Vegas 12 rendering 60p

John McCully wrote on 10/29/2012, 8:49 PM
Regarding Vegas 12 - I’m frequently shooting AVCHD 1920 x 1080 60p using either an HX200v or a NEX 5n and my question relates to rendering. I’m curious to know why Sony have not provided a 1920 x 1080 60p template but more importantly what do you recommend as the best template with what modifications that will give the best results with file size not a factor (within reason) nor internet publication (Vimeo, YouTube, whatever) a consideration.

Many thanks for your input.

John

Comments

PeterDuke wrote on 10/29/2012, 9:35 PM
Since you say internet delivery is not a consideration and 1920x1080 60p is not part of the Blu-ray standard, how do you propose to view, share or distribute your work?
Ron Windeyer wrote on 10/29/2012, 9:48 PM
Depends where you are viewing the footage and on what. You are probably aware that 1920 x 1080 60P is outside the normal specs, and will not go on a Bluray.
I have a similar issue - in PAL-land I shoot 1920 x 1080 50P. I am able to transfer the resulting mp4 file to a Playstation 3; this will play it, and the result is awesome.
I have used the Sony AVC/MVC template; this one I think carries over from V10. Now I am using the Main Concept template. Shots as follows:
https://www.dropbox.com/s/k9t4blmwuyccwtt/Render1.png
https://www.dropbox.com/s/pwyplbqmrzf1pgh/Render2.png

(BTW, don't be put off by the MainConcept template not having a 50 - or 60 - fps preset. You can type it in.)

Looks great for viewing on computer as well!
John McCully wrote on 10/29/2012, 9:49 PM
Thanks Peter, I have a very nice 24 inch high quality monitor, a modern fast computer and lots of visitors. I not infrequently share using a flash drive also. And of course I do DVD's and so forth but that's not my question; I know how to do that.
John McCully wrote on 10/29/2012, 9:54 PM
Thanks Ron, the drop box gave me an error. I have used that template, I think, and typing in alternate values as you suggest.
PeterDuke wrote on 10/29/2012, 10:41 PM
A hardware media player connected to your TV is another way to view your work. I use a Dune HD Base 3 because it will play Blu-ray ISO files with menus, but there are no doubt others that will play straight video files that would be suitable.
John McCully wrote on 10/30/2012, 12:26 AM
Thing is, Peter, I don't have a TV. Ha ha, I know...nothing worth watching and you only get what's offered. I'm a workstation addict and I don't have a significant other telling me off for always having my head stuck in the computer. With my 24 inch monitor along with a couple of Paradigm Studio Monitors connected to a NAD amp and a broadband connection to the internet...I mean why would I need a TV? I have a Blu Ray player in my computer I might add though I don't watch a lot of movies these days as I did once upon a time.

I do keep threatening to get a hardware media player to connect to other people's TVs but not high on my get list.

Cheers.
John McCully wrote on 10/30/2012, 12:31 AM
Ron those image files were most helpful. I copied them, more or less but substituting 50p for 60p even though I am currently living in a PAL country. They both seem to be just fine, thanks for that.
Ron Windeyer wrote on 10/30/2012, 1:57 AM
Great - glad to help!
Hogan773 wrote on 1/13/2013, 8:36 AM
HI - i realize this is several months old but I came across it on a search.

I am using Movie Studio but I assume it could apply here. I think I have the same question as OP. When I take AVI files from my old camcorder and edit them, and then render as AVI again, Vegas sails through it because it doesn't rerender everything, only places where there is an added effect or transition.

I have an HX9V camera and I take all movies at 1080 60p highest setting. I get all the little clips and I then like to edit them, combine them, etc into files for posterity. I choose to leave them in the best possible format for the future. From there yes I can downgrade to a DVD burn or something, but I want the archive to stay at 60p for now.

I can use Sony PMB software to "join" clips together and I THINK? that it doesnt rerender anything. But it is so clumsy to use for any sort of trimming that it takes more time than Vegas unless I am simply just joining a few clips.

Is there a template that allows Vegas to smart render the source? I've tried the existing ones as well as making a custom template and trying to follow as closely as I could the "specs" of theHX9V source file, but it still renders everything. I couldnt view those Dropbox links above as they may have been deleted now.

also is it true that if Vegas is rerendering everything even at 60p that I am "LOSING QUALITY" each time it does this?

Thanks for any advice, thanks
john_dennis wrote on 1/13/2013, 12:15 PM
This thread will start you on an odyssey of MPEG-4 cutters if you take all the links.
Hogan773 wrote on 1/14/2013, 4:43 PM
Hmmm - thanks. I think I came across that thread earlier in my search.

Appears that perhaps my free but clunky PMB software is indeed the tool to at least combine many of my segments (if I don't need to do lots of editing in the middle). I am pretty judicious with my video clips....I'll take 15 seconds or 30 seconds, and then turn it off and start again for a different shot (unlike Grandma who will leave it on record for about 15 minutes straight but then who the heck wants to watch 15 minutes of the kids playing). So I might end up with 3 or 4 little clips of the same general activity, and that's what I want to join up as a single clip for posterity.

The reason I thought I might get a trick was because my camera is SONY, and PMB is SONY, and Vegas Movie Studio is SONY so I was surprised that their free PMB has functionality that super-bad-arse Vegas doesn't contain........oh well I guess.

Am I correct in saying that if I just join 3 clips on Vegas and it rerenders, then I have "LOST" quality due to that event? I realize my eye will probably not notice such a loss, but I just want to know how it works technically.

Thanks
john_dennis wrote on 1/14/2013, 5:25 PM
"Am I correct in saying that if I just join 3 clips on Vegas and it rerenders, then I have "LOST" quality due to that event?"

This is a very good assumption for most codecs you would use to deliver your masterpiece. If you want to to make multiple passes at the edits, you should use a lossless or near lossless intermediate. Search the forum for DNxHD, Lagarith, Cineform, etc. You'll stumble over something. Many people (including me at times) use XDCAM (MXF) if you're just doing a generation or two. Search for Laurence and MXF.
JohnAsh wrote on 1/18/2013, 11:04 AM
<< Depends where you are viewing the footage and on what. You are probably aware that 1920 x 1080 60P is outside the normal specs, and will not go on a Bluray.
I have a similar issue - in PAL-land I shoot 1920 x 1080 50P. I am able to transfer the resulting mp4 file to a Playstation 3; this will play it, and the result is awesome.
I have used the Sony AVC/MVC template; this one I think carries over from V10. Now I am using the Main Concept template. Shots as follows:
https://www.dropbox.com/s/k9t4blmwuyccwtt/Render1.png
https://www.dropbox.com/s/pwyplbqmrzf1pgh/Render2.png

(BTW, don't be put off by the MainConcept template not having a 50 - or 60 - fps preset. You can type it in.) >>

I'm trying out various options on my new cam, which can record 1920x1080 50p. My WDTV will happily play back the MTS files from the camera. But I'm struggling to render any edited video in this format.

Having read this post, I thought I'd found the solution but, unfortunately, the dropbox images are no longer there.

I've looked through various render templates but cannot find where I can "type in" 50p into Main Concept templates.

Any help appreciated.
Ron Windeyer wrote on 1/18/2013, 6:14 PM
Oops - sorry! I guess I was a bit obsessive about "cleaning up"!

Try the Sony Tablet 1080P template; proceed as follows:

https://www.dropbox.com/s/k9t4blmwuyccwtt/Render1.png

Change a few parameters; TYPE IN 50 in the fps field, and you will have something like this:

https://www.dropbox.com/s/pwyplbqmrzf1pgh/Render2.png

If you want, for convenience, you can highlight the Sony Tablet 1080P title, change it and SAVE. You then have your own personalised template.

Best of luck.
JohnAsh wrote on 1/20/2013, 12:09 PM
That's great, Ron. Thanks. I'll give it a whirl.

John