Comments

Chienworks wrote on 1/18/2004, 1:54 PM
If you connect the camera to the computer through firewire then you will be getting a DV signal, exactly the same as you would get from a DV tape (although hopefully with no tape dropouts). On the other hand, you could use the analog output from the camera to a capture card in your computer and get an uncompressed capture, but then you'll be going through both D->A and A->D conversions so the signal may be worse than DV.
johnmeyer wrote on 1/18/2004, 1:58 PM
Yes and no.

If you connect the DV camera to the computer via Firewire (1394), then the video has already been converted to DV and therefore compressed. Therefore, there is nothing you can do by using different capture software.

If, however, you connect the camera (DV or otherwise) via its analog connections (composotie or S-Video) and use an analog capture card, you can use any number of different capture applications that can connect through the codec of your choice. Depending on your computer and hard disk speed, you can capture in various formats that use less compression than DV and get better quality. Using no compression at all wll require a VERY capable system, especially for your disk drive. It is not clear to me whether going all the way to uncompressed will buy you very much in final quality. Try something like the Huffy codec (it's free) and see if you can tell the difference from DV (your baseline case) or from uncompressed (your "ultimate"), assuming you can capture uncompressed.
mark2929 wrote on 1/18/2004, 2:04 PM
Kelly. Yes Im using Firewire. I thought that the picture through the lens would in its raw state be an optical image which transferred down the fire wire link could be recorded on the computer in any available recording format.
OH well I thought I had a good idea on the boil.

Thanks Kelly
mark2929 wrote on 1/18/2004, 2:07 PM
And yes were up and running again.Thanks John. The reason for this is because I would like to improve Chroma key Footage .
PeterWright wrote on 1/18/2004, 4:32 PM
Mark,

The biggest factor in Chroma keying is careful lighting. There are a few threads on this, but some things to watch are:

Keep the subject well away from the screen to avoid green (or blue) relections.

Light the screen evenly and avoid ripples or creases..

Add backlighting to the subject to improve separation.

Watch out for straggly hair! (The subject's, not yours)

There are more - possibly others can add.
RBartlett wrote on 1/19/2004, 6:54 AM
Many modern hard discs can deliver 40MB/sec even at their lowest performing part of their geometry. My el cheapo Maxtor 160GB 2Mb buffer units certainly do on their own Silicon Image IDE parallel controllers.

With good fast memory and a reasonable CPU, an SVIDEO capture card can acquire uncompressed 720x480 or 720x576 as YUV 8bit 4:2:2 with a $60 card and some half decent triple shielded cables. Sometimes the cameras give a less processed output on the composite port than they do on the svideo - you need to research or test this.

Uncompressed video and PCM 24/96 fits into this computer equipment space. Sure, you can do lossless compression, but you could equally convert to lossless MJPEG with the Matrox codec whilst you are sleeping if you are in a bit of a squeeze (pun intended).

NewTek's VT, BMD's DeckLink and some other solutions squeeze into the sub $2500 arsenal (YCrCb or SDI). However if chromakeying is just part of your deal, consider the Fusion878 capture cards, or perhaps www.seriousmagic.com for their fine Ultra (Key) directly on your DV [there are others too, including Vegas itself].

With your source layers of video on adequate storage (be it IDE or SCSI, NT striped or just a driver + controller section per stream) there is a processing advantage in not having DV sources. In Vegas another penalty may occur with going from YUV to RGB, but as most tape formats are YUV, I still capture in that format and not in the RGB24 mode that the Fusion878 chips in the TV+SVIDEO+comp capture cards can use.

Compress at the very last stage, whether going to DV or DVD.

Incidentally FireWire could handle uncompressed video, just not as DV. It would be a lossless i-frame MPEG-2 or some other FEC container. Just nobody has bothered for it is true that SDI has some more life in it.

Lastly, there are some low compression DDR/HD-VTRs available that do low compression MJPEG 4:2:2, http://www.ffv.com or a dealer http://www.vidyo.com - neither to whom I am affiliated.
mark2929 wrote on 1/19/2004, 9:59 AM
Peter

Thanks for the Advice with lighting I have been reading John Jackmans Book on lighting (I got a Lighting Kit for Xmas) and I have converted the small spare room into a Studio

RBartlet

I Think part of the problem Im going to have is with the Capture Card ( I use a laptop) I Will probably look more into analogue Capture at a later time. I Thought I may have found a way to record direcct to my laptop using it as the recording device. Hoping this could enable me to make really good chroma key footage perhaps equivelent to betacam? Ultimately rendering out to DV.

I now know this can be done its a question of finding the best way thanks for all the help everyone !
farss wrote on 1/19/2004, 1:25 PM
Have a look at a range of filters by Formatt.
These guys are at the very serious end of the business so I assume anything they make does work. They also COST as you different ones for each focal length. These things seem to be like an optical honeycomb that reduces spill. I think they were around GBP 500 each, OUCH! Still they are glass so they'll outlast several cameras.
mark2929 wrote on 1/19/2004, 1:35 PM
farrs what I have done to try and combat spill is painted the walls magenta (not the screen obviously chroma green) also using a fluorescent light for the screen 13 amps and commotion will help clean up any spill.

Im quite reluctant to buy Filters anymore got a draw fulla cokins daft really when you can do the same with vegas plugins and correct in post too late when the footage is captured with filter FX

Thanks farrs
RBartlett wrote on 1/19/2004, 1:41 PM
Whilst it is possible to find an analogue capture card in cardbus format (there is a security camera solution somewhere out there that uses te Conexant Fusion878 for video capture at YUY2 4:2:2 from composite and svideo (one at a time), quite pricey as I recall. It is however a problem expecting a 2.5" drive to work anything as fast as a desktop drive. You'd perhaps get MJPEG 4:1 compression which with 4:2:2 would still have an edge (another intended pun) over consumer DV. However you'd need really to have a boot drive and a video drive adjacent, which whilst possible is another ungainly combination.

There will be an uncompressed hand/belt held VTR that will blow away the bottom end of the pro market. It just hasn't quite arrived yet.

Also try reflecmedia for another angle on a keying solution in less than perfect studio environments.( www.istudiostv.com )
mark2929 wrote on 1/19/2004, 1:57 PM
RBartlet

>There will be an uncompressed hand/belt held VTR that will blow away the bottom end of the pro market. It just hasn't quite arrived yet.<

I am surprised that has not been done before but certainly it could change the face of camcorders completely.

I WANT ONE Better put one down for my xmas list. Samanthas gonna have to start saving now !

Had a look at reflecmedia ages ago. Trouble is the expense. The price might come down though. Have to wait and see.

Thanks.