Comments

r56 wrote on 5/17/2005, 5:34 PM
I confirm it but…
It is notable only when "All Tracks Markers and Regions" ripple mode is enabled and only one video and audio event is present and you delete one of the two events.

I wouldn't consider it a bug, it's the way ripple is performed and in this particular case only it may be an annoyance.

If you put two video events with their corresponding audio events on the timeline you will notice that if you delete the audio of the second event its corresponding video event will move to the left and get hidden under the first event. (Similarly if you delete the video event the audio will move to the left and get hidden)

Now if you delete the audio of the first event its corresponding video won't be able to move to the left before the start to hide so it becomes as short as possible and gets hidden by the second event that moves to the left in its place and covers it. (After you delete the event you have to disable ripple and move the events to the right to see the hidden event, if you move the events with ripple on, the hidden event will remain hidden, as it will be following the other events underneath)

Of course in the case you described the result of the ripple, which is that tiny event, stays exposed since there isn't any event following after it to cover it.

A solution could be to have "All Tracks Markers and Regions" ripple mode "ignore" a single video-audio event on the timeline.

Vassias
rmack350 wrote on 5/17/2005, 10:09 PM
It does this because the event's already at zero and it's "group partner", the video stream, gets moved back by the length of the deleted audio, back into negative timecode land.

Right. Not really a bug. Just buglike behavior. Ideally, Vegas shouldn't allow you to ripple things into areas before 00:00:00;00 on the timeline.

What seems even more buglike is that just because I deleted one member of an AV pair, everything ripples. Even though the other part of the pair is still present! Why would anyone want that?

Are we expected to constantly turn ripple on and off? Then why not include a dead-man's key to auto ripple? (I mean a key to make auto ripple work only as long as you hold the key down)

Rosebud, you should report this anyway, even though it's not a exactly a bug.
Rosebud wrote on 5/17/2005, 11:02 PM
Thanks to all.

I never noticed this behavior in V5, so i consider it is a V6 bug.

I have reported it to Sony.
farss wrote on 5/18/2005, 12:09 AM
Ripple Edit aka Ripple Destroy has been a disaster since V4. It's never gotten better and I suspect due to the way Vegas works it never will. The way Vegas treats the A/V pair of captured media is equally disasterous. The 'feature' added in V6 that attempts to 'fix' this is kind of quaint, why spend time writing code to find a problem produced because the code doesn't work properly in the first place. It makes me more certain that there's a fundamental flaw in the design.

Despite all the wonderous things Vegas does it still falls down as a basic editor.
Rosebud wrote on 5/18/2005, 12:55 AM
Despite all the wonderous things Vegas does it still falls down as a basic editor.

I totally agree with this.
Like i have already said, Vegas have some uncomprehending lacks.
Video Editor needed "robust" basic editing feature rather than complex compositing feature.
By occulting this, Sony loses many professional users.
Paul_Holmes wrote on 5/18/2005, 2:23 AM
Hmmmm . . . maybe that's why I never use ripple edit except for the first basic cuts. Never thought of it as buggy, just seemed to get in my way at the wrong times and I just worked around it by turning it off.
farss wrote on 5/18/2005, 2:54 AM
I'd never accuse it of being 'buggy', what it does is 100% reliably wrong. What's never been explained, in fact not even a single word from the Madison team, is why this hasn't or cannot be fixed.
I'm suspecting the problem to some extent lies in how Vegas treats audio tracks, they're all treated the same.
In a somewhat lenghty thread sometime ago regarding EDLs it was mentioned that other NLEs name the audio track of an AVI pair differently to the other audio tracks. Vegas doesn't do this. There's no special relationship between your camera's vision and audio tracks, the best we get is they're grouped but the grouping can easily be lost or removed by the user.
Bob.
jlafferty wrote on 5/18/2005, 6:49 AM
Huh. Never lost grouping of events before. Strikes me as more of an issue of knowing how Vegas works, and working with it, and less an issue of it being "buggy". Personally, I had rarely, rarely used ripple edit, but with V6's implementation, I'm loving it. I have it set to the middle setting (affected tracks, markers, regions...) and it works exactly as I need/want it to.

- jim
rmack350 wrote on 5/18/2005, 2:50 PM
Normally I've kept it off and then manually rippled. It's very reliable that way with one or two exceptions. (That's okay, I can remember that many exceptions).

Having a ripple occur when you've only deleted one member of an AV pair is pretty stupid because that's almost sure to be NOT what you wanted to do. But there are a variety of ways you might want ripple to work. I still think the dead-man's key is a good compromise. When autoripple is on the key should toggle it off, when autoripple is off, the key should toggle it on-and only while the key is pressed.

Rob Mack