"Normalize" Music for Render?

Soniclight wrote on 3/21/2010, 6:35 AM

I do my music creation, arrangement and editing in Steinberg Cubase SX, export as .wav.

Problem is that when I import it into a Vegas (8) project and render it out as an .avi or .wmv there is a distinct change in volume. I don't want to bump up the dBs in Vegas to avoid distortion, but the result is that:

Playing both in Windows Media Player, the .wav file alone is louder than its sister in the video.
And naturally, ditto for the video's eventual Flash version done with On2 Flix 8.

Is this as it should be and besides just fiddling around by ear, is there a way to normalize the audio in Vegas so that volume is preserved at original .wav level?

Probably missing some very "duh" thing here, so my apologies if a dunce-ian question:)
Thanks.

Comments

farss wrote on 3/21/2010, 6:55 AM

Vegas will preserve the levels at the original wave unless you do something to make it do otherwise.

If you feed the same audio into three encoders and when played back the volume is different one of both of two things is happening.

1) The encoder is doing something either normalising or compressing.

2) Don't forget each player has its own volume control, that could you 'duh' problemo.

If you want to adjust levels in Vegas but not clip do this. R Click the media and under Properties tick the Normalise button. Take note of how many dB gain it shows. Untick the box. That's as much gain as you can add before you will clip.

Perhaps that isn't enough to makeup for your problem then consider maybe turning down the one that's too loud.

Hope some of the above helps.

Bob.

Soniclight wrote on 3/21/2010, 7:38 AM

Thanks, Bob. I'll look into it.

I don't think it's the "duh" player volume issue since I don't touch it between playing both versions (WMP keeps whatever one sets globally). The .wav isn't too loud, it's the vid that's too quiet :)

Truth is since I'm a Cubase guy, I've rarely done much music tweaking in Vegas for I like the music to be done-with by the time I put it in a .veg project.
Just basically plop and play. Maybe gotta pay a bit more attention...

farss wrote on 3/21/2010, 8:14 AM

Kind of out of ideas here, hard to know without seeing.
I'd suggest you check the encoder settings for the audio in the WMV encoder. Keep sample rate the same, make certain you're encoding as stereo too, a mono mixdown can drop levels sometimes for complex reasons.

Bob.

Chienworks wrote on 3/21/2010, 9:36 AM

If your imported music is louder than the rest of the video then drag the level of the music files down on the timeline. Hover the mouse pointer at the top of the audio event and it will change into a hand with a pointing finger. Drag down and a blue line appears. The farther down the drag the line the lower the volume will be. When it sounds right compared to the rest of the video then you're done.

A-Scott wrote on 3/21/2010, 10:30 AM

There are many places in the signal path that you could be affecting the gain of the audio. I'm assuming you've looked at the obvious possibilities (track gain, bus gain, master gain). Also check the effects for unexpected meddling.

Finally - and this is my guess - check your pan mode. Right-click on the pan slider and make sure it is set to "Add Channels (0dB Center)" or "Balance (0dB Center)".

The other pan settings will lower the gain at the center position.
(Check the Help file under Panning Modes.)

Soniclight wrote on 3/21/2010, 11:56 AM

Thanks for further responses. I never touch pan for I've noodled it all before importing the audio file. The issue is also not about volume or gain between music or audio parts within a project; just as stated in the beginning, wanting to maintain volume of original .wav. imported.

Will have to play around with this some more until I get it right :)
NRN.

Laurence wrote on 3/21/2010, 1:24 PM

Back in June of 2006, I posted on the script forum asking if there was a script where you could click on an audio event, run the script and have it normalize that event. John Meyer immediately modified the "normalize all" script so that it would do what I want and posted it. Here is that thread with the script:

http://www.sonycreativesoftware.com/forums/ShowMessage.asp?ForumID=21&MessageID=469188

All you do is click on the audio track you want normalized and run the script. Too cool.

VASST's Ultimate-S script has a "normalize selected" function as well and these days I just use that since I already use it for so many other things anyway.

Along the same lines, another thing that is really useful is a brick wall limiter so that you can normalize a voice-over and a music bed together. There is a really good free one http://www.kjaerhusaudio.com/classic-master-limiter.phphere.[/link]

While you're there, you should download all of their free audio plugins. They're excellent quality and free. You can find them here:

http://www.kjaerhusaudio.com/classic-series.php

The classic master limiter is my favorite, but they are all good. Not just good for free, but good period. Of all my audio plugins, the Kjaerhus Classic Master Limiter is my favorite and it was free. It sits on my Vegas master audio bus all the time.

Their paid programs are pretty good as well. I have two of them and they're excellent.

A-Scott wrote on 3/21/2010, 1:43 PM

Whether you touched it or not, the default pan mode might not be what you're thinking. I suggest taking a look. The centered "un-touched" position might be reducing gain depending on what pan mode is being used.

Try rendering the project as simply a .wav and see how it comes out. If the level in the resulting .wav is reduced then SOMETHING IN THE PROJECT is doing it. How much gain are you losing? That could be a big hint.

jrazz wrote on 3/21/2010, 3:19 PM

Just another thought, but have you tried removing the audio fx from the track itself in Vegas? There are two or three placed there by default. You may just want to remove them and see if that makes a difference.

j razz

Soniclight wrote on 3/21/2010, 5:16 PM

OK, more good pointers. Thanks :)