Flash can also play mp4. no need to re-encode.

I use MP4FastStart to make the mp4 file start playing immediately, and then embed the JW player to play it (much more control than the flash player itself). looks as good or better than flv and can be done from vegas using the mainconcept or sony codecs.

thanks all,
I'm gonna try that!
VJ

Hi all,
So I tried to "render as" in .mp4, but I have some questions about the CUSTOM window.

1) My project is originally in PAL DV 720x576, so in the "Frame size" can I select : NTSC Square pixel (640x480) – (Does it work with original media in PAL 720-576?)

2) Should I selct in the "Frame rate" the option 25 PAL instead of NTSC 29,970?

3) For the bit rate, which bit rate to chose?
- Constant bit rate? If so, how much for good quality and not too big file size? (768,000; 2000,000; 4000,000; 10 000,000; 14 000,000 or more?)
OR - Variable bit rate?: And in that case what does means "Two-pass"? and "Maximum" and "Average"? Which values should be chosen?

What is the best Custom for good quality video for the net with handlabl file size?

Thanks for the help,
VJ

Hello! Is anybody can help with this issue?
VJ

I'd love to hear some recommendations here, too. It seems like there is a fine line between quality and file size (i.e. the abiltiy for the streaming video to keep up with the "download" without pausing to wait for more download).

Furthermore, I'm wondering if there is any advantage to recording in 720p (what frame rate?), when using a Canon HG21 that records in 1080i natively.

So... I'm doing some experimentation, but there are so many combinations and permutations of settings that I'd love to hear what others have learned.

I happen to use Silverlight for my websites (supports wmv or mp4) but I suspect even Flash or ??? settings would be a good starting point for whatever platform is used.

...Jerry

Nobody on that issue?

In other words, what is the best set up (jncluding quality and display size 640x480 for example) with the MPEG4 in Vegas Pro for internet viewing of video between 5 and 15 minutes?
Thanks!

Videojohn,

Sounds like you & I might be the only two with an interest here.

First, my caveat - I'm not sure I know what I'm doing, but I'm going thru a trial-and-error experiment. I render the video on my Desktop - Intel Q9550, Vegas 9.0b 64bit. Then I test the results on my old/slow laptop - Pentium M - Wireless 54Mbps. The trick seems to be to balance the quality with the ability of your browser to keep up with the streaming video.

The other variables include - What is the resolution of your source? What size do you want to display the video on you website?

I seem to get the best results using wmv (I'm using Silverlight). But since you expressed an interest in mp4 & 640 display width, here's what I came up with: http://www.jazzythedog.com/longwood.aspx

I'd be interested in hearing others comments on the quality - Overall quality? Does the video keep up with the streaming? Is the video "jerky"? What about the transitions?

I shot the video on a Canon HG21; 1080i/60i 17Mbps. Here's the render settings:



In the meantime, I'll continue my trial-and-error (hoping someone with some experience in this area will "chime in").

...Jerry

Just viewed your test vid from the link you supplied and

Overall quality? -- Very Crisp and Clean even at full screen
Does the video keep up with the streaming? --Yes for me

Is the video "jerky"? What about the transitions? --Slightly jerky in the pan and zooms but not bad

Viewed in IE8 on a Quad

Cheers

Hi amendegw,
My original sources are mainly DV 720x576 (PAL) and I have one or two videos in 1280x720 (HDV).
I want the final display on my website to be 640x480 (because I tried with 320x240 and it is really small). But now the issue is what are the best set up to render in .mp4 so the quality is good BUT also that my webmaster will convert these files in .flv and that the files can't be too big to dowload and play smoothly on the net! (I have video up to 15 minutes).

I also made some test with the following settings:

.mp4
640x480
frame rate PAL 25 fps
constant bitrate (btw what is the difference between constant and variable bitrate?) of 1,200,000
I also made tests with a bitrate of 1,500,000 and 2,000,000 but it seems that the final quality does not change much at the end of the chain (after being transformed into .flv) what change is the size of the file!!
Cheers

"...the quality is good BUT also that my webmaster will convert these files in .flv and that the files can't be too big to dowload and play smoothly on the net! (I have video up to 15 minutes)."

At the risk of restating the obvious... I don't think the issue is the total size of the file (or length of the video), rather the ability of the browser to keep up with the video stream. In other words, the download starts, the video player starts - as long as the video is downloaded faster than the video plays, you're okay - doesn't make a difference how long the source video is.

The file I rendered using the specs listed in my previous post was 11MB - for 1:30 min of video. If you view the video and hover your mouse cursor over the video, you can watch the download progress (horizontal bar) versus the player progress (triangle cursor). As long as the triangle is left of the bar - you're in good shape. It's a race - if the triangle catches up to the bar, the player stops and waits for more download - not good!

I don't know very much about Flash (my video, above, is played in a Silverlight Media Player), but there could be another issue here. I've read in other posts that the MainConcept mp4 codec does not put in the necessary markers to provide for Flash streaming and another product must be used to provide for steaming - Faststart(?). If these markers are not added, your Media Player will have to wait until the entire video file is downloaded to the client. Are these markers added when an mp4 is converted to an flv? Don't know - i'm way out on a limb here talking about things that I'm only vaguely familiar with. Can some one with some firsthand knowledge "chime in"?

" what is the difference between constant and variable bitrate"

Although, there are many, many variables here, I believe you can improve your ability to stream with a variable bitrate. i.e. fewer bytes of video per minute of playback.

Phew!!
...Jerry

Hi Jerry,
You mean that with "constant bit rate" you can tell to "use" more or less bit rate depending on the nature of the picture (needy of high bit rate or not?) and so the streaming is improved?

...my explaination is totally untechnical, I know...
VJ

"You mean that with "constant bit rate" you can tell to "use" more or less bit rate depending on the nature of the picture (needy of high bit rate or not?) and so the streaming is improved?"

No, I mean that a "variable bit rate" render produces a smaller file for a given quality video. Thus your website can display a better quality video on a slower connection because fewer bits of data flow over the network.

That said, I understand Microsoft's Silverlight has recently introduced a concept called "Smooth Streaming" which does exactly what you imply - the hosting service will vary the quality of the video based on how quickly the client can accept the video stream. see: http://www.iis.net/extensions/SmoothStreaming However, your hosting service must provide this service (mine does not). As I understand it, this effectively allows a "Constant Bit Rate" rendered video to be viewed at a variable rate. Here's a demo: http://www.iis.net/media/experiencesmoothstreaming (you can watch the bit rates vary).

Make sense?
....Jerry