No new audio features in Vegas Pro 11???

cchoy wrote on 9/9/2011, 9:04 AM
Correct me if I'm wrong, but I didn't see any updates to the audio features in Vegas 11 AT ALL?

With the release of ProTools 9, I think it is more important than ever for Vegas to be able to keep up in the audio world.

Particularly frustrating in Vegas 10: Stability. ON THE SAME system I can run 3 Speakerphone instances in ProTools no sweat. Why does Vegas struggle with a single Speakerphone instance?

Is Peter the only one left sticking up for us??? Go Peter!

Wish list:
Proper surround routing (why does it disappear with busses?)

OMF import/export (COME ON ALREADY! This is supposed to be a pro-audio solution!) I understand that AAF is better, but it is not as widely used in the industry right now.

Updating the way envelope points are created with events

Different color markers

Better stability/plugin support

Anyone else have any thoughts?



SHTUNOT wrote on 9/9/2011, 5:00 PM
I think the phrase "beating a dead horse" describes it all best.

vegasmon wrote on 9/9/2011, 11:51 PM
Yeah..what ever happened to the cinescore replacement ?? Why does'nt Sony work out there differences with smartsound and adapt their plugin ??

musicvid10 wrote on 9/10/2011, 12:50 AM
* VST support on the Surround Master.
* Full BWF export.

Has Vegas no wish to compete in the broadcast audio market?
Hanging in there with Vegas Pro 8 and a bunch of outboard apps.
The horse ain't dead yet, but she's sure lost her whinny.
imac wrote on 9/10/2011, 8:13 AM
i think it's clear sony do not want to compete on the audio front and are pushing all resources at video

it's a shame because having both together is a unique product

i've been using vegas since v1, but today the end has come as i just can't stand the instability any more.

the end

there is something fundamentally wrong with vst or third party plug handling that persists through the versions and i expect in v11

after todays frustration when returning to a veg project after painless experimentation in other apps, i resign from vegas audio
FuTz wrote on 11/2/2011, 7:34 AM

Stuck in V7 here for same reasons...
gwailo wrote on 11/3/2011, 2:07 AM
actually they took away a feature I liked.

Since I've been using vegas from before the mixing console was introduced, I got used to using the 'mixer' window to do everything i needed.

But now Sony has apparently put some effort into making the "mixing console" look better, they changed the "mixer" window into "master bus" / preview bus (only)

I've always considered the 'mixing console' to be rather useless and clunky for my post-audio work and I used the 'mixer' window exclusively since it was smaller and could do everything i needed.

I could add busses / effects / change routing all in the 'mixer' window

Now that they've changed it to "master bus" they taken all the power functions out of the 'mixer' window, so I am forced to use the 'mixing console'

I guess I will just have to accept change... :(

Does anyone know if there's a way to make the VU meters tall enough to be useable?
Geoff_Wood wrote on 11/3/2011, 3:00 AM
I also prefer to avoid the Mixing Console window. Historically , not requiring that view was considered a major BENEFIT of the Vegas workflow. But some people didn't get the point and demanded one, because they imagined you need something that looks like a physical mixer in a DAW.

Therefore I also miss not having busses and AssignableFX showing in the Master (Mixer) window. Maybe if could have been (or could be !) added as a switchable option....

However a MAJOR plus is that Grouped Tracks are now Solo-able and Mute-able. Oh, for a Volume Envelope on them as well ;-P

pwppch wrote on 11/3/2011, 8:16 AM
You can resize the regions of the mix console. if you hide the peak meters, the meters will appear similar to the old mixer view.

You can hide those areas that you don't want or need.

You can size and arrange the mix console to be very close to the layout of the old mixer view.

gwailo wrote on 11/3/2011, 8:57 AM
yeah it's not a big deal really, and I will get used to it...

I've gotten everything close to the way it used to look and taking up almost as little space.

I just don't like the forced wasted space caused by all the toggle buttons on bottom left and the list of tracks and checkboxes in the upper left.

Here are some graphical suggestions for the Mixing Console in Vegas 12 :)

1) an option to hide the track listing and toggle buttons - (just like you can hide the track headers in the timeline)

2) unsquished VU meters - I definitely don't need VU meters on every track, just the master would be fine. It would be great if you could give an option to simply line up the master VU meter beside the master peak meter instead of squished on top.

3) A couple extra ticks would be nice at -20dBFS and -10dBFS would be great for lining up tone and levels so it's easier to compare directly to the scaling on a digibeta machine meters.
pwppch wrote on 11/3/2011, 1:35 PM
@1. You can hide the list and region buttons in v11.

cchoy wrote on 11/3/2011, 2:09 PM
I also prefer the mix window to the mixing console-- why would you take features away???

If you're going to strip down the mix window so that it's basically useless, you might as well eliminate it (something I feel is a bad idea.) Maybe the mixing console can have a "classic" mode or something?

So ProTools 10 just came out. They implemented regional gain that starts in the middle. They also have a real neat feature that loads all of the audio in to RAM-- how cool is that?

They also have per item envelopes.
They also integrated OMF support.
They also have integrated many of the features that I like about Vegas.

Not to mention the surround routing works the way I want it to.

The reason I used Vegas first was because it was waaaay ahead of the curve. Now it's really falling behind. I'm still using V10 -- sounds like V11 isn't stable enough to adopt, and it doesn't sound like V11 has anything audio wise that V10 doesn't. I started on Vegas 4, then got 5. I skipped 6 and got 7. There was nothing happening between 7 and 10 so I waited till 10. Looks like I'll have to wait till 12 or 13 before there's any more features I want.

Also. I've been asking for this since Vegas 5.
HUI support anyone?
We have a Yamaha DM2000 in the big room. It's not going to change anytime soon. Vegas doesn't work with it. Big minus.

I had convinced most of our engineers to switch to Vegas, but they've become frustrated with the limitations, and many of them are unfortunately moving back to ProTools. Real shame. For now, I'm sticking with Vegas-- with the hope that someone over there has the audio folk's backs.

gwailo wrote on 11/5/2011, 2:37 AM
cool, thanks peter - now that i've got the mixing console stripped down, everything fits better


I dumped protools around the time of Vegas 5 because some driver kept crashing my machine.

I am also very frustrated that vegas has severely stalled in its audio development, but before switching back to protools they would have to fix the following. Please let me know if they have already fixed the things in my list:

1) having to choose a mono / stereo track when dropping in files
2) when moving a clip on the timeline and you drop it on top of something else, does it still destroy/ erase what it landed on? - can that "feature" be turned off
3) when moving a clip around on the timeline does it still bitch at you if you somehow didn't pick up the fade at the same time, or does it just move the bloody fade like it should
4) can you make fades by dragging like it's done in vegas - no more fade window...
5) can you now drag and drop into the timeline instead of using their silly import process
6) have they finally figured out how to render a file without doing it in realtime
7) can you drop in mp3 files onto the timeline or does it have to convert everything
8) is the video track still restricted to only a few types of video
9) can you add more than 1 video to the timeline

It's hard trying to find these answers from pro-tools people or even their website because they have already accepted the pro-tools way of doing things and don't even see things in my list as actual negatives.
cchoy wrote on 11/5/2011, 12:47 PM

I'm going to check with my friends over here, but for now, here's what I think I know to be true about ProTools 10. Seems like they're developing features like mad over...

The main reason I'm sticking w/ Vegas for now is I still think the GUI is less cluttered and more elegant. For basic audio editing and sliding around, Vegas is still the best (IMHO)-- however, for MIXING and FX and SURROUND (all things I need to do), it is falling behind the curve. Errors with the real time pitch bending/time stretching are especially frustrating.
SO-- ProTools 10:

1) From my understanding, mono and stereo can live on the same track (I haven't seen this one, but this is also a HUUUUUGE issue for me.
2) They've done a massive upgrade with crossfading-- imitating Vegas' style but still not quite up to par-- HOWEVER, I've been told this issue has been addressed.
3) no more yelling here
4) see 2
5) drag and drop implemented
6) yes -- you've got to search around a little on how to, but yes
7) mp3 supported -- I think it converts it automatically for you
8) video track is slightly more robust, but still sucks
9) not sure about this one, but I doubt it.

In conclusion, ProTools is 80% there. Most of my initial gripes have been resolved. I still hate them, though.

@sonic foundry people
How much money would I have to raise for you to implement HUI and OMF support?
I'd totally do a KickStarter Campaign.

gwailo wrote on 11/5/2011, 2:41 PM
thanks for the info cchoy...

But it looks like surround mixing is only available in the silly expensive HD version

I have no problem paying more for vegas to improve features / make it stable, but paying $9999 for the minimum protools HD version is a bit nuts.
rraud wrote on 11/5/2011, 6:35 PM
"How much money would I have to raise for you to implement OMF support?"
There is no amount of money you can pay SCS for OMF support. It's quite obvious really they're sole reason is to aggravate me.. A 'user' since Vegas-1 (or was it 2... before video) Looks like I won't be a user much longer though, with the neat advancements in SloTools.
LarryP wrote on 11/6/2011, 11:58 AM
Soloing a bus track no longer mutes any tracks assigned to the master bus like it did in V10.

I hope this is a bug and not a feature.


Edit: Missed the other thread on this topic.
Nice Lady Productions wrote on 11/11/2011, 5:19 PM
I'm a bit shocked that Sony hasn't dealt with the external hard drive (3TB USB 3.0)/audio issue in Vegas 11. This issue is present in Vegas Pro 10 and has been reported to them by myself and others, but no response or fix in their latest version.

The issue is that if you pull a 48, 000 Hz, 24 Bit file onto the time line from a 3TB external drive (mine is USB 3.0, but even as USB 2.0), it doesn't play properly. If I pull that same file from my desktop onto the timeline (or a smaller USB 2.0 drive): no problems. The file itself isn't corrupt (Windows Media plays it perfectly), it is just Sony Vegas that plays it with distorted static or cuts out the sound completely.

Sony has been aware of this bug. The fact that they didn't deal with it before releasing 11 demonstrates to me that they aren't taking resolving software bugs seriously. I ended up asking for my money back for Vegas Pro 11.
Geoff_Wood wrote on 11/11/2011, 8:00 PM
Um, is this a universal problem, or just one on your system attributable to other factors, such as USB 3 drivers, some other system throughput issue, or even AV ?

I can play a 48/24/S event directly from a USB 2 HDD with no problem at all !

DavidMcKnight wrote on 4/24/2012, 4:56 PM
I can confirm the 3TB ext drive problem, and Sony is aware of it as of December. Interestingly, Sound Forge plays the same file on the same drive just fine. Was this problem introduced in V10? Meaning, will V9 play the file OK? I haven't tried that yet, assumed that since neither V10 nor V11 would play it that it would never play and we didn't have 3 TB USB 3 drives back when V9 was current (that I know of anyway).