Popular cams render buggy Vegas Pro 18 build373, still in Vegas 19

TTTT wrote on 11/9/2020, 12:50 PM

I was working on a video in Vegas Pro 18 and things were going as usual.

At some point I decide to update to the latest build (build 373).

At first I had to waste several minute, hide and then re-show the Video Preview in order to have it undocked (otherwise clicking on the tab was doing nothing at all).

Now that I try to preview my project, using "Preview (Auto)" quality setting, all I get is frame drops (not sure but I mean black frames, or image freezing (like not even starting though sound if playing), freezing and potentially crash of the all application.

Even simply moving the preview window or moving the cursor on the tracks seem "difficult" for the software.

Seems like start to read from certain tracks play fine for a bit, but as soon as another track/video event overlaps it's black preview or freeze. A 4K source file seem to cause problems quicker than the others (multicam, with different cam so different file formats).

I know that some settings are reset when updating, even with builds, ... but it's possible that I forgot about some configuration details where do you think I should look ? (Project is also using Ignite Pro plug-ins v4 but they don't seem to have to do with this problem. Well they are in the project but at this step they are actually all disabled.))

Some system info: Windows 10 Enterprise, GeForce GTX 1080 Ti (driver 457.09, very recent), Threadripper 2950x, 32 GB RAM ...

Also, I accidentally double clicks on a .veg file and this opened Vegas Pro 17. Version 17 had no problem previewing this project. Now thinking that I was maybe using Vegas Pro 17 from the start. (I mean I have Vegas Pro 18 in my task bar, but .veg file are still associated to Vegas Pro 17. Anyway ... I'd like to use Vegas Pro 18 but it's not usable in this state.

Comments

TTTT wrote on 11/9/2020, 2:28 PM

Also, I usually use my computer through a non-admin account. I tried launching Vegas 18 Pro "as administrator" ... but it got me into the "hard crash" flavour of this yet unresolved epic Ignite Pro 4 issue (I really tried to have it solved with their support service, very actively for 6 months and further less actively, but I think they gave up) : https://www.vegascreativesoftware.info/us/forum/looking-for-owners-of-previous-vegas-pro-suite-or-vegas-pro-ignite--117074/

(I can use Vegas + Ignite Pro 4 thanks to some workaround I described on the second page of latter topic.)

TTTT wrote on 11/9/2020, 2:54 PM

It seems like reading the following files (from Panasonic GH5s and Panasonic GH4) is what causes the most struggle to the Preview window.
Other cameras involved are Canon EOS 5D Mark IV and Sony RX-100 M5.

From Panasonic GH5s:

General
Complete name : E:\...\P1000173.MP4
Format : MPEG-4
Format profile : Base Media / Version 2
Codec ID : mp42 (mp42/avc1)
File size : 4.66 GiB
Duration : 4 min 37 s
Overall bit rate mode : Variable
Overall bit rate : 144 Mb/s
Encoded date : UTC 2019-06-10 00:12:53
Tagged date : UTC 2019-06-10 00:12:53
PANA : ïjjÏÊ«ª>ºz*ªªÎ¢ª¢È / j*êkº®¨Î¾ºªª/ / ªÿè.¢«Ì.È¸îíªº¾¨ / ªª«Ë

Video
ID : 1
Format : AVC
Format/Info : Advanced Video Codec
Format profile : High@L5.2
Format settings : CABAC / 2 Ref Frames
Format settings, CABAC : Yes
Format settings, Reference frames : 2 frames
Codec ID : avc1
Codec ID/Info : Advanced Video Coding
Duration : 4 min 37 s
Bit rate mode : Variable
Bit rate : 142 Mb/s
Maximum bit rate : 158 Mb/s
Width : 3 840 pixels
Height : 2 160 pixels
Display aspect ratio : 16:9
Frame rate mode : Constant
Frame rate : 50.000 FPS
Color space : YUV
Chroma subsampling : 4:2:0
Bit depth : 8 bits
Scan type : Progressive
Bits/(Pixel*Frame) : 0.343
Stream size : 4.61 GiB (99%)
Encoded date : UTC 2019-06-10 00:12:53
Tagged date : UTC 2019-06-10 00:12:53
Color range : Full
Color primaries : BT.709
Transfer characteristics : BT.709
Matrix coefficients : BT.709
Codec configuration box : avcC

Audio
ID : 2
Format : PCM
Format settings : Big / Signed
Codec ID : twos
Duration : 4 min 37 s
Bit rate mode : Constant
Bit rate : 1 536 kb/s
Channel(s) : 2 channels
Sampling rate : 48.0 kHz
Bit depth : 16 bits
Stream size : 50.9 MiB (1%)
Encoded date : UTC 2019-06-10 00:12:53
Tagged date : UTC 2019-06-10 00:12:53

Other
ID : 3
Type : Time code
Format : QuickTime TC
Duration : 4 min 37 s
Bit rate mode : Constant
Frame rate : 50.000 FPS
Time code of first frame : 11:46:04:12
Time code, striped : Yes
Encoded date : UTC 2019-06-10 00:12:53
Tagged date : UTC 2019-06-10 00:12:53

From Panasonic GH4:

General
Complete name : E:\...\P1000236.MP4
Format : MPEG-4
Format profile : Base Media / Version 2
Codec ID : mp42 (mp42/avc1)
File size : 3.94 GiB
Duration : 3 min 58 s
Overall bit rate mode : Variable
Overall bit rate : 142 Mb/s
Encoded date : UTC 2019-06-10 01:18:34
Tagged date : UTC 2019-06-10 01:18:34

Video
ID : 1
Format : AVC
Format/Info : Advanced Video Codec
Format profile : High@L5.1
Format settings : 2 Ref Frames
Format settings, CABAC : No
Format settings, Reference frames : 2 frames
Format settings, GOP : N=1
Codec ID : avc1
Codec ID/Info : Advanced Video Coding
Duration : 3 min 58 s
Bit rate mode : Variable
Bit rate : 140 Mb/s
Maximum bit rate : 211 Mb/s
Width : 1 920 pixels
Height : 1 080 pixels
Display aspect ratio : 16:9
Frame rate mode : Constant
Frame rate : 50.000 FPS
Color space : YUV
Chroma subsampling : 4:2:0
Bit depth : 8 bits
Scan type : Progressive
Bits/(Pixel*Frame) : 1.352
Stream size : 3.89 GiB (99%)
Encoded date : UTC 2019-06-10 01:18:34
Tagged date : UTC 2019-06-10 01:18:34
Color range : Full
Color primaries : BT.709
Transfer characteristics : BT.709
Matrix coefficients : BT.709
Codec configuration box : avcC

Audio
ID : 2
Format : PCM
Format settings : Big / Signed
Codec ID : twos
Duration : 3 min 58 s
Bit rate mode : Constant
Bit rate : 1 536 kb/s
Channel(s) : 2 channels
Sampling rate : 48.0 kHz
Bit depth : 16 bits
Stream size : 43.7 MiB (1%)
Encoded date : UTC 2019-06-10 01:18:34
Tagged date : UTC 2019-06-10 01:18:34

Other
ID : 3
Type : Time code
Format : QuickTime TC
Duration : 3 min 58 s
Bit rate mode : Constant
Frame rate : 50.000 FPS
Time code of first frame : 08:37:24:02
Time code, striped : Yes
Encoded date : UTC 2019-06-10 01:18:34
Tagged date : UTC 2019-06-10 01:18:34

andyrpsmith wrote on 11/10/2020, 4:44 AM

Could you send me 2-3 clips of the problem files, I also have 1080Ti. I would like to see how v18 deals with this on my system which currently is in stable mode. Also 457.09 is a recent game driver I believe, 456.71 seems to be the most stable driver so far with V18. I could pick these up using dropbox if you have it or airbridge (free but you need to register).

TTTT wrote on 11/10/2020, 5:05 AM

Thank you.
I cannot send these precise source files, but I can see if I generate new one from the cameras and even check if I can replicate the issues in a smaller test project that I could send.
But I do not know WHEN I will be able to do so.

Regarding drivers, you seem to be referring to "Nvidia Studio Drivers", well two things.

- I'm not too much into gaming but recently a game forced me to update my drivers otherwise it wouldn't launch. Not sure which minimum version it required.
- I don't remember who it came from, I suspect if was FX Home Ignite Pro 4 support (but it could be Magix support or people on this forum) but some time ago I was using Nvidia "Creator Ready" drivers, and I was advised to follow the "Game Ready" branch even for creation softwares as these were more "advanced" ...
Just confusing...

andyrpsmith wrote on 11/10/2020, 5:07 AM

No problem, just send me a PM when ready.

andyrpsmith wrote on 11/10/2020, 3:20 PM

Hi TTTT, the Canon 5D clip 629 MOV. No issues with Preview icons on top bar. this clip does not play properly in V18 using So4compoundplug, or in v17. It plays correctly in V16 which uses compoundplug.

The only way I could get it to play in V18 was to change hardware decoder for So4 compound reader setting from 1 to 0. It would then read this file correctly. Why I don't know. I'm looking at the other clips.

Same for Panasonic 243, plays OK in V16 but not V18 unless So4 is set to 0 in internal.

Other clips play OK.

I think the Vegas team may need to look at these two clips.

TTTT wrote on 11/10/2020, 4:40 PM

Should I make a bug report or so?

Also, I have no idea where to change So4compoundplug/compoundplug.

Though, I have no issue with Vegas 17.

andyrpsmith wrote on 11/10/2020, 5:01 PM

Hopefully one of the moderators will chip in and advise?

andyrpsmith wrote on 11/11/2020, 3:34 PM

Can anyone advise on this issue with V18. i can only get the files to play by changing hardware decoder to 0 - middle line

andyrpsmith wrote on 11/11/2020, 3:51 PM

TTTT sent me a link saying the link would be posted in this post.

Is there a way to activate compoundplug in V18?

j-v wrote on 11/11/2020, 3:51 PM

Did we get those files? Where?
The only thing a see strange on both MediaInfo's is the rediculus hich bitrate for 50 p FHD files and not more.
BTW. It looked you were helping here on an common helperssite with personal help, I dislike!😬

TTTT wrote on 11/11/2020, 3:54 PM

And here are the test files from my cameras that andyrpsmith used to find this workaround. Some info in .txt file, marker texts, track names etc.

https://4dm1n.net/private/TEMPORARY/20201110-vegas-forum/20201110-Vegas_Pro_18_Preview_test.zip

[approx. 1.5 GB]
It looks like it's actually the files from the Panasonic GH4 and Canon 5D Mark IV that are causing reading problem.

andyrpsmith wrote on 11/11/2020, 3:56 PM

Did we get those files? Where?
The only thing a see strange on both MediaInfo's is the rediculus hich bitrate for 50 p FHD files and not more.
BTW. It looked you were helping here on an common helperssite with personal help, I dislike!😬

Luckily it's not a crime!

TTTT wrote on 11/11/2020, 4:16 PM

...rediculus hich bitrate for 50 p FHD...

Not sure what bitrate would be expected.
I suppose the reason is https://www.premiumbeat.com/blog/differences-all-i-ipb-compression/

j-v wrote on 11/11/2020, 4:45 PM

@TTTT
On my laptop from signature all 4 files are playing fluent in a FHD 50p project with Preview best full, no problems, only the last ones are looking a bit unsharp. Look

I did not yet look at your projects and settings on that download. Maybe tomorrow....... If @andyrpsmith is not interfering in the meantime.

andyrpsmith wrote on 11/11/2020, 4:56 PM

@TTTT
On my laptop from signature all 4 files are playing fluent in a FHD 50p project with Preview best full, no problems, only the last ones are looking a bit unsharp. Look

I did not yet look at your projects and settings on that download. Maybe tomorrow....... If @andyrpsmith is not interfering in the meantime.

I think you should withdraw your remark j-v

Rule #1, Respect the opinions and views of other members of the community."

TTTT wrote on 11/11/2020, 5:23 PM

@TTTT
On my laptop from signature all 4 files are playing fluent in a FHD 50p project with Preview best full, no problems, only the last ones are looking a bit unsharp.

I will not have the time to do tests myself before at least tomorrow, but I edit my projects in 3840x2160 at 50p.
GH5s does great 4K, regarding Mark IV, I got better results filming in FHD and upscaling.
The other two cameras, are usually rather there as complementary support. (I would like to replace them if I ever decide to put some more money in it ... anyway currently due to Covid as well as other activities, I'm not filming, only editing existing footages).

These test video are not meant to be sharp, I made them very quickly to create a smaller test project. (Especially with the 5D Mark IV, I had 85mm f/1.2 on and nothing is in focus in the test shot.)

j-v wrote on 11/12/2020, 4:12 AM

@TTTT

I will not have the time to do tests myself before at least tomorrow, but I edit my projects in 3840x2160 at 50p.

To me it looks very strange when only 1 cam is producing in 4 K to edit in a 4K project for an upscaled render, unless you use a lot of MediaGenerators that also need to be at 4K. Normally upscaling of the results is used at the renderstage by choosing a certain template.
But also when using a 4K template all played at full framerate with Preview/Auto with me. All the files use the so4compoundplug.dll. Look

Also playing your test projects goes normal:

TTTT wrote on 11/12/2020, 10:15 AM

Thank you for testing. Do you think it may come from hard/system difference?

As I mentionned in original post:
[quote]Some system info: Windows 10 Enterprise, GeForce GTX 1080 Ti (driver 457.09 *, very recent), Threadripper 2950x, 32 GB RAM ...[/quote]

* Though I mentionned it in the .txt file with the videos, I just realised that I may NOT have actually tested the NVidia Studio drivers ... After I uninstalled "Game Ready" drivers 457.09 and installed 456.71 "Studio" drivers, I got an error message saying that "Nvidia Studio drivers 456.71 are not compatible with my system." I restarted, and computer rebooted using 457.09 anyway, though I had them uninstalled.... confusing ...

RogerS wrote on 11/12/2020, 10:23 AM

Did you download a laptop driver or the wrong version of Windows by accident? It should be compatible.Try again here: https://www.nvidia.com/en-us/drivers/results/166051/

j-v wrote on 11/12/2020, 10:50 AM

Do you think it may come from hard/system difference?

I don't know your Vegas settings that are important for these things. Therefore we need screenshots of
- Options/ Preferences/Video
- Options /Preferences/ Deprecated Features
- Options/ Preferences/File I/O

As I mentionned in original post:
[quote]Some system info: Windows 10 Enterprise, GeForce GTX 1080 Ti (driver 457.09 *, very recent),

Mine on laptop is GTX 1050 with driverversion 456.71.
There is no need to uninstall a former driver if you install that Studiodriver adviced by the Vegas development. But you have to do the install of only that driver and it has to be a "clean" install of only the driver and not all the other Nvidia stuff that come with it unless you need something for gaming or sound.

TTTT wrote on 11/16/2020, 2:59 AM

Hello, here are the screenshots you mentionned.

(I'm a bit surprise that "Deprecated > Enable ProType Titler" is disabled while I have some in my projet and it's working fine.)

Regarding the drivers, I'll need to check again, I think that I did exactly what you wrote (before I tried uninstalling the driver) and after restart computer was still with latest Game Ready driver. (I need to find the right time when I can do driver stuff and reboots.)

j-v wrote on 11/16/2020, 4:33 AM

(I'm a bit surprise that "Deprecated > Enable ProType Titler" is disabled while I have some in my projet and it's working fine.)

Deprecated does not mean those options are not available, but if they are not selected here they cannot being used or chosen to use in a new project.
Further sorry I cannot compare your settings because I never used an AMD processor, maybe someone else with such an AMD is able to help you.

TTTT wrote on 11/18/2020, 10:59 AM

I have taken some time to effectively downgrade my GPU drivers from Game Ready 457.09 to Studio 456.71. (In the mean time, both Studio and Game Ready branches are now at version 457.30) I had to use some driver uninstaller software named "DDU" to prevent computer from switching back to Game Ready 457.09.

I reactivated So4compoundplug (I mean I set the setting to 1 instead of 0, not 100% sure reactivating is the appropriate term.)

But I still get exactly the same issues with those drivers.