RoundTripping to/from FCP: DNxHD rejected by FCP

fausseplanete wrote on 7/24/2010, 2:01 PM
From Vegas, rendered a 720p50 project to DNxHD for roundtrip to FCP and back. Created a custom preset for that render, under QuickTime. Under Compression config, no option seen for 720p50, so picked nearest-matching, namely 720p59.94 DNxHD 145 8-bit, RGB mode. Resulting file size was about same as Cineform, which is encouraging.

In Mac-land, with the latest free (LE) version of DNxHD installed, played successfully in QuickTime player, even looked correct, but FCP complained "Codec not found". That thing (FCP) is so finnecky!

So please what's the way to success here (for 720p50) ?

Comments

PerroneFord wrote on 7/24/2010, 6:00 PM
What version of FCP were you using??? That's strange as I'd done this workflow with about 6 FCP people without issue. I've had other friends doing this workflow as well. The fact that it plays properly in quicktime on the Mac leads me to think it's an FCP issue. Can you do a Log and Transfer and bring it in?
fausseplanete wrote on 7/25/2010, 12:39 AM
Perrone, thanks for responding, trying desperately to maintain rationalism over the jinx theory here...

I have FCP 7.0.2 running on Leopard at the moment (no Snow).

The DNxHD format I rendered to first was:
<<<
HD 1280x720
50 fps
Progressive
PAR 1.0
Avid DNxHD Codec
24 bpp color
Quality 50% (The default - I know you recommend 100% but it looked OK so I left it)
Configure: [RGB, 720p59.94 DNxHD 145 8-bit]
>>>

Subsequently I tried Configure: [RGB 720p50 DNxHD 185 8-bit]
..yes there was a 720p50 option after all, it was just right at the bottom of the scroll-list where I didn't expect it...
But it didn't change anything.

Not sure if the Configure info gets retained as part of the Vegas render profile or whether its only remembered by the codec (in which case one would have to check it each time).

I'll try some more experiments, including your suggested L&T.

David
fausseplanete wrote on 7/25/2010, 12:49 AM
Log & Transfer says: "unsupported media or has an invalid directory structure".
It says that for both of my rendered DNxHD files.

Also on the Mac, VideoSpec recognizes it OK and says Components (i.e. codec) Installed. Interestingly it also says the Chroma subsampling format is YUV422p i.e. YUV not RGB - so does "RGB" in the Configuration just mean "Full Range" (0..255) but still encode as YUV ?

I will next try the same experiments on a different Mac running Snow Leopard.
fausseplanete wrote on 7/25/2010, 4:58 AM
On the Mac, made sure I had the latest proper version of DNxHD for Mac. I had what looks like a later (beta?) version installed, namely AvidCodecsLE2.2.1.pkg.zip that I got from Googling on [avid dnxhd donload], as opposed to AvidCodecsLE-2 which is what is linked from the more official [www.avid.com/dnxhd].

First had to uninstall. Found the DNxHD uninstaller via [Mac: Spotlight: uninstall].

Made no difference though - same error. Experimentation continues...
fausseplanete wrote on 7/25/2010, 5:10 AM
Same error on a different Mac, that one running Snow Leopard. Took care that the correct DNxHD codec was installed (freshly) there.

Will next check the DNxHD codec version on the Windows/Vegas system...
fausseplanete wrote on 7/25/2010, 5:38 AM
On the Windows system, reinstalled (uninstalled then installed) DNxHD, ensuring the correct version (I think it was already, on this system, but hey, fresh start to be certain). From Vegas, rendered to DNxHD 720p50 etc., as before except this time with Quality=100% same as Perrone's established method. Resulting file was no larger than at Quality=50% (reassuring - I had feared it might have been).

Same error when trying to use in FCP7 though (while playing fine on same system's QTplayer), so wondering what to try/investigate next...
fausseplanete wrote on 7/25/2010, 7:34 AM
Someone else had the same problem (so it's not just me!):
http://discussions.apple.com/thread.jspa?messageID=11619653
That person is using an entirely different set of settings to myself.

The only reply he received suggests:
"FCP cannot have a sequence setting of DNxHD. This is an Avid codec. He will need to either use an FCP codec and render the footage, or convert the footage from DNxHD to something that FCP is compatible with. FCP 6 or later can edit DNxHD files, but I wonder if it only works on files that came from Avid...? "
fausseplanete wrote on 7/25/2010, 7:59 AM
Tried DNxHD setting 32 bpp instead of 24 bpp but no difference.

Dragged into FCP timeline, despite "Codec not found" error. It displays the audio waveform but will not play or do anything, even of video stream deleted. Preview shows red. Tried different Sequence Settimngs but to no avail.

FCP correctly describes its properties.

Is there something I need to do to FCP to make it more aware of DNxHD? Some kind of codecs-refresh in FCP?
fausseplanete wrote on 7/25/2010, 8:17 AM
Sounds to me like the fundamental problem is that FCP is not aware of the installed DNxHD at all, not some pernickety format issue as I had first imagined.

FCP Audio/Video settings: none of the sections ("Sequence Presets" etc.) include any entries for Avid or DNxHD - should they?

Tried exporting a conventional FCP-based project to DNxHD but no "Avid" or "DNxHD" options listed. Should there be?

I appreciate this is getting off the Vegas topic now, but didn't realise at the outset it would go that way - I had assumed my Vegas render was wrong.
fausseplanete wrote on 7/27/2010, 7:50 PM
On the Avid-Mac forum http://community.avid.com/forums/p/84564/477328.aspx#477328, found someone else with same issue. Like me they rendered from Sony Vegas to DNxHD to import to FCP, and like me the media wasn't recognized.

Thus far, that thread is inconclusive, with suspicions focussing on the precise format settings etc. and the fact that the media was rendered from Sony Vegas (as I guess the latter is relatively "unknown territory" to the Avid/DNxHD folks).
apit34356 wrote on 7/27/2010, 8:05 PM
Fausseplanete, a smalll but critical point; the codec DNxHD does all the encoding of the video stream, vegas does not touch the encoding process. At most, vegas may update the file headers and starting meta data as it closes the file. If Sony has an issue it will be there, but I would question FCP file handling when it opening the file.