wrote on 12/12/2006, 4:43 PM
I too am a former Pinnacle victim and look back at those days with great disdain. I switched away from Pinnacle when I could no longer tolerate its wretched instability. Besides that, as I expanded my consulting business, I could not create the video compositions that I envisioned for my clients due to its very limited video and audio features. The only good part about Pinnacle was Hollywood FX, a really great 3D compositing plugin. When I switched to Vegas my life change and my blood pressure returned to normal.
jrazz wrote on 12/12/2006, 6:28 PM
By the way, after you install Cinescore, go to Insert and click on generated music. That is where you will see the Cinescore plugin pop up to add your music to the video footage. Also, since you are a fellow wedding videographer, you will definitely want to purchase the Cinescore theme pack entitled: Pass the Ring.

j razz
Marchgale wrote on 12/13/2006, 3:27 AM
Thanks again for the useful tips.

A question. I've installed Vegas 7 as bundled with my camcorder, and downloaded the latest update, 7.0c from the internet. Then I downloaded the 30 day trial of Architect 4. Thing is, it seems the only way to get Architect 4 onto my system when the 30 day trial is over is actually to purchase the whole Vegas7+DVD system from scratch. Is this right?

If so, it seems strange that Sony won't allow a separate purchase of DVD Architect 4.

Fair enough, I suppose, as so far I've paid diddly squat!

So, If my flexible friend gets its well deserved caning in the weeks ahead, would I be best advised to uninstall Vegas and start again with the purchased discs or would it be okay to re-install the new program over the top of what's already there?

Thanks again!
Chienworks wrote on 12/13/2006, 3:31 AM
If you have Vegas, there is an upgrade to Vegas + DVD.
Marchgale wrote on 12/13/2006, 3:45 AM
Thanks Chienworks,

I called Siren Technology in Manchester, they said the upgrade would only work if I had a previous version of Vegas (6 or lower).

Would the upgrade work if Version 7 is already installed?
Marchgale wrote on 12/13/2006, 3:50 AM
I've just answered my own question - the upgrade purchase won't accept my present serial number!
Marchgale wrote on 12/13/2006, 4:08 AM
In for a penny, in for a pound - I just ordered the full package and Cinescore from this website. From now on I can concentrate on editing!
elvindeath wrote on 12/13/2006, 9:00 AM
Ahh... how time flies. It was just last year when I was crowing about finally jumping ship from Pinnacle Studio. Admittedly, I use Vegas only for personal home video work (not for any commercial endeavour), but in about 6 months of use, I have had exactly one crash in Vegas (which I don't believe was Vegas' fault - but the fault of an app running in the background), versus about 2 - 5 PER SESSION with Studio.

As far as I'm concerned, Pinnacle Studio should not be sold. It is not a final product. When you burn a disk, wait all night for it to render and finish and then cross your fingers that hours of hard work aren't wasted because of some inexplicable render or burn error, you're not dealing with professional software.

Vegas has been an exponential improvement for me (though I wish the titling was better) ... and I'm sure you'll love it.
Steve Mann wrote on 12/15/2006, 11:57 AM
Is your version bundled with the camcorder "Vegas" or "Vegas Studio"?
Tattoo wrote on 12/15/2006, 1:13 PM
Welcome to Vegas. There are many Pinnacle Studio refugees here. Studio definitely has a editing style that's easier for brand new editors to grasp in my opinion, but it doesn't take long to catch on to the differences and take it well beyond. I really got sick of saving my work every five minutes and having the audio & video get out of sync.

Probably the hardest thing about Vegas is that it doesn't tend to give you a certain effect pretailored to do something. There are presets available, but for the most part you get a more "scientific" approach and a lot of setting options. For instance, where Studio might have an effect called "Wacky Bubble Distorter," in Vegas you use a Height Map function and a shaded circle. While it's a little harder to figure out initially, you soon realize that you have near infinite control over that Height Map and could use any shape (or video source or whatever) you want. Hopefully you don't use any such effect in too many wedding videos, but you get the idea.


Marchgale wrote on 12/15/2006, 2:27 PM
The version bundled with The Sony V1E camcorder is the full Vegas 7.0, which can be upgraded to 7.0c from this website. So it's the full version, but the serial number does not appear to qualify for the upgrade to Vegas 7 + DVD, which is why I've now ordered the boxed packages at the full asking price, plus Cinescore.

As for Pinnacle, I managed to get Studio 9.4 working pretty well. Yes it did mean saving work every few minutes and it was prone to sudden, occasional random crashes, but its general ease of use and the SmartSound facility meant that I could knock out a wedding video fairly quickly and painlessly. When I first tried out Studio 10 it was a complete disaster and crashed if you so much as blinked, so I went back to version 9.4 but they're now up to version 10.7 which might be a more stable platform and it's meant to cope with HDV.

Then I bought the Sony V1E plus Hard Disk Drive HDR-60, which might, but probably won't, work smoothly with Pinnacle, and now, having invested the money, reckon I might as well invest the time it'll take to get used to Vegas 7.0c, which is expressly designed to work with this recording equipment. From what everybody's saying I'm not going to regret the move - I just hope that editing wedding videos or anything else with Vegas will soon become as intuitive as Pinnacle, which for all its faults is one heck of any easy program to use when it works in a stable fashion.

Tattoo wrote on 12/16/2006, 6:28 AM
The time you lose due to learning a new system (Vegas) will rapidly be eclipsed by the time you save by not having to constantly save and/or reboot. I gave up on Studio at version 8 so I wouldn't know from experience, but somehow I doubt that attempting to handle HDV would fix verion 10. Sounds like more trouble to me.

I would attempt to contact Sony Madison Software about upgrading to the Vegas + DVDA (& Cinescore) version. Even though you've already paid for the full version, I recall folks having success with similar situations in actually getting a rebate from Sony. What I recall is folks that paid full price for whatever reason when a discounted version was available. I don't know why your (free) full version of Vegas wouldn't qualify for a discount upgrade price, so I suspect that it's just a limitation of the website that doesn't recognize your serial number. Contact them via voice or email and I bet you get some $$ back. There's plenty of other video/audio stuff to spend that money on.

Marchgale wrote on 12/16/2006, 5:21 PM

Thanks for that, I'll certainly give it a try on Monday and see what happens - nothing to lose!!
DrLumen wrote on 12/16/2006, 8:17 PM
"I too am a former Pinnacle victim..." Well said, well spoken.

There is a bit of a learning curve at first. However, like was said previously, you will have the ability to control nearly every aspect of your video and/or effects - if your so inclined.


IMHO, there should be a 12 step program for people with the pinnacle addiction! My name is Keith and have been without pinnacle for 408 days! :-D

intel i-4790k / Asus Z97 Pro / 32GB Crucial RAM / Nvidia GTX 560Ti / 500GB Samsung SSD / 256 GB Samsung SSD / 2-WDC 4TB Black HDD's / 2-WDC 1TB HDD's / 2-HP 23" Monitors / Various MIDI gear, controllers and audio interfaces

Steve Mann wrote on 12/17/2006, 12:07 AM
My name is Steve and I have been free of the devil called Pinnacle for more than a thousand days.

I will reach my thousand day milestone from Premiere addiction soon.

That reminds me, I haven't done a backup of my projects for a few months...... Vegas is just so darned reliable that I forget about doing a backup once in a while because even though Vegas has never crashed on me, hardware still does once in a while.

AlanC wrote on 12/17/2006, 4:19 AM
My name is alan and I've been free of the Pinnacle curse for 2 years 11 months.

I thought Pinnacle had stopped supporting Studio but I have just checked their website and they are selling 10.5 with a Plus Package that includes a microphone and a Green Screen?

All the benefits of Pinnacle Studio software plus the additional flexibility of a hardware capture device complete with analog and digital inputs. Studio Plus packages include a microphone and green screen for creating professional video presentations.

Then underneath the advert is the statement:

Pinnacle Studio 10.7 update now available

I wonder what happened to 10.6?

mr.beebo wrote on 12/17/2006, 6:58 AM
It crashed
Marchgale wrote on 12/18/2006, 11:47 AM
I've just heard back from Sony Software - to qualify for the upgrade the existing serial number has to be from a Vegas 1,2,3,4, 5 or 6 version. A Vegas 7.0 version doesn't qualify for upgrade.

The good news is that my full version boxed packages arrived today - so now the fun can begin!