Switch away from YT into VP I get higher pitch - Why?

Grazie wrote on 3/15/2019, 9:27 AM

More to the point, how do I retain the SAME Pitch?

Grazie

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Comments

rraud wrote on 3/15/2019, 9:50 AM

Do you mean 'pitch' in terms of sound? If so, that is typically a sample rate related. For instance playing back a 44.1kHz audio file at 48kHz would speed up playback slightly and raise the note some as well. Very similar to a 'pitch' speed control on a pro reel-to-reel audio tape machine.

Grazie wrote on 3/15/2019, 10:19 AM

@rraud Hiyah! Yes, this I know. Try and imagine this: In YT I’ve got a 1k Test tone. It’s playing nicely and registers correctly on my Oscilloscope. CHECK! Now, I switch away from YT and clicks into VP and..... the tone playing over my system increases goes up in tone. In all that’s Beethoven, why? I don’t have the 1k tone in or on the Timeline. And yes, I placed a 1k tone in VP and the tone plays correctly at the correct tone.

Grazie

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bvideo wrote on 3/15/2019, 11:01 AM

In starting up YT, the audio driver setting for playback sample Hz gets changed to whatever YT wants; Vegas has given up the driver presumably. In returning to Vegas, the setting is apparently restored by Vegas. Whatever is already playing, i.e. the 1k test tone from YT (I presume has not been terminated and is playing in the background), is now being played at Vegas' chosen driver setting. YT doesn't know about that, so doesn't resample its background signal to be played at the different rate.

All this depends on the driver models & settings chosen by Vegas & Youtube. Sorry, I don't know how to solve this right off. I looked briefly but didn't find any sample Hz setting in Youtube, but you probably don't want to change your Vegas setting just to match YT. Hope this helps a little anyway.

Grazie wrote on 3/15/2019, 11:35 AM

In starting up YT, . . .

@bvideo - All that makes sense, yes.

I looked briefly but didn't find any sample Hz setting in Youtube,

Sure, understood.

but you probably don't want to change your Vegas setting just to match YT.

Correct. I'm doing my own Q&A with regard to Tone for my SillyScope and confirming or denying the validity of the same: Run a YT Tone and checking back and forth in VP and at this point I "stumbled" on this.

Hope this helps a little anyway.

Yes you do, very muchly . . .

But . . But . . another conundrum:

Imported a Sony 1kHz tone and a 1kHz tone generated in SF10 . . Guess what folks, that are NOT the same. I sheep-dipped both through iZoRX6Ad Frequency Anayliser and got these numbers:

SoundForge = 0.999kHz

SONY = 1.002kHz

I'm not a complete FreqSquinter, but there is a markedly Police siren DahDoohDahDooh result going on. I wonder if MAGIX is aware?

Grazie

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bvideo wrote on 3/15/2019, 2:13 PM

Would you like to post mediainfo of those two files? You've got me curious. So I'll see if I can find the Sony tone & try generating in SF.

Grazie wrote on 3/15/2019, 2:20 PM

Would you like to post mediainfo .....

Sure thing. Won’t be today.

So I'll see if I can find the Sony tone & try generating in SF.

Thank you!

 

Grazie

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bvideo wrote on 3/15/2019, 4:49 PM

@Grazie I've not found the Sony 1kHz tone yet. Also, in RX6 Adv I've not found a frequency analyzer that gives any exact number. The spectrum analyzer just shows a blob around 1000Hz. I'm not convinced mediainfo will show anything useful. (I was interested in length, sample Hz, and number of samples).

In SF9 I generated two 1kHz test tones, 44.1kHz sample rate and 48kHz, each 1 second long. SF's statistics report 1000.00 zero crossings per second (I think they mean 1/2 of the zero crossings) for each. Maybe SF10 statistics zero crossings will say something about your two files.

But just to show the vagaries of integer arithmetic, when I resampled the 44.1 wav to 48, SF's statistics now reported 999.00 zero crossings. Then I mixed its inverse to the generated 48, I did not get all zeroes. I got a very low-level waveform with 1235.00 zero crossings.

zdogg wrote on 3/15/2019, 5:55 PM

Please let some of us know what is YT?

JackW wrote on 3/15/2019, 6:11 PM

YouTube, perhaps?

Grazie wrote on 3/15/2019, 9:01 PM

YouTube, perhaps?

Definitely! 😉

Grazie

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Grazie wrote on 3/16/2019, 12:20 AM

OK - Searching for "Convergence of Logic" for this Topic:

@rraud - Project Settings at 44.1

@bvideo - Timeline for the two Samples:

@bvideo - Media Properties both revealing 44.1 kH:

@bvideo - iZoRX6 Adv Spectrum Analyzer

Sound Forge 10 : 996.5

SONY Sample Tone : 1049

"Convergence of Logic" for this Topic:

I was wanting to know WHY clicking away from YT into VP I get PITCH rise. @bvideo has indicated how this could or maybe happening.

However . . . .

I wanted to acquire some Evidenced Based Results by using Test Tones to determine where or how this was happening. But all this did was to introduce a secondary complication in that it revealed that there is a rise in PITCH comparing the TWO sources. SF is low and SONY is high.

Any thoughts?

Grazie

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bvideo wrote on 3/16/2019, 2:21 AM

@Grazie Now the thought I'm thinking is maybe the spectrum analyzer is not a perfect indicator of pitch. After all, we "know" the display of frequency for a pure tone should be like this: __|__, not like a termite mound. The broad spread of energy and the other artifacts in those displays, like the 3rd & 5th harmonic of the Sony and the wiggles in the SF sample are probably a result of FFT analyzing signals that aren't infinite and maybe some imprecision in the way those samples were made.

There is another way to compare those sample files. It would involve inverting one of the samples and then mixing the two (with level matching). Using your Vegas timeline should work fine. If they are identical, there would be silence (almost*). If they differ by say 1Hz, then they would go in and out of phase with each other, so the sound would get louder and softer, once per second (the "difference tone" or "beat frequency"). If they differ by much less than 1Hz, one might have to extend the two tracks by "looping" those samples to get to the beat frequency. If much more than 1Hz, say 40 Hz, then one would hear a bass note.

-------

* - "almost" because clearly they are not identical, as those spectrum displays seem to indicate. But probably very small differences that one would have to amplify to be able to hear.

Grazie wrote on 3/16/2019, 4:49 AM

@bvideo - So I looped the Tracks together

Phase Invert doesn't tell me much. OK, being pragmatic, whether by Izo or using my Scope, they are different by a country mile. I quickly videoed the Scope very badly and capturing the Audio Oscillations as a file, and then dropped onto a VP Timeline.See here I get nice Amplitude Modulation:

Erm . . ? Now what?

Grazie

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bvideo wrote on 3/16/2019, 9:21 AM

@Grazie They sure are different frequencies. And your beautiful phase invert measured the difference. The frequency of that pattern of amplitude modulation shows the numerical difference between the frequencies of the two files (when comparing two sine waves). Of course we are way out of the realm of Vegas here. We are comparing two claimed digital sources of a 1kHz sine signal that disagree. The two little spikes at 3k and 5k in the Sony wave already made me suspicious it was not cleanly created. Maybe it is just "good enough" for level calibrations. (It's fun to note that Sony has had a hand in creating both files...)

One other comparison that can be made is to bring them each into Sound Forge and do Tools->Statistics for each and look for the number of 0 crossings. I believe for a sine wave, that statistic would equal the frequency. (SF seems to count only the 0 crossings in one direction, because really a sine wave crosses 0 twice per cycle: once going up and once going down.)

The 1kHz file I created in SF said 1000.00 zero crossings per second. Interesting to know what SF would say about the Sony file.