OT: "?" for folks with Audio/VO expertise...

VOGuy wrote on 3/2/2006, 12:05 AM

Hi Dave.

Since this is, after all, the Vegas forum, I'll try to structure my comments so they might be of interest to Vegas users. Vegas is, after all, an audio program too, and many V.O. pros use it. A good place to hang out is the Yahoo groups "voiceovers" group.

Your voice quality is fine - I know many people who make their living from V.O. work who started out with much less " voice" than you have.

I get calls and emails, usually about one a month, from people who always wanted to get into voice-over, who now regret never having done so when they were younger. "Is it too late,now that I'm 60 (or 30, or 40 or 50, etc.)? The answer, of course is "No", it's never too late, but there is no way to recover lost years, doing something other than what you want to do.

Voice-over is very much a learned skill. If you want to learn v.o., yes... start now.

The hardest part is learning to sound like a human being - something I still struggle with. The second hardest part is learning how to deal with rejection. There are some people who just love my work, and some who can't stand me (and of course, most somewhere in-between) -- and I still can't figure out why, or pedict who, in either case.

In terms of specifics, I would back off just a bit from the shotgun mic - to add a little "life" to the recording. Then... practice, practice, practice. The more you practice you do, the better you'll get.

Good Luck!

-Travis

FrigidNDEditing wrote on 3/2/2006, 1:00 AM

rejection - ahh - NP - I get that ALL the time, in some form or another - and have learned (as long as I don't forget) to just take what I'm told and either listen to it or blow it off depending of course on the source( and if they cut the check ;-P )

Thanks for the backoff tip - I'll try it, That closet is none to large :)

That VO DVD that VASST had talked about a guy who read the NY Times aloud everymorning for practice (I may not go that far), but there were a LOT of good notions on how to improve ones skill.

Thanx again.

Dave

Steve Mann wrote on 3/2/2006, 2:17 AM

You asked for it, but no expertise here....

You sound like you're on a roller coaster. Your pitch is up, down, up, down. You start every sentence with a low pitch, it goes up in the middle, then back down at the end. You aren't reading, you are reciting. (Listen to a bunch of kids reciting the Pledge and you'll hear the same rythmic pitch pattern).

Also, the mic you are using is very bassy. Does it have a low cut-off switch?

Finally, you need a spit/pop screen to soften the spray of your "SH" sounds.

plasmavideo wrote on 3/2/2006, 6:34 AM

Dave,

I can't access your voice file to listen to it due to internet acess to certain things blocked here at work, but I can echo what Travis was saying related to rejection, etc.

I was in radio for years as DJ, production person and engineer before moving to TV. Along the way I've learned the following:

Some folks will hate your presentation and some folks will love it. It's also very material dependent, so you need to be flexible in the way you do your reads. Don't lock yourself into one voice style. These days, sounding more like a real person and less like "an announcer" is very important, but also work on that "announcer" voice for the times it will be necessary.

Also, you may find yourself in the position of being "today's darling" and three weeks later the same client will suddenly dump you for the next darling. That's part of the business, and nothing personal, so don't let it discourage you.

Remember that your voice style may not be right for a particular client's need and take the rejection with a smile. I used to get depressed when I was passed over for a particular spot or presentation, but I learned after listening to the final product that my voice would have been totally inappropriate for the message that was being presented. Again, it wasn't a personal dislike of me, I was just not appropriate for that read. Now, I've learned to even say "no, I don't think that would be right for me" and saved myself and others a lot of time and disappointment. Now-a-days I'm so heavily involved in the engineering/tech support end of things and the video and audio editing end of things that I rarely do any voice work, but it's fun to do when it comes my way.

Good luck, and I'll try to listen to your example when I get home today.

Tom

Guy S. wrote on 3/2/2006, 8:08 AM

Not bad at all!

As others have said, the key is to practice, and here's a suggestion on how:

Read a sentence several different ways.
Excited... Professional... Calm... etc.

Read a short sentence (or a phrase within a longer sentence) several times, putting the emphasis on a different word each time.

If you are serious about this, you'll need the appropriate equipment. There are many ways to go, but these suggestions will get you pointed in the right direction:

Microphone -- MXL makes some good, low cost studio condenser mics in the $50 - $200 range (www.musiciansfriend.com). I've owned a RODE tube condenser which was awesome, and I just got an ElectroVoice Cardinal ($200) which is excellent. It sounds great and is somewhat directional, so it picks up virtually no background noise.

Pop screen -- an absolute necessity.

Microphone pre-amp -- you can use a mixer, but if you don't need the extra inputs, consider a Behringer tube preamp ($130 at misuciansfriend.com). My personal mixer is an Allen & Heath, and it's excellent. Mackie is also one of the best. I use an inexpensive Yamaha at work, and it's mediocre -- mic inputs overload and distort easily.

Compressor -- I use a Behringer compressor/limiter/gate to process the audio before it goes into my computer. This compressor is one of the best I've and is one of the key ingredients to getting my voice to sound bigger than life.

Audio processing in Vegas -- Vegas has really useful audio tools for compressing and equalizing audio.

Once you get a mic, you'll need to try some different setups to fine tune its placement in the room and your mouth-to-mic distance to get the sound(s) you want. The only equalization I use for recording is rolling off the bass, which frees up some headroom so I can record a hotter signal.

Your voice gives you a lot to work with, so go to it and have fun!

FrigidNDEditing wrote on 3/2/2006, 8:27 AM

Everyone so far - thx for the responses and so on, much appreciated.

N19093 - I can hear exactly what you're talking about, however, I didn't know that was a negative thing necessarily - at the end it got a bit much, but this was a VERY rough read, and I was not breathing as I should have ( should have heard it right off - I had a lung full of air and didn't ever seem to go below half, HA HA HA ) I guess I just considered it emphatic overall - I'll not necessarily stop - but it's certainly another way that I can "do" my voice and something to practice on.

Thanx

Dave

plasmavideo wrote on 3/2/2006, 8:45 AM

Well, I was able to download it after all.

Dave, you do have a nice voice to work with, especially for the type of read you did. That's very similar to the read I did for our church's campaign last fall. I agree that it is a tiny bit "sing-songy" but I'm being picky. It's hard to do emphasis at certain points without the read sounding a bit that way.

I'm not familar with the VAAST learning tool you are talking about, but I'm sure it has some good tips. It sounds like you'll be more suited for narration or quiet commercial work, but that's just one opinion. Would be nice to hear your Monster Truck and Tractor Pull voice :->

I'll echo some of the other comments about eq'ing out some of the bass and boosting upper mids a bit. It does sound like you worked the shotgun a little too close.

I've been using a Behringer mic processor here at work for basic EQ and gating and compression prior to the mixer and then recording into Audition in the computer for post processing the takes. At home, I just go from the mixer into the computer and post the audio with Sound Forge or Cool Edit. I generally use a several db boost at 3 to 4K, about 3 to 4 db of processing in Wave Hammer and a gentle amount of the RGC High Frequency Stimulator (free direct-x plugin) to enhance the presence. Your results may vary depending on the mic. We have a beautiful high dollar AKG at work, and I have a low dollar bargain basement mic at home. I'm getting ready to order a new Audio-Technica for home, though.

Good luck! That talent would be a nice addition to your business bottom line, and a plus for clients for one-stop shopping.

T

EDIT: Ditto the following comment on "tube sound warmth". I don't like the sound of the "tube warmth" enhancer in the Behringer at all.

Coursedesign wrote on 3/2/2006, 8:51 AM

Just an alert on using tube mic-pres with tube mics (or warm non-tube mics).

There is such a thing as too much warmth.

It is not pleasant.

And to those who said they weren't able to predict what people would like: you're in good company. I have spent many thousands of hours researching if somebody had found a way to predict this, and the results from both the top psychologists and the very top market gurus are all the same: it cannot be done.

The good news is that there is solid real scientific research showing that when something is popular in one place, it is far more likely to be popular elsewhere.

Bush Sr. used this very skillfully during his reign. He went to two small towns and delivered a local speech that wasn't covered anywhere else. In one town he said, "X is a bad idea," and in the second town he said, "X is a great idea." Afterwards, his scientifically trained pollsters collected the results, and he then went to two larger towns and said, "X is a great idea" (if that was the winner) in one of the towns, and "Y is a much better idea than X" in the other town, and so on to a growing population, gradually refining his message based on what people were most willing to buy.

Last month, Hallmark had a surprise hit among their Valentine cards. The same card ran out of stock in nearly every store across the U.S.

Same concept.

Bob Greaves wrote on 3/2/2006, 9:56 AM

The intonation rhythm and sound of a voice is often context determined. This means what works in one context may not in another.

For example, there is a drone in your voice (starting low ending low while speaking slowly) that is very common in fundamentalist or evangelical circles for radio preaching. (I used to be an announcer for a National Radio Bible Teacher). So this may or may not be a strength or a weakness depending on your intended audience - but it tends to cause the person unaccustomed to radio preaching to shut it off. It works when preaching to the choir and congregation over the radio but not the neighborhood.

You are using the wrong microphone. A sure SM 58 would do better, but it too is the wrong microphone. I recommend you look at a Studio Projects C1. When kept at eye level a constant distance from your mouth of about 12 inches it picks up most voices very well.

Today the narrator speaks more quickly except when drama requires a different pace. We also, as a culture, prefer the voice that sounds as if it is professional but conversational. It should not sound as if you are reading a script. Reading a script slows you down and alters your intonation from how you sound when you speak articulately but spontaneously.

You are very brave asking for constructive criticism. That tells me you have what it takes to survive the learning curve.