David, I had a lot of fun there in Sacramento and met a lot of great videographers too!

Here is something I forgot to ask. Are there any historic, old, nice church buildings that are worth going to see? For that matter, any other historic buildings that we should go and take a look at?

Thanks

j razz

Definitely eat at The Palm on Second Avenue.

Ate there back in 1980. Best steak I ever had.

Churches:

Old Trinity Church, end of Wall St
St Patricks Cathedral: midtown, sth avenue maybe???

BTW Never Call 6th Avenue "The Avenue of the Americas" like on th street signs. Sure sign of the uninitiated.

There's a Protestant church in nearby Park slope, Brooklyn. Sorry, I forgot the denomination, But it is loaded with incredible stained glass windows designed by Louis Tiffany. Wonderful to see. Google it.
Actually Brooklyn is celebrated (by Whitman, I think) as the city of churches. Would be worth researching it.

Historic
Fraunces Tavern in Wall st area. Washington stayed there. The cloisters.

Have a great time.

jrazz,
There are more great historic buildings in NYC than you can shake a stick at. I recommend a very strong stick, because there'll be something to shake it at on practically every block. I suggest teak or oak.

Anyway, generally speaking, the farther downtown you go, the older the city gets. So where you go will depend on what era in history you want to see. The Lower East Side Tenement Museum is cool if you want to see how people lived a hundred years ago: http://www.tenement.org/ And there's the places others have already mentioned. Then there's Wall Street. Trinity Church was already mentioned, and it's at one end of Wall St. so you can see both.

If the weather's nice, take a stroll across the Brooklyn Bridge and have lunch at Grimaldi's pizza then walk the 1/2 block to the Fulton Ferry Landing and be amazed at the veiw of lower Manhattan. (The view is even more spectacular at night when the city and bridge is all lit up.)

Grand Central Terminal (it's not "station") is interesting too.

The "Flatiron" building (actually the "Fuller Building) on lower Broadway is another famous building.

City Hall and the "Tweed Courthouse" are worth a look. The Museum of New York is now in the Tweed Courthouse but it got there after I left NYC.

South Street Seaport is fun and has some good shops. One of my favorite little restaurants, The North Star Pub used to be there but it seems to be gone now. Still, there's tallships and shops and restaurants.

If you're into history at all, check out Ric Burns' massive documentary, "New York: A Documentary Film."

And if you like reading, you might want to read Jack Finney's "Time And Again." It's a time travel book where the hero goes back to 1882. It's a mystery, but the main attraction is the descriptions of the city itself and what it's like to live there back then. It's very well researched and if you read it you'll have a different (and I think *better*) perspective on the older parts of the city. Here's a link to it on Amazon: http://tinyurl.com/q3juq (A lot of the book takes place in Grammercy Park, which is also a great place for a stroll. The book also deals extensively with the Tweed Courthouse and the general City Hall area.)

The reason why, in my opinion, being at least a little familiar with the city's history is important is that without it you're just seeing a bunch of buildings and you may as well be in *any* city. It helps you see the city as more than just a breeding place for Starbucks Coffee stores. :-)

Fred

PS: As touristy as it seems, I think the Statue of Liberty is a great trip to take. It also stops at Ellis Island. (By the way, despite the statue's association with New York, it's actually in New Jersey waters, so NY and NJ share the money it brings in.)

PPS: If you eat at John's Pizza or Grimaldi's, don't panic if the pizza looks too well done. The bubbly, burned parts are, in my opinion, the best part. Also, even if you like pizza with toppings, I recommend you get at least one that's plain. That way you can really taste the pizza itself. And the pizzas are so thin that you can eat a lot more slices than you expect.

Two more things:

1) Houston St. is prounounced "HOUSE-ton" not like the name of the city in Texas. Houston St. is the "Ho" part of "SoHo" and "NoHo"-- South of Houston and North of Houston.

2) Getting back to the history stuff, the Bethesda Fountain area of Central Park is worth taking a look at. That whole area, including the nearby Bow Bridge has been seen in a ton of movies. It's easy to get there from the West 72nd St. entrance to the park. And right there at the corner of 72nd and Central Park West is the Dakota building, which is where John Lennon lived and was killed. It's also the building from Rosemary's Baby and was a key element in the book I mentioned in the previous post.

If you are taking Busterkeaton's advice and make the trip to Staten Island for Denino's pizza, right across the street (that would be Richmond Avenue) is Ralph's Italian Ices - Far and away the best Italian Ices made anywhere on the planet! Their lemon ice has bits of lemon and lemon zest in it - the chocolate has little bits of real chocolate - I have never been dissapointed there.

Speaking of Staten Island, if you email me off list and let me know when you will be taking the ride on the ferry, I can meet you on the SI side and give you the quick tour (including Denino's & Ralph's) but also including (near the ferry) Sailor's Snug Harbor - An "old sailors home" that has been converted into a culteral center - very nice. I can then drop you off back at the ferry (this would have to be a weekend day however). Lemme know.

BTW - On the SI ferry you will get the best views of the Statue of Liberty and Ellis Island - I have set up a tripod outside and gotten some nice stock footage. You can also get goot shots of the Verazano Bridge, lower Manhattan and lots of other neat stuff.

Other great views for panoramas are the top of the Empire State Building and the top of the pedestal of the Statue of Liberty (highest they allow you to go these post 9/11 days).

Bruce, I would love to take you up on the offer, but we are only going to be there Monday through Friday.

I really appreciate all of the advice and help here. You know, with all of these suggestions, I bet you guys could wrap them all up and bind them and have yourself a citizen's guide to NYC to sell on Amazon.

Thanks again, and when we get back, I will let you all know where we went and what we thought. Thanks again!

j razz

Almost forgot:

Sunday AM Dim Sum at the Silver Palace restaurant just across the street from the foot of the Brooklyn Bridge (hmmm, or is it the Manhattan Bridge? One or the other, easy enough to find.)

A huge ornate restaurant that will be loaded with huge extended Chinese families on Sundays. Probalby the most authentic dim Sum I ever saw. And don't worry about getting served something disgusting. The waitresses who push the carts will tell you "White people no like" if you order something a little too exotic.

Wonderful experience.

Chinatown is at the base of the Manhattan Bridge - BB puts you near City Hall.

And most dim sum is inedible by gwaylo (chinese slur/slang for white person) standards. If you're adventurous, try the chicken or duck feet.

A lot of cafes and good food on 7th Avenue around Christopher Street in the West Village. Also, if someone tells you to meet them at the corner of West 4th Street and West 10th Street, they're not putting you on. Sammy's Roumanian Steak House on Christie Street just North of Delancey (lower East Side) is within walking distance of both Chinatown and Little Italy, and while short on ambiance has an international reputation for great food.

My favorite restaurant in NYC is the Oyster Bar in the basement of Grand Central Terminal. Fresh clams, oysters and fish brought in daily, good prices, and all in one of the most spectacular buildings in the world.

The Oyster Bar is one to check out. Sit at the counter and watch the cooks make oyster pan roasts.

The Flatiron Building always makes me smile. It's right where Broadway and Fifth Ave cross.
I was a bike messenger one summer and one the keys to figuring out how to get around the city is Broadway is crooked and every place it crosses an avenue is a square.
It crosses 4th Ave at 14th St (Union Square)
It crosses 5th Ave at 23rd St (Madison Square--Flatiron Building)
It crosses 6th Ave at 34th St (Herald Square--Macy's)
It crosses 7th Ave at 42nd St (Times Square)
It crosses 8th Ave at 59th St (Columbus Circle)

For churches you have to see the Cathedral of St. John the Divine. Biggest church in America. Started building it in the 1890's and it's should be finished in 100 years.

more pics

I second the recommnedation on The Cloisters. Great collection of medieval religious art work in the most peaceful place in Manhattan. It's at the far northern tip of Manhattan. Great views across the Hudson too. The Rockerfellers bought the land in New Jersey so that it wouldn't be developed.

In your mid-twenties! Then I definitely stick by my list. My girlfriend and I are old folks -- I'm approaching 30 this year :D I think you'll be able to weather the adventure of 10th ave or the LES...

Otherwise, I completely forgot... DESSERTS!

Cookies: Lavain Bakery at 74th and Amsterdam, just below MaxWax. The best chocolate/chocolate cookie concoction. They're somewhat underbaked and soo very dense and gooey. Each cookie costs about $5 but is enough for two to share -- they must weigh about 1/2lb each. You're almost always going to get them warm out of the oven off the speedrack when you go.

If you REALLY like chocolate, but are downtown at the time, check out City Bakery at 18th between 5th and 6th. You can take the 6th avenue F line to 14th and just walk up and over. They have a hot chocolate drink that has the consistency of a just melted chocolate bar with a little cream mixed in. With their homemade marshmallows, blocks of slightly firm marshamallow cream, just get a small to share.

- jim

Ahh.... Remembered some old places I used to like. Don't know if they're still there but her goes:

Both on West 52nd Street - Off of Broadway (Theater District) and across from the Roseland Dance Hall.

Gallagher's Steakhouse - You used to be able to see the meat hanging in their collers from the street. Good, aged beef.

Right next door is Victor's - Cuban food (the roast sucklig pig is exquisite). I believe Roberto Duran used to go there after his fights.

And while it's very expensive and the food ain't all that great - you may want to take a look at Sardi's just for the experience - I once at there with a friend who was doing an off-Broadway play and by showing a SAG or Equity card, you get a special lower price menu (still kinda pricey but hey, why not).

By the way, flew over the city last night. Manhattan and the area sure looks beautiful at 35,000 feet at night.

Hope you have fun on your trip!

Okay, so just a little over a week before we take off to NY. Wanted to say thanks for all the suggestions. We have scoured over them and my wife likes to plan things (I swing in the other direction of no schedules for vacations) and she has gone through with a highlighter picking the places that sound of interest and the things that she thinks we would both enjoy. I sat down with this list a couple days back and underlined some of the things that I want to do or some places that I wanted to eat at.
This is really a great list b/c I found that after the descriptions you all gave, I had just about everything underlined. We should really bind this and find a reseller in NY for those who arrive and want a local's guide to the city.
Anyways, thanks again and we are looking foward to our trip!

j razz

What a list - I lived in Manhattan for over 20 years, so here's what I think.

Since you're young (and probably broke) - forget about all those steak places. I've eaten at them all and they are great. At the end of the night, you've had a great meal and a $150 or more dinner bill.
Live on pizza and Italian food, from everywhere. It's all good.
NYC water ok from tap.
Subways safe by day until midnight - then a little sketchy, but probably not really.

Museum of Nat History - up the block from you - definite.
Times Square Marriot Hotel - coffee in the lobby - go to restaurant on 43rd floor - what an elevator ride. Have more coffee - leave -definite
Empire State Observatory - if it's clear - definite
Central Park - including walk thru zoo - if it's nice - definite.
Sony IMAX theater - if you've never seen this - definite
Broadway show - eh - we loved "Dirty Rotten Scoundrals", "Stomp", and "Swing", btw. Do a matinee - way cheaper. Go on a rainy day.

and here's the ringer for that "special" night.
A dinner cruise on the World Yacht. It will be the same cost as all those steak places, but you'll spend three to four hours cruising around Manhattan at sunset - skyline, Statue of Lib, dancing, dining, and a memory (and photo ops) forever.
http://www.worldyacht.com/sitecontent.cfm?page=dining

Have a great trip
v

Thanks Vic,
We will definitely do that, the World Yacht... as for the young and broke thing- well, my wife is a nurse and does quiet well while I am a social worker by day and a wedding videographer/graphic designer/web designer/I'll try any project once guy. So, basically, she supports my hobbies :)
We are definitely going to try Luger's as well and the pizza place by the Brooklyn Bridge as well as a ton of other places that were listed here.

I'll be sure to report back on how things went.

j razz

One thing about the pizza: I don't remember if I mentioned this earlier (and I'm too lazy to search the thread), but at the pizza place (Grimaldi's is the one at the Brooklyn Bridge), get at least one that's plain (no sausage, peppers, etc.). The pizza is so thin that you can easily eat more than one, so if you like toppings, get one with and one without. The reason is just that once you throw toppings on it you tend to taste the toppings more than the pizza (especially with something like pepperoni). Also, burnt is good when it comes to this kind of pizza, so don't worry if it looks overdone.

Fred

Fred,
You did mention to get one plain and that they are thin. Thanks again though.

j razz

Remember, we expect a full report when you return. :-) I just hope we haven't overhyped everything... And I hope the weather is good.

>>If you just want a quick lunch somewhere, a lot of places in NYC which cater to the work lunch crowd have a custom salad counter where you pick up a container of lettuce and they mix in practically any ingredient you want for you.
<<

There is an excellent European import chain called
'Pres et Mange' (Ready to Eat). They make great sandwiches and are relatiely affordable. They were my main source of lunch when I visited London. Pretty much same variety and quality in the NY stores.