OT: Beware of the Blackberry Storm

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Coursedesign wrote on 12/8/2008, 8:52 AM
The iPhone email has not been the success story as hinted and RIM has the corp world and world governments email down well.

Ummm, the iPhone passed Blackberry sales last quarter, so I wouldn't buy RIM stock right now.


And iPhone internet performance was marginal --- but the browser was a clever presentation app. ;-)

Where was it marginal? Not in the pro review I saw recently, where they got about 250 kbps on the Blackberry and about 750 kbps on the iPhone.

The browser perhaps? Analyst Dan Frommer says, "The iPhone's Web browser is easily more powerful than any browser RIM offers."

Another metric for "internet performance" is coverage. In current ads, AT&T claims to have the largest coverage of all 3G networks.

I can't vouch for AT&T, but I wouldn't rule it out. And $30 for unlimited data isn't bad.

T-Mobile has the least coverage (because they've got the newest network and it takes time to build out), with coverage primarily in the largest metropolitan areas.

Verizon has the best coverage in pre-3G, and that will be important to people in rural areas especially.

Funniest comment seen:

"After using an iPhone, all other phones, including Blackberry, feel like the unholy spawn of a Dymo Labelmaker and a pinball machine."

:O)

The "Dymo Labelmaker" part refers to the chiclet keys on the BB, they are indeed similar.
The "pinball machine" part I don't quite get, but owners should know.

Coursedesign wrote on 12/8/2008, 9:10 AM
Breaking news:

Airlines worldwide give out free iPhone stands for movie viewing

Who'da thunk?

rmack350 wrote on 12/8/2008, 10:13 AM
The pinball machine comes from the way you hold it with two hands and work the keys. As for Dymo labelers, the last one I used had a dial and a squeeze trigger. They have buttons now?

I don't think I'd worry about Rim's stock. There's room for a handful of manufacturers out there and Rim has some compelling things going for it. There are lots of corner cases where the Iphone is a non-starter and I think most manufacturers can chip away at it.

The main thing going against the Iphone is lack of choice and incompatibility with some corporations and govt agencies that have strict requirements.

I have a friend in SoCal in the aerospace industry who just can't have a phone with a camera, and he's required to wipe the phone of data before leaving the country. The Iphone is out of the question for him but there is a cameraless BB available and the BB is pretty secure and easy to wipe of data.

I have a relative at the census bureau who is also restricted in what he's allowed to bring onto the premises. An Iphone is out of the question for him too.

Here at our office we have a few people traveling overseas a lot. They passed on the iphone too because it was going to be a hassle when they traveled abroad. That may have been remedied by now with the 3G version.

And in my own case, I was an ATT customer who would have bought an Iphone eventually but I switched to Verizon 2 weeks ago to get my ailing parents onto my cell plan. ATT didn't cover their home and probably never will because it's a canyon spurring off from I5 on the Grapevine (Course, you know that area). The highway has coverage but the canyon doesn't and I see no reason for ATT to ever add coverage for 100 homes up a canyon.

And of course some people only need cell service.

And of course some people see Apple marketing as kool-aid.

The point is that there will always be room for competition in this market. The important thing is to figure out what features you really need in a phone.

Personally, I want an unlocked GPS.
Coursedesign wrote on 12/8/2008, 10:26 AM
Good points. All these high tech phones are a pain for security in more ways than one.

The question is, how much longer will there be any "just-a-phone" mobile phones available?


What's an unlocked GPS?

Is this what you're referring to? (being able to use your phone's GPS with Google Maps, like on the you-know-what?)

apit34356 wrote on 12/8/2008, 10:29 AM
iPhone pricing---- Wal-Mart

What will all those anti-"Wal-Mart" iPhone owners going to do....... did Apple "sale-out" '-) the Dems and the labor party? ;-)

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Wal-Mart to Sell iPhones, But at What Price?
Posted Dec 08, 2008 12:09pm EST by Aaron Task in Investing, Electronics
Related: AAPL, WMT, MSFT, RIMM, TGT, NOK, FDO

Apple's iPhone is one of the few products selling well this holiday season and Wal-Mart is one of the few retailers where people are shopping these days. So some marketing geniuses have decided (ta-da) it makes sense to sell iPhones at Wal-Mart stores.

Actually, it is a very good idea for both firms: Apple is seeking to dominate the smartphone apps market like Microsoft dominates PC software. Meanwhile, Wal-Mart is looking to cement its reputation as the essential retailer — and not just in bad times.

This deal should help both companies pursue those goals, although various reports say the iPhone won't be available in Wal-Mart on Dec. 28, which may cannibalize some holiday sales.

The key issue of contention right now is the price, with many sources refuting the "$99 iPhone" story, as AppleInsider.com details.
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The iPhone bowser is a good design if not great, but the lack of Flash in the beginning was a bad decision not to work it out with Adobe.

With China manufacturing needing new work, Apple can re-structure their production deals and volume. Cheaper iPhones, but keeping profits high!

rmack350 wrote on 12/8/2008, 10:53 AM
The locking or unlocking is dependent on the service provider. On my Curve Google maps seems to use cell towers for positioning but it still shows traffic and things like that and it can follow along as I drive with text directions. It gets a bit lost if I'm in not in range of several towers.

The curve also comes with Blackberry maps and that one can use the GPS so it seems to always know exactly where I am. But no traffic info. Generally, I'd rather have the traffic info because I already know where I am.

Verizon wants an additional $10.00/month for their VZNav service. In the SF bay area I just don't need it and I'm not going to give them another 10 bucks. Maybe if the Iphone leaves it's GPS unlocked then that'll encourage Verizon to do the same. It appears that the provider can probably provide a key to programs to use the GPS and I'd rather pay once for a program and a memory card full of data.

Google maps actually gets the job done most of the time.

Rob Mack
rmack350 wrote on 12/8/2008, 10:57 AM
LOL!

That's a universal holder, not an Iphone holder.

Rob
farss wrote on 12/8/2008, 12:09 PM
"Who said here it was a "dud"? Robert?"

Not you. Still uncertain how you figure I implied you did say that.
The original post and linked reviews did.
Perhaps I should be more careful who I appear to be replying to?

Then again threads meander all over the place, reading every post still doesn't help working out who is addressing what, even changing the topic doesn't seem to keep things in logical order. None of this paragraph applies to you (Grazie) though, just a general observation.

Bob.
rmack350 wrote on 12/8/2008, 1:30 PM
When I moved to Verizon I got my folks a very basic phone with big keys, no camera, and no Bluetooth. Works great. Still not quite simple enough.

Biggest problem is that they press the buttons on the side of the unit by accident.

There are plenty of basic phones available, I think. They aren't going to go away as long as the data phnes have a $30-40 dollar monthly premium.

Rob
rmack350 wrote on 12/8/2008, 1:33 PM
Unfortunately, we get a choice of two forum views. I use the threaded view which makes it seem like people are responding to specific posts. Others use the Non-threaded view which lets you see the contents of lots of posts but makes it difficult to know who's being responded to.

Rob
David Settlemoir wrote on 12/8/2008, 5:45 PM
Another opinion of the Storm:

http://www.jkontherun.com/2008/12/blackberry-stor.html

My plan is to pick up a Storm and replace my BlackBerry 8830 World Edition after Verizon completes the purchase of Alltel next year. At least I will look at all the phone options then and try the Storm out before I pass judgement.

One of my associates has an iPhone and half the time when he calls me I can't understand what he is saying or it drops the call. He has enjoyed showing it off to everyone, and it is a pretty cool gadget just not a very good sounding phone (at least on the receiving end.)

David
Coursedesign wrote on 12/8/2008, 7:47 PM
If your iPhoned friend comes through with crappy voice quality (or frequent dropped calls) he's got the first generation. I thought this was unacceptable, so I stayed put.

The 3G version has excellent voice quality though, both in and out.

Version 2.2 of the software supposedly fixed a "dropped call" problem that I never experienced, but that may have happened elsewhere in marginal areas.

For serious cheapskates, buy an iPod Touch and Truphone 4.0, a free program from the App Store, and make calls via Wi-Fi.

See http://www.pcworld.com/businesscenter/article/155081/get_an_iphone_on_the_cheap.html:

British Voice over IP vendor Truphone has come up with a clever way to get hold of an IPhone on the cheap: Buy an iPod touch MP3 player and add software to turn it into a phone.

Hooo-hoooo!

For the rest, there is always the iPhone 3G, which already has 30% of the U.S. market, and is experiencing a higher growth rate than the others.

IF Google keeps up the Android development, they will have a contender together with Symbian and iPhone OS X.

Microsoft seems to have been caught napping in this space, as it's been years since they launched any major improvements in WinMo. I don't think they understand this market, but I'm willing to be surprised.

Next step from MS: *Vista Mobile* Taaa-daaa! Using lead-acid batteries that clip to your belt, one on each side to prevent you from keeling over.

apit34356 wrote on 12/9/2008, 7:40 AM
Course, how about $99 ;-) one of many articles circling around WallStreet... ;-)

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Reports: Wal-Mart to sell $99 iPhones
Jacksonville Business Journal

Related News

Rumors of $99 iPhones coming to Wal-Mart Stores Inc. gained momentum over the weekend with reports that the retailer has been training its employees on how to sell the popular Apple Inc. devices.

Bloomberg said it talked to employees at five Wal-Marts (NYSE:WMT) in California who said the phones would be in stores by the end of the month.

Cupertino-based Apple (NASDAQ:AAPL) hasn't commented on the reports.

One way that the company may bring the price down on the devices that has been suggested would be to make the cheaper models with four gigabytes of memory. It now sells versions with eight gigabytes for $199 and with 16 gigabytes for $299.

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Coursedesign wrote on 12/9/2008, 8:39 AM
The 99 dollar rumor was 100% speculation, as was the 4GB idea.

But the Wal-Mart part was correct, however it ended up being $197, beating the other stores by a whopping $2, perhaps as a minor contribution towards the gas needed to drive to the nearest Wal-Mart store.

I can imagine the price negotiation between Apple and Wal-mart: irresistible force meets immovable object.

Apple is used to getting its way, and Wal-Mart is used to telling all their suppliers how it's gonna be.


Apple bought 75% of the world's flash production in advance (for use in iPhones and iPods). I'm glad I didn't have to make that decision. My knees would have been clattering against each other day and night.

apit34356 wrote on 12/9/2008, 10:04 AM
"But the Wal-Mart part was correct, however it ended up being $197" ? What source?


"Apple bought 75% " This is an old spin from the early days, its more true that Apple bought the market share of specialize flash memories with on board arm cpus and DSPs to reduce chip count and increase performance----a smart engineering move and harder to copy. ;-)

Coursedesign wrote on 12/9/2008, 10:38 AM
"But the Wal-Mart part was correct, however it ended up being $197" ? What source?

[/link=http://www.ilounge.com/index.php/news/comments/iphone-3g-coming-to-wal-mart-for-197/]iPhone 3G coming to Wal-Mart for $197[/link]

You’re correct that they bought 75% of the world's production of flash chips for mobile device use. My goof.

I don't think on-board ARM CPUs and DSPs were part of that deal though, as those are manufactured by very different companies.

apit34356 wrote on 12/9/2008, 5:20 PM
"I don't think on-board ARM CPUs and DSPs were part of that deal" Samsung manufactures a complete line, as well as most of all the big chip plants.

More on Google's Android "Team" expansion.

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Sony Ericsson, Vodafone Back Google's Android

Article Tools Sponsored By
By REUTERS
Published: December 9, 2008

Filed at 3:04 p.m. ET


SAN FRANCISCO (Reuters) - Fourteen of the world's largest mobile phone and chip makers, including Sony Ericsson, Vodafone Group Plc and ARM Holdings Plc, joined the Open Handset Alliance on Tuesday to support the Android mobile device platform developed by Google Inc.

The new members' pledge to back the Android software is a significant feat for Google in the mobile phone industry, as its T-Mobile G1 phone takes on rival Apple Inc's wildly popular iPhone 3G.

Sony Ericsson, a joint venture of Japan's Sony Corp and Sweden's Ericsson, said on Tuesday it plans to release a mobile phone that uses the Android software in mid-2009.

"Android is set to become a significant application framework for mobile phones," said Ericsson's head of mobile platforms Robert Puskaric in a statement.

By joining the Open Handset Alliance, each of the members commits to developing applications and services for mobile phones and handsets using the Android platform or designing Android-compatible mobile devices. Taiwan's Asustek Computer Inc, Toshiba Corp and Garmin Ltd also pledged their support, bringing the total number of companies in the Open Handset Alliance to 47.

Both Google and Apple have wooed developers to create applications for their mobile devices, but Apple keeps a tight grip on the iPhone's hardware and operating software. Google's Android is open to being changed by outside developers.

(Reporting by Jennifer Martinez, with additional Reporting by Sinead Carew in New York; editing by Gerald E. McCormick)
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If iPhone does the WalMart $99 thing, I think ---- it will crush the mid range phones for sure and that is a massive volume to have and produce!