Quicktime MOV Pixel Aspect Incorrect

fldave wrote on 3/8/2009, 8:14 AM
Is this a new issue? I haven't done much MOV rendering.

No matter what Pixel Aspect setting I use in rendering from Vegas 7 or 8 to QT for NTSC or PAL MOV, it is stuck on 0.909 in the final rendered file. The encoder is ignoring the Pixel Aspect setting. This happens both with manually rendering from the project, as well as using the Batch Render script. I have tried stretch/no stretch on the manually initiated render.

Nothing is working to get a NTSC or PAL widescreen MOV.

I recently upgraded to QT pro, could that have done it? If so, does QT Pro have a similar batch rendering facility? It is kind of clunky so far.

My source file on the timeline is HDV 1.333.

Hopefully, this is just something simple I overlooked.

Sorry, incorrect spelling in the topic!

Comments

fldave wrote on 3/8/2009, 8:33 AM
I just rendered directly out of QT Pro and it is ignoring the aspect ratio also. So something is going on in my machine, I think. I just reinstalled XP on another machine yesterday, I need to try it on that one.

Anyone else having this problem?
musicvid10 wrote on 3/8/2009, 9:49 AM
Yes, this is reproducible. I think it actually renders to 1.00 PAR. It "may" be a QT problem, but is not limited to QT Pro, I have QT 7 standard on my Vista box.

Here is a workaround in Vegas I have used:

1) In the QT template, set a custom frame size of 1920x1080, 960x540, 640x360, 480x270, 320x180 etc. (I think that is correct for HDV 1.3333) and set "Stretch to fill frame" on render.

Edited.
newhope wrote on 3/8/2009, 3:53 PM
If what you are seeing is a squeezed QT .mov rather than widescreen this is typical of QT even on a Mac.

It threw me as well when I first dealt with it. One way of getting QT .movs to display on your screen as widescreen is to open them in QT Player and select Window/Show Movie Properties then select the Video Track and Visual Settings tab. Uncheck the Preserve Aspect Ratio and set the Scaled Size to the correct values, e.g. 1024x576 for widescreen DV PAL (as opposed to 720x576 squeezed).

You can then Save the file and it will always open in widescreen.

New Hope Media
musicvid10 wrote on 3/8/2009, 5:51 PM
I ran a couple of tests and it seems Vegas doesn't honor the PAR setting in .mov renders, no matter how you set it.

Project dimension (1440x1080 / 1.3333) renders are actually square pixels and play squished in any player, whereas 1920x1080 stretched to fill output plays correctly no matter what pixel dimensions are chosen in the template.

"...open them in QT Player and select Window/Show Movie Properties then select the Video Track and Visual Settings tab."

Even .mp4 rendered at 1.212 or 1.333 PAR plays squished in QT 7. Looks like I have to shell out $30 for the QT Pro version to have these "luxury" options available to play back widescreen source in its proper aspect. Guess I'll stick with VLC for now.

So, to summarize:
It seems neither the Vegas .mov render nor QT 7 Standard recognizes PAR other than 1.0000.
fldave wrote on 3/8/2009, 6:41 PM
Thanks for confirming that I am not (too) crazy.

The other thing that concerns me is that Vegas is saying that the PAL mov is upper field first, even though the template I used is lower field first.

I wanted to do this automatically with Vegas batch renders, but I guess I need to do one-by one in QT Pro.

newhope wrote on 3/9/2009, 5:20 AM
...I guess I need to do one-by one in QT Pro.

I don't think QT Pro is going to change anything for you. I have it under Windows and Mac and QT still squishes widescreen, except for 1920x1080 square pixels. THis is the case even with .mov files i render from FCP when playing in the QT Player (though not when playing in FCP)

New Hope Media
musicvid10 wrote on 3/9/2009, 10:24 AM
"I have it under Windows and Mac and QT still squishes widescreen,"
Thanks for confirming what I suspected. I guess Apple is a bit behind the curve when it comes to widescreen.

It seems the workable solution, then is to render to a custom frame size that reflects the SAR in square pixels, in this case 1920x1080 or some proportional reduction thereof.
Cliff Etzel wrote on 3/10/2009, 11:19 PM
QT is crippleware from my experience. I dread having to render the format when someone requests it.

Cliff Etzel
Videographer : Producer
bluprojekt | SoloVJ blog

Coursedesign wrote on 3/11/2009, 8:14 AM
Rendering QT from Vegas has always been a frustrating experience, perhaps for two reasons:

1) SF/SCS has always been focused on doing things the Microsoft way, and they are intimately familiar with Microsoft's APIs and functionality (think VfW and .Net), but QT is a strange animal to them.

2) Microsoft had as a policy for years to sabotage QT, a variation on "the next version of Windows isn't complete until Lotus 1-2-3 doesn't work."

Interestingly, Avid Media Composer doesn't seem to have these QT problems, neither on Windows or OS X.

FCP has no problem rendering to 4:3 or 16:9, as long as you specify the pixel aspect ratio properly when rendering. It doesn't try to automate display conversions; you get the rope to do advanced things or to hang yourself. This is needed for more advanced work.

Coursedesign wrote on 3/12/2009, 11:11 AM
Stan,

This recent Apple Knowledge Base article should help you:

How to maintain aspect ratio when exporting high definition formats to standard definition