Trimming, Trimeline Scrubbing and Keyframes

Aegis Kleais wrote on 7/12/2008, 3:03 PM
Today's topics "Trimming", "Timeline Scrubbing" & "Keynote adjustments"

Trimming
I just found the Trimmer, but have a couple questions on its use. I see how I can set the "IN" and "OUT" points. But I end up having to "CREATE A SUBCLIP" to have a separate file in the PROJECT ORGANIZER. I take it this is so that you can keep the original, but make separate smaller clips. Am I right in that assumption?

Timeline Scrubbing
In Photoshop, you can hold the SPACEBAR to turn the cursor into the HAND TOOL to quickly move about the canvas. Is there a similar ability in Vegas for its timeline without using the scrollbars?

Keyframes
My familiarity with "Keyframes" is what I learned in Flash. They define moments where attributes change, or mark begin/end points where an effect gradually changes from its properties at the beginning to the properties at the end.

If Vegas does similarly, I'm having a hard time finding out how this is done. For example, if I have an audio track, and I want it's volume to fade from current value to 0 from frames 10 - 200, how do I go about doing this? I would figure I'd need to set keyframes, and then modify the volume properties and (maybe) tell Vegas to "tween" the values from one to the other (or is that done automatically rather than abruptly? Once I've done this, I need to find out how to do similar keyframing with Effects and Transitions

BONUS QUESTION!
Is there a way, when importing a video track that is accompanied with audio, to "detatch" the audio from video and either (a) offset the audio so it's not in sync with the video or (b) remove the audio entirely?

Right now, I just click the MUTE button on the timeline track.

Comments

reberclark wrote on 7/12/2008, 3:28 PM
JackW wrote on 7/12/2008, 3:41 PM
To which I would add: if that doesn't do it for you, buy Spot's VAAST DVD set detailing the use of Pro8. It's worth every penny.

Jack
rmack350 wrote on 7/12/2008, 4:23 PM
It's odd and off-putting to construct a set of questions as if you were the instructor. Who gets the bonus?

There is a PDF manual as well as online help. I'd really recommend that you start with the manual. After that you'll be able to narrow down the questions. But, because I'm a compulsive question answerer, here's a vague stab at it:

Trimmer - You can do all sorts of things with it including making subclips and regions. You can also just pick a stretch of media and add it to the timeline directly, without creating a bin object. That's probably what most people do. Look in the manual for Regions, Trimmer, and the Vegas Explorer. It's a useful feature. (There are also all sorts of things people wish the trimmer could do, but it doesn't)

Timeline scrubbing - Vegas to Photoshop is a lousy comparison. Vegas to Flash might have been better in your case since at least they both have a timeline. Anyway, there are lots of keyboard shortcuts that can get you around the timeline, including variations on the scroll wheel. Personally, I like JKL, Page-up/down, and ctrl left/right. That covers what I do, which is pretty limited.

Keyframes - yes, a keyframe is still a keyframe and does what keyframes do. However, In Vegas keyframes appear in the course of other actions, like applying filters, pan/crop, adding an envelope, Audio FX automation, things like that. It's the opposite of flash, where you'd set a keyframe before making changes. In Vegas, the change usually sets a keyframe automatically if a keyframe can be set.

The bonus question - it's a bonus for you, not for me. Yes, you can move, unsink, and delete audio separately from video.

Rob Mack
Aegis Kleais wrote on 7/12/2008, 4:27 PM
The "BONUS" question was moreso a "joke" along the same lines. I see an "Interactive Tutorial" in the Help section and will give that the once through.
rmack350 wrote on 7/12/2008, 4:40 PM
I think it was seen more as a bonus punishment on top of a load of chores. ;-)

Rob
Aegis Kleais wrote on 7/12/2008, 6:34 PM
I have figured out how to do all the above.
TGS wrote on 7/12/2008, 6:42 PM
I've read the manual enough times, that I don't bother anymore. I just come here. I'll waste way too much time getting side-tracked, whenever I get the manual out. Both trying to solve my problem and getting trapped reading stuff I don't need to waste my time reading then. It's much easier to understand answers here, when you get to hear multiple viewpoints.

In Vegas, you go to "Insert", then 'Audio Envelopes' then choose 'Volume' (or Pan if you need it). A Blue line (default color) will appear at the equator of the volume track. You can either double left click or right click and choose 'add point' and it will add a dot to the line. Put 2 together at the beginning of the Volume change and put 2 more, together at the end of your change. Now "grab the center part of that line and drag up to increase volume or down to cut it. You can figure the rest from here.

EDIT: Aaahhhrrrrrrggggg. Missed it by ......... that much.
Aegis Kleais wrote on 7/12/2008, 6:58 PM
Whoa, TGS.

I didn't know THAT trick! So THAT's an envelope eh? Nice! Is there a way to define an envelope for both channels in a stereo track automatically (if not, can we create one and then dupe it over?)
TGS wrote on 7/12/2008, 7:08 PM
You have your choice. Either one envelope controls both the tracks at the same time, equally. If you need to control both the left and right sides, independently, right click on the audio track and select 'copy'. Then copy that track right under the present track. Then right click on top track and go down to 'Channels', then select "Left only". Then do the same for the copied track, except select 'Right only". This separates your channels and you then apply a volume envelope to each.
Aegis Kleais wrote on 7/12/2008, 7:37 PM
Ok, so aside from duplicating and setting each channel to left/right only, you're saying the envelope I place in a stereo track, though only appear on the top (left) channel, is actually affecting both?
PeterWright wrote on 7/12/2008, 8:43 PM
Yes - it can equally appear below the half-way line if the volume is set at a minus Db.

There is another, red envelope which TGS mentioned above - Pan ("P" key after selecting track), which can direct how the stereo mix is output.
crocdoc wrote on 7/12/2008, 8:50 PM
I'm a relative newbie to Vegas, too.

What I recommend is for you to buy the Vegas Editing Workshop book by Douglas Spotted Eagle to learn the basics.

Use the search function on this forum - it's quite a good search engine as far as forum search engines go (I've seen some atrocious ones on forums relating to one of my other hobbies).

Then do a search on youtube for assorted 'how to' videos done by end users.
MarkWWW wrote on 7/13/2008, 5:21 AM
In a stereo track you would control the overall level with a Volume envelope and the relative levels of the left and right channels with a Pan envelope.

As well as the book and training videos suggested hereabouts, you might like to have a look at the free tutorial videos on the Sony webite. There are several for Vegas Pro, and it's also worth looking at the videos intended for the cheap version, VMS, as most of what is shown in them also applies to the full version of Vegas.

Mark
nepule wrote on 7/13/2008, 7:05 AM
Buy the Sony Digital Video & Audio Production by Gary Rebholz and Douglas's Editing Workshop, these answer just about all you need to know. Money well spent......
Aegis Kleais wrote on 7/13/2008, 8:11 AM
I've heard a lot of good things about Vegas Pro 8 Editing Workshop with DVD by DSE, and I'm not much on reading (despise it, to be honest), but I'm willing to put down the coin for a good book, and many people seem to recommend this one.
rmack350 wrote on 7/13/2008, 10:19 AM
While you may despise reading, here you are on a forum that is entirely text, so it's obviously not impossible.

Reading a manual or looking at help files isn't like reading a novel. You can skim it for what you need and you can skip back and forth.

I understand hating to read. I have an old friend who's dyslexic and reading is a chore for him, but he's also an engineer, currently finishing up a business MA, and also starting a charter sailing business. He has to read. He just doesn't read for pleasure. For that he can do books on tape.

I hate to belabor the point, but if this forum is the first place you go when you have a question then you're mining other people's time and effort when you could have looked it up first. That's selfish. It'd be a great courtesy to others if you would go do your homework first and then come back with focused questions, rather than relying on others to do your homework for you. As you can see here, people are more than willing to answer questions on narrower topics but they get peevish about the "How do I use Vegas" questions. We all know from past experience that a person asking that type of question will keep going for weeks or months without ever trying to do their own research.

Rob Mack

Aegis Kleais wrote on 7/13/2008, 11:35 AM
Reading an electronic format and a paperback one are actually two rather different experiences due to the medium by which they are presented. I can read a 400 page PDF, but don't prefer to do likewise with mundane paper-based formats. As expected, most resources are not provided in this manner.

I come from a forum (a Photoshop one) where the community is ALMOST similar to this one. They are more than glad to answer questions, but they don't do free work (and that's understandable) whereas here it seems that they share a similar belief that asking for free work is a no-no, but they also require a prerequisite of reading through help files, tutorials, extra books, manuals or related readings, which is understandably harder to meet.
rmack350 wrote on 7/13/2008, 3:33 PM
Actually, no one is really asking that you read through a list of materials, but at least three of us suggested that you read something before asking vague and general questions. You can usually get to a starting point just by skimming the manual (a downloadable PDF document) for 15 minutes.

People here love to answer questions but appreciate knowing that the questioner has at least tried to do their homework.

Rob
Aegis Kleais wrote on 7/13/2008, 4:16 PM
Exactly. The same difference I stated in the last post about the difference between this forum and the Photoshop one. In the PS one, we just don't want people askin us to do free work. We have a guy who's first response to every question for help is "Do a google search", which is not to say it's a bad answer, he's just trying to teach someone to fish rather than giving them one.