I will second what 4eyes is telling you. Just hook up your PS3 optical output to your Denon AVR-1708 optical input and then assign that input digital audio port to the same source (the PS3) as the PS3 HDMI input. You do that in the Denon Setup.

In the PS3 setup make sure that you specify the optical output for audio and not HDMI.

Really. That's all there is to it.

And - don't waste your money on Monster HDMI cables. For short runs the $15 ones will do just fine. If and only if you have a real long run then you might need a large conductor HDMI cable.

Thanks guys. Followed your advice and it works great. Too late on the wasted money though. :(

Live and learn. :)

We went through this issue when doing support training for a client's HDTV product line. Home theatre boxes won't pass through digital audio from the HDMI cable. Solution was to run a separate audio source to the box (it could be a separate digital audio run)

This may have changed with later HDMI standards. I can't remember why the boxes had such a stupid limitation but it's common. Unfortunately, it was also an obscure factoid that was easy to miss.

Now I'll read the other two responses and probably get a good refresher from everyone.

Rob Mack

"optical input and then assign that input digital audio port to......"
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The problem with the optical output is that the audio is somewhat restricted in bandwidth. You will not get the newer audio versions through optical. This has been one of my larger complaints with the PS3.... it does not have the 5.1 analogue outputs which really restricts your movements on the audio front. If you don't own the newer, (much more expensive) AVR's with HDMI audio, then you're out of luck. The players have the analogue outputs and I can't understand why they didn't do it with the PS3. And generally speaking, it's also been my major complaint with the entire BD line. These machines are literally all over the map. If you get into blu ray, then you HAVE TO, HAVE TO sit down and carefully read the manuals to make sure the machine you get is going to line up with your expectations and your existing equipment. Each machine is wildy different from another in what they can and can't do.

Any chance you can return the Denon AVR and spend a few more bucks??

"The problem with the optical output is that the audio is somewhat restricted in bandwidth. You will not get the newer audio versions through optical".
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That is an interesting point. I have a Denon 3808ci sitting at home waiting for me to hook it up to my PS3. You can find the spec for this receiver here:

Denon 3808ci

Questions for blink3times:
1. Would you hook the PS3 to this receiver via HDMI?
2. If I do, will I get all those fancy new audio versions with this setup?

Jeff

Hi Blink,

I wish spending a few more bucks was an option. Unfortunately the amp, speakers, 52" TV, cables, hardwood floors, paint, texture, a/v cables, etc. etc, have put us way over budget. I'm going to have to live with the audio limitations for now. What really chaps my hide is the lousy service at Best Buy. As I mentioned, they tried to defend the first mistake by saying I should have specified my intended setup. So when I purchased the amp I thought I was crystal clear. "I'm going to run the audio and video for the PS3 and the cable box through the amp via HDMI." I should have known the blank expression and reluctant nod of the head from the sales associate was a bad sign. I would return the amp on general principal but frankly I'm tired of messing with it all. I just want to curl up on the couch with some popcorn and start enjoying some movies (with limited audio options).

In the meantime, I have placed Best Buy on probation. If I can tear myself away from the new TV long enough, I may send them a nasty-gram as well.

The first problem is Best Buy. Next. You need a HDMI 1.3 capable receiver otherwise you will not get audio via the HDMI cable. Onkyo has some receivers that will do this. The Denon 3808ci will also handle this. Before buying anything to do with AV I always spend some time with the very knowledgeable folks at www.avsforum.com , there are people there that will give you the right answer. I don't think Deep Color should be a concern until there are displays capable of producing it and content encoded in it.

As far as cables I'd check out RAM electronics. I have a couple of their cables and they are very good quality and cheap.

"I always spend some time with the very knowledgeable folks at www.avsforum.com "

I second that!

The AVS forum is full of people with heavy experience in these areas. It's also where you will find BD/ Toshiba employees and insiders.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/index.php?

Scroll about 1/2 way down and you will see the HD DVD/Bluray areas. EVERYTHING you EVER wanted to know about hd dvd/blu ray is there.

In fact GOSHEP...

The rep for Denon can now be reached again on the Avs forum (lots of company reps sign on to AVS to talk and answer questions). You may want to ask him a few questions:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=986622

Here's the dealio with most of this stuff.........

Half the problem is with the HDMI spec.....more so the "copy protection" pitfalls of DRM. The higher 96Khz digital audio can not be digitally outputed from the device it's being fed to, to prevent you from digitally copying the high resolution audio. You only really have to worry about this when you're playing back DVD "AUDIO" format discs, and HD/Blu-Ray discs that have 96Khz and higher sampling rates and use uncompressed lossless audio like MLP . Dolby Digital and DTS audio will be fine, since they are lossy audio formats.

Now on the AVR side of things....The cheaper models will have an HDMI "Switch" function. Which means it's nothing but a "switch". It does not take the digital audio on the HDMI input and process it for 5.1/7.1 surround playback thru the receiver. It just switches it from the input back out to an output when you select a certain input on the receiver. On the higher end AVR receivers it will process it and play back the 5.1/7.1 audio thru the receiver. So when buying a surround AVR receiver you have to check if the HDMI inputs are just "Switched" or have "Processing" capability. I'm guessing your Denon only had "Switching" capabilities. So you will have to use the digital Optical connection.

I have a Harman/Kardon AVR-645, which is one of the more expensive H/K model receivers, and this one has audio "processing" capabilities and thus it will playback the digital audio on the HDMI cable thru the receiver. They also have less expensive models that only do the switch function.

http://www.harmankardon.com/product_detail.aspx?cat=REC&sType=S&prod=AVR+645

There is also an AVR-745 which is one step higher than the one I got. That model does video "processing", where my AVR-645 only does video "Switching". For video "Switching" is usually the only thing you need, since your HD TV will usually do any of the video processing. Thus if you wanted to upconvert 480p to 720p...etc....that kind of video processing.

So anyways, I have a PS3 and I run the HDMI out from the PS3 to the HDMI input of the H/K AVR-645, then I run the HDMI out of the H/K to my Plasma TV for the video. The H/K receiver will process the audio in surround and additionally pass the video out to my Plasma, so that I can enjoy Guitar Hero III in all it's glory.

I also agree with the AVSforum suggestion.....I'm a member :-).

i find it VERY STRANGE that you don't get audio through the HDMI cable on that receiver. I picked up a Sony STR-DG510 for less then 1/2 the price of that Denon & the audio goes through the HDMI.

What pisses me off is that after I bought the HDMI cables & went to hook it up for him, I found you that you can NOT have analog audio go through the receiver to the TV via HDMI. and vice verse (HDMI a/v in on the receiver, analog out). The whole point of buying that was to eliminate switching sources on several different devices just to watch a movie to TV and it didn't help at all.

From what I understand, it's a "copy protection" thing. bunch of BS imho.

Best Buy/Magnolia dropped the ball on so many levels. At the time, we were prepared to pay whatever was necessary to accomplish what we wanted. After explaining exactly what we wanted, the aforementioned amp was presented as the solution. For me, it was a bonus that it was one of the lower priced Denon amps. I figured at that price point, the more expensive models merely had higher output or 7.1 (which would have been overkill for our 300 square foot "theater". I felt like I had done a pretty good job of researching what we needed and what would work best for us. I never thought I'd need to know the details of every amp. I had hoped that the guy selling them would've been knowledgeable enough to point me to the right product for the job. BAH! I'm content with the optical cables for now. Next year I may upgrade the amp and move this one into the computer room or hock it. I'm just tired of re-wiring and fiddling and most of all of dealing with half-wits who care nothing of the level of service they provide (or don't provide).

As for DRM. Pfft. They ought to spend their time and money pushing for tougher penalties for those who break the law rather than screwing with those who obey it.

I bought the Sony STR-DG910 7.1 receiver and I've been quite pleased with it. It does audio over HDMI and has remote microphone which auto-calibrates the 7 speakers and the subwoofer. It lists for $499 but I got it from B&H for $349.

THF states: What pisses me off is that after I bought the HDMI cables & went to hook it up for him, I found you that you can NOT have analog audio go through the receiver to the TV via HDMI.
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Sadly, the ability to upconvert audio from other sources to HDMI is also one of those capabilities relegated to the fine print of the user manual. I am, however, surprised that you would want to send audio from your receiver to the TV. Usually the receiver would provide a higher quality sound. Most folks with this set up would use their TV simply as a video monitor.

David

"What pisses me off is that after I bought the HDMI cables & went to hook it up for him, I found you that you can NOT have analog audio go through the receiver to the TV via HDMI. and vice verse (HDMI a/v in on the receiver, analog out). The whole point of buying that was to eliminate switching sources on several different devices just to watch a movie to TV and it didn't help at all.

From what I understand, it's a "copy protection" thing. bunch of BS imho"

Yeah, the DRM stuff they're doing is a bunch of B.S. and only causes more headaches for those of us trying to connect our components so that it's both simple to control and we are able to get the best quality audio/video out of the system.

The 1st problem I had connecting my system via HDMI was with the video. I had my Panasonic DVD player connected to the H/K receiver and the H/K receiver HDMI to my Panasonic plasma. I was receiving and processing audio but my video was all screwed up. If I connected the HDMI, of my DVD player directly to my Plasma then the video was fine. So I had to assume the problem was with the H/K receiver on passing the video. So I called H/K tech support where they informed me I had everything connected properly, and they suggested it was most likely the Panasonic DVD player in that the player probably didn't properly support the HDMI "pass thru" switching function.....which again is needed due to copy protection B.S. So I called Panasonic Tech Support.......and asked them if they knew if my DVD player supported the "pass thru" function for HDMI. They had no idea of what I was talking about and couldn't help me in the slightest. So after I bought the Sony PS3, I connected that the same way as I had the Panasonic DVD player originally.....Low and behold everything worked properly and the guys from H/K where right.

So here again, the benefit of HDMI is so you can eliminate a lot of the cords and get the best quality.....but instead, I had to run more cords because the Panasonic DVD player did not support the proper pass thru function. So on the Panasonic DVD player, I had to connect the Optical digitial audio out to the H/K receiver and then the HDMI directly to my TV for video.....because the copy protection causes these problems and it's up to the electronics developers to ensure they properly implement the functions to avoid the copy protection pitfalls. The thing that pisses me off is that I bought the H/K receiver because it had HDMI connections and I could simplify my setup. So I pay extra money for this function, and then someone like Panasonic doesn't do things right on their end and I can't use the stuff I paid extra for.

I am, however, surprised that you would want to send audio from your receiver to the TV. Usually the receiver would provide a higher quality sound. Most folks with this set up would use their TV simply as a video monitor.

that was what I ended up doing. They only have two speakers on the receiver, so it's stereo, just like the TV, so I (at the start) didn't care. But because of the DRM, the input on the amp needs to be changed & the input on the tv needs to be changed. Originally it was going to go all in the amp & to the TV on a single HDMI out. :(

Just checking out AVR's because I plan on upgrading as well. But from the looks of it ONKYO seems to be the weapon of choice for HD DVD/Blu ray (something about a LFE bug on Denon machines)

There a guy on the AVS forum that wrote up an extremely detailed FAQ on the ONKYO 705... give it a read... it may help you to understand Denon as well.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=935808

That you need monster800 cables is a bare faced typical best-buy lie. Best-buy sells HDMI cables for $99 the exact same of which come FREE with the Sony $99 DVD player and come three in a packet for $39 at Costco. You have been taken. RETURN ALL YOUR STUFF to Best-buy and start again.

http://riteav.com/

Another source for good and cheap cables.

I have a 50ft run of component cables ($15) going from living room to editing room and they work just fine.
HDMI cables and converters (DVI to HDMI) are also very reasonably priced and work well.....

Teaktart

p.s. my one and only experience with Monster cables were that I could not get one of the cables off even using a pliers and eventually it broke off....never again will I pay too much for nothing gained.