Glad to hear that, Burt.

But as John said, this is the rare exception. Consider yourself lucky.

Sony built it, they sold it and made money from it.
Why should they not honour the warranty, the cost of warranty repair does not come out of the retailer/dealers markup.

Bob.

Because his camera was likely an import. Sony should be liable for products sold in the country the camera is sold in.

And it's not like he bought it from Sony's own website, so no, they didn't sell it to him.

so, i buy a camera while on an extended holiday in, say, alaska, or alternatively, i'm in nz and a job turns up so i buy a camera.....

when i get back to australia i'm to expect my guarantee is worthless?

curious, since i intend buying my next camera in singapore...

"And it's not like he bought it from Sony's own website, so no, they didn't sell it to him."

And I didn't buy my EX3 from Sony's own Web site either, but they are still liable for the warranty repairs.

Bob's right.

In Australia you cannot buy anything from Sony, they own no retail or trade outlets. The "Sony" shops are not owned by Sony, they're owned by another retail chain.

As an aside I buy all SCS products from SCS. There is an Australian distributor as well, I guess technically I'm buying grey.

The reality is the cost saving for us buying from B&H or Globalmediapro is such that we can get around two cameras for what we'd pay locally. I don't recall us ever having a camera needing warranty repair. The only exception has been updates to our EXs. Mine came back with 60% of the camera replaced. The factory stuffed up, the lens was out of wack when it left the plant.

Leslie makes a good point. Cameras travel a lot, it's a perfectly reasonable expectation that a manufacturer will stand behind their products and those who choose to use them regardless of where they bought it. It's certainly something anyone would consider in a buying decision for such kind of kit.

We've had two K5600 ballasts fail recently, neither bought through K5600's Australian agent. They are technically a few months outside the warranty period but K5600 are fixing them for free, 24 hour turn around. Now when someone asks me which HMI lights to buy who do you think I'll recommend?

Bob.

Manufactures originally limited the scope of warranty repair to geographic areas for which they were sold. They did this mainly for practical and financial reasons. For each geographic area (Europe, USA, Japan, etc) there were different models released. While there are obviously similarities, there were differences. Each model required specialized training for the service technicians, different service manual and specialized parts. By limiting service to only models that were sold in a specific country, the manufacture was reducing costs. Things have probably changed a little bit since I worked for a Sony Authorized Service Center 15+ years ago since there is probably more of a "global" structure in their design of equipment.

Pay attention, Jay.

I'm talking about grey-market cameras that don't have a US warranty, and are not covered by Sony in this country, nor should they be.

"[i]Pay attention, Jay.

I'm talking about grey-market cameras that don't have a US warranty, and are not covered by Sony in this country, nor should they be.[/i"]

Say what you mean, then Gates. I'm not a mind reader.

Be that as it may, gray, green, blue, black, white, it doesn't make any difference. Sony made the camera. They ought be will to fix it regardless of where it was bought (short of being stolen) as Bob suggested. I happened to agree with him.

...and I agree with Bob, too. That is the single criteria. If Sony made it and something goes wrong within a year, then it gets fixed under warranty. At least that's the way mine turned out and I don't thinK I got lucky. I think Sony recognized something here, too.

When you buy anything, especially a big ticket item like the camera, a large chunk of the price goes toward the factory warrant. It doesn't matter if if your camera that breaks down or someone else's, your helping to pay for it. If the dealer bought it somehow for several hundred or a thousand dollars less than normal, the warranty portion was not paid for. That's like buying something "as is" and expecting to exchange it for something perfect without paying the difference. When you buy from a real dealer, your also buying warranty protection.

Lynn

Sony's never been the issue. It's the reseller. My whole point is that you need to buy from a reputable dealer. Plain and simple.

There's a reason Sony doesn't authorize every fly-by-night operator to sell their products.

Sorry but that's plain wrong, The dealer does not pay for the cost of warranty repairs. The retailer's markup goes straight to their bottom line.

What you do pay for and is the crux of the real problem, is showroom space, knowledgeable (joke) people to guide you to the right choice etc, etc. Of course all that costs money. The problem is having taken on board all that free advice and time playing with a camera you go home and Google for the best price and buy it from someone who is drop shipping straight from Sony's distribution centre.

If you're buying broadcast / pro cameras then the dealer may even loan you a camera while your one is away being repaired, They may kick Sony real hard to get your problems dealt with. This is what you pay for.

Bob.

Bob, it's not quite so clear-cut as that. My point, once again, is for the person do simply do a little research when buying anything online, especially if the price is too good to be true. One needs only to check resellerratings.com or a similar site to see the horror stories about the retailer mentioned in this thread, and all the other bait-n-switch operators to avoid.

I will however agree that a store's mark-up plays into the cost of a product. Many times I have gone and looked at a camera at Best Buy, but then bought it online at B&H or Newegg.

Even B&H Photo sells some grey market gear, but they are VERY clear about it in the description. I noticed this the other night when I was shopping for some Canon DSLR lenses.

You're right. They always say it's imported, and it's usually a few bucks less than the U.S. version.

"They always say it's imported, and it's usually a few bucks less than the U.S. version."

Not to put words in Burt's and Bob's mouths, but that seems to be the issue here. Why do "grey market" items cost less and why are they not worthy of Sony's warranty?

Sony makes camera X. It cost Sony Y to manufacture the camera. Sony sells the camera to online retailer. Sony has received their money for their product. Online retailer sells camera to customer for less money than large brick & mortar business. Camera, or a part thereof, poops out within the first year of ownership. It cost Sony Z, to fix the camera regardless of where it was bought.

Whether the retailer is online in Timbuktu or Kalamazoo should have no bearing on warranty issues.

The world has changed. The days of little distributor absolute fiefdoms are over.

The hockeystick part of that curve started in the 1990s when the world really became a "global village" (as Marshall McLuhan had foreseen) through widespread use of the web giving people equal access to the local and the far away.

In 1995 my brother in Sweden told me that he urgently needed some professional software, I think it was Macromedia Director. This was on a Monday. He called the local distributor and was told that they could get it to him by Friday for $5,000. A localized Swedish edition of course, but who cares about that for a professional tool?

So he checked with a U.S. supplier. What did they have to offer? $1,000 and delivery on Wednesday.

So $5,000 for delivery in four days vs. $1,000 for delivery in 2 days? Hmmmm.


Warranties should be worldwide, because people travel and for a global company it just makes sense, it's part of their strength. This is already the case for many notebook computers, so why not video gear?

"Why do "grey market" items cost less and why are they not worthy of Sony's warranty?" I'm a little surprised by this question. Manufacturers, because of international trade agreements, usually pay import tariffs (taxes per item and this can variable per type of item from a manufacturer). Most countries require manufacturers to track their inventory so they get their tariffs. Grey products avoid tariffs and product volume restricts by shipping re-boxxed items from a less taxed market or a market which products are sold in under cost because of agreements(another discussion). When an item is sent to a big manufacturer for repairs that is from a grey market, usually they are required to record serials and collect tariffs..... this clearly explained in US law and most EU markets,etc,,, So most manufacturers try to avoid this massive paperwork by refusing to do the repairs locally or by charging for the additional cost to process the repair.

If you have a way to avoid paying duties on importing goods, I'd like to know about it.

I don't know what "taxes per item" you're talking about, other than sales taxes of course which will be due in any case, and doesn't affect the comparisons here.

What is a tariff?

A tariff (from Arabic t'ariffa: "fee to be paid"), a duty imposed on goods when they are moved across a political boundary.

It's not a tax, and it shouldn't make any difference to a warranty repair shop whether the camera was bought locally or elsewhere, as the cost of the parts and the labor will be identical.

The price difference for the same product sold in say the U.S. and the U.K. (where a dollar converts to a pound in the price list) is usually justified as being necessary due to a higher cost of doing business in Europe with higher corporate taxes (actually, the tax rates are higher in the U.S.) and the higher salaries of the staff (some truth to that, although that is somewhat offset by longer freight distances within a country that spans 3.8 million square miles).

Mostly it's a case of charging more because they can.

I've been on both sides of this (manufacturer and monopoly national distributor), and negotiated both sides.

It made sense at one time, but not so much today other than for localized products.

Global village, get used to it!

SOOOO I have a question is it safe to buy from B&H I see several posts that state that they sell " grey market" so how can you trust them if you have a warranty issue. I am looking at several items from them but I have always had a real hard time ordering big ticket items from online or catalog but where I live there is no retailer that sells big cameras.

Paul B

B&H is cool and reliable. I've been buying pro video gear from them for 20 years, never a problem.

The "grey market" referred to was people overseas buying from B&H in New York instead of through their national distributors.