This issue was ranted about in another thread. There is a difference in the way Vegas and (seemingly) every other NLE and compositor counts time.

Vegas doesn't round down to 29.97 as everyone else does. Instead it carries the digits way out. It's more accurate, but it won't agree with anyone else's rendered files.

I'm a little unsure about it but I THINK that Vegas repeats a frame around frame number 88 in your project. This is to compensate for the difference noted above. The next point this happens is over 9 hours into the timeline.

If you are worried about seeing the repeated frame then you should add at least 5 seconds of leader or black to the head of the premiere project and then render.

In your case the issue is that you cut by frame number and Vegas added a frame. Unfortunately, you need to know this is going to happen and then add a frame to all of your numbers (after 88, I think)

Others want to chime in?

Rob Mack

Actually, I thought it sounded like he just split in the wrong place! (1 frame left of where he should have)

seconded, jet.

You should just pick one program and stick with it, any time you are trying to transfer stuff between and infereior product, like premiere and a great program like Vegas you will run into problems. Just do everything in Vegas from now on and you should be fine :)

seconded, jsnkc...

I did have about 30 seconeds of leader on the front of the files.

And as for splitting one frame off - I did a frame by frame advance until the first frame of clip B, for example, was visible. That's where I did the split. When I apply the filters, it appears correct - the final frame of clip A, as seen on an external monitor, has the filters for clip A, while advancing to the next frame shows the first frame of clip B with the clip B filters applied. But as soon as I render (or even prerender), the first frame of clip B (on the external monitor) becomes the final frame of clip A. The video output now shows a DIFFERENT frame than the timeline, even though this did NOT appear prior to rendering.

If I've got a setting wrong somewhere, fine. But this also isn't consistent - some rendered files have this error, others don't. So I don't believe there is any way for me to make my splits in a different spot in order to compensate for this bug/error/feature.

As I said, I would love to just recreate the timeline in Vegas and do everything there. But the fact is, there is no way to get the timeline into Vegas - Vegas won't import the EDL's properly. And even cleaning up this split/error business by hand would still be less time-consuming than recreating a seventy-five minute timeline with a few thousand cuts.

Premiere is hardly "infereior", unless you are still using version 4. Since 5.1 and for sure with 6 and 6.5 Premiere is very serious NLE. I am more into the SoFo items like Sound Forge and Vegas because on an AUDIO level SoFo has it down. VV with version 4 is now very good and is very close to being a Premiere 'killer'. I said this before in a post I made but it would be awesome if there was a way to import a Premiere project into VV 4.0b. The EDL export/import does not work very well so unless you want to re-start the edting you have to render out from Premiere and then bring it into VV. Why do that? In my case I like the audio mixing, and now with 5:1 even more so, in VV. Also with 4.0b I can also convert to 24P.

As for the issue at hand - yeah it could be as simple as being one frame off but here is another thing - based on other threads here there is an issue with the frame rate in other NLE's rounding off and VV being more precise. So couldn't the one frame added thing be this issue as well? In theory couldn't VV be adding that weird extra frame at the split? I have noticed this a few times myself when I export and bring into VV. Where I split the file I can frame by frame through it and it is perfect but upon a render where that split is I suddenly have the same problem redrogue5 talks of.

The main problem that I have with Premiere is that it, like most other NLE's, is a lot harder to work with than it needs to be. The last version I used was version 6 and it seems like it took forever just to do simple tasks that can be done in a couple mouseclicks in Vegas. I think premiere and vegas are probably very similar in a lot of aspects, but for ease of use and the learning curve, Vegas has to win hands down.

Sounds like Vegas 4.1 when it exists, presumably to be publicized worldwide by Sony, should have a killer NLE import feature...

Filmy, you ARE on topic. For those following, the issue isn't Premiere. It's taking the premiere render and recutting it in Vegas.

Red, sounds like this bit about a rounding difference between Vegas and Premiere isn't the issue. Here are the possibilities I can think of:

1. It really is a bug
2. To advance a frame you use Alt+left or right arrow. If you just use the left or right arrows alone the cursor moves by one screen pixel. Depending on your magnification level this can be one or more frames.
3. I can't think of a third possibility right now.

What to do... How about this: Take your render and put it on a track in vegas. Use it as a visual guide to lay out the clips in a second set of tracks. Cut the clips to match the rendered Premiere project.

In the rendered file track you can set markers at the cuts and then in the raw clip tracks you can take advantage of snapping to markers to size up the media. That'll get you in the ballpark.

Does premiere have a feature that allows you to save a project and it's media to a new location and trim all the media down as it does it? That might help a little, maybe.

Doesn't sound like fun.

Rob Mack

I was careful to only go one frame at a time, using the timecode as a reference.

In any event, I think I'm going to just rebuild the timeline in Vegas. I like your idea of trimming the project in Premiere - that will give me a pretty good guideline of what goes where. Is there a script for automatically setting in and out points on a clip, so I can keep heads and tails on the trimmed media?

I THINK I know what you're asking. I don't know what Premiere can do though.

The vegas trimmer can save regions to the media file from the trimmer (only). My guess is that if you could do this in Premiere then you could browse the media files in Vegas and drag the regions up to the timeline. You'd then use the file that was rendered in premiere as a guide to placing the clips in a track above it.

To recap, you'd want to set regions on the media files from within Premiere and then use those regions in Vegas. If you can do that then there's no reason to trim down the media files from within premiere.

Sure would be better if there was some way to use an EDL. That would give you a start.

Rob Mack