Comments

John_Cline wrote on 2/12/2009, 9:16 PM
If you mean Sony, probably not. Perhaps there will some sort of third party support via a VFW-compatible codec, but I wouldn't hold my breath.
Seth wrote on 2/18/2009, 7:19 AM
No. No plans to support RED, or any other digital cinema-oriented formats. There are some workarounds though. And they involve the more expensive versions of Cineform.
PerroneFord wrote on 2/18/2009, 8:58 AM
There are numbers of options. And not all are expensive. The one's I use are free in fact. And I drop nice 4k RED files into Vegas 8.1
Seth wrote on 2/18/2009, 12:31 PM
"The one's I use are free in fact"

I think the original post was about native R3D support, but please share the details of your baked-in workflow.
Yoyodyne wrote on 2/18/2009, 12:36 PM
+1, I would love to hear Red/Vegas workflow details.
jabloomf1230 wrote on 2/18/2009, 5:08 PM
There is a R3D plugin that allows VirtualDub to read Red files. Maybe you could frameserve them to Vegas:

http://arenafilm.hu/alsog/vdr3d/

PerroneFord wrote on 2/18/2009, 5:36 PM
I use 1 of two methods depending on what I need in Vegas.

IF I need quick and dirty 8-bit files, then I use hte Virtualdub plugin.. It works well, but audio support is in beta. This is generally not a problem as nearly no one shoots R3D with audio anyway..

If I need 10-bit RGB or YUV then I use RedCine and export the video in DNxHD (10-bit YUV) or as an image sequence where I can get 16bit RGB.

These tools are free.

As for native support, that's a completely different story, and I am not aware of ANY editors that allow you to just drop an R3D on the timeline. Maybe FCP will since that is what the RED team chose to support out of the gate.
jwcarney wrote on 2/18/2009, 5:48 PM
Are you referring to the QT plug-ins of DNxHD? If so, I thought Vegas didn't recognize 10bit qt codecs.
Yoyodyne wrote on 2/18/2009, 5:59 PM
Great info guys! How is the preview performance with the DNx HD files? Any gotcha stuff to be aware of?
PerroneFord wrote on 2/18/2009, 6:36 PM
Yes I am. Vegas recognizes the 10-bit QT stuff just fine. It does NOT recognize the 10-bit AVI stuff. Or at least it won't write to it. The Blackmagic 10-bit codec seems to work ok, and I use that back and forth in 8.0 and 8.1.

Basically the VFW OS piece that Vegas leverages to handle AVI files is only 8-bit aware. The QT container operates outside of VFW so does not have this limitation.
PerroneFord wrote on 2/18/2009, 6:39 PM
Preview performance is quite poor. Nature of the game. So I work with 10 bit SD or smaller sized proxy files for editing, and then media replace when necessary.

For RED that's 720x406 for 16:9, or 720x360 for 2:1.

The online/offline workflow is pretty standard in the film industry, so I just mirror that workflow for RED and generally for higher end HD projects also.
Yoyodyne wrote on 2/18/2009, 7:26 PM
Thanks for the info PerroneFord, much appreciate it.

I'm exploring workflow options for dealing with the Red camera & the Red Scarlet stuff that theoretically will be coming out at the end of this year. So far it looks like Final Cut is the most known quantity for working with the files but I was curious as to the Vegas options.

My main concern is preview and playback quality/speed. Does anyone here have any experience with the Cineform options? I've used a proxy file workflow on some projects but I would like to avoid it if possible.

PerroneFord wrote on 2/18/2009, 7:46 PM
I've tested the Cineform workflow as well. It's certainly a lot faster than any .mov workflow, but the fact is, when you're pushing around 2k+ of data, it's pretty taxing on the computer. I've worked with Cineform Raw up to 2k. With a modern machine (quadcore / dual quad / i7) it should be plenty fast. On older hardware, proxy still makes sense, or you have to be more patient.

The other thing about the RED files is that if you output them from RedCine as a series of images, you don't HAVE to work with them as a .mov. You can create TIFs, Targas, Jpegs, or even OpenEXRs which I just downloaded a reader for last week.

Lots of options in RED. But Macs and specifically FCP have the most variety of workflow.
ddm wrote on 2/19/2009, 2:16 PM
Premiere cs 4 just came out with an update that supports Red natively. It has templates for all red resolutions and you can just import the qts and drop them on the timeline.Seems to work really well, too.
jwcarney wrote on 2/22/2009, 1:59 PM
Cool, being able to use DNxHD 220 (10bit 4:2:2) would be wonderful, even if the final output is 8bit.
Now I have to find a tool that will convert from 10bit 4:2:2 uncompressed to QT.

I'm hoping dvfilm/raylight add avc intra to their QT toolbox soon.