"What I don't understand is how one can do without the AC3 encoder."

Lots of AC3 encoders out there. Export your tracks as wav files and import to something like AC3tools Pro (which costs all of $50 Canadian)

http://www.mediatwins.com/products/ac3tools_pro/index.html

I too am a person that bought the "stand alone" version of Vegas 8, without DVDA or AC3 encoding. I bought it on ebay from a "certified Vegas retailer." Ya, right. Whatever.

Well it took me a while to figure out what was going on after buying it though, because some of the online tutorials seemed to be do things I couldn't find features for. So once I did get it figured out, I was a bit miffed that I had spent $160ish for a copy of VP8, only to have to spend another $200+ on an upgrade from SCS. So now I own two copies of Vegas Pro 8, when all I need is one--because I can use it on 3 machines.

So I guess I'd have to vote against these stand alone versions. I understand that SCS may sell more copies of Vegas because of it, but if users aren't as committed as I was to learning the application, they may simply bolt when they find out they didn't get what they thought they were buying. And it isn't clearly *explained* on the website either. It's perfectly obvious, if you are familiar with Vegas and it's software family--but if that was the case, you probably be buying the stand alone version of Vegas...would you?

My $0.02.

TB

"but if users aren't as committed as I was to learning the application, they may simply bolt when they find out they didn't get what they thought they were buying. And it isn't clearly *explained* on the website either."

That's the other part I don't like about this. The sad lack of a clear "what's in the box" notice kind of makes Sony look a little sheepish. I have heard a number of upset people on other sites complaining about the fact that it clearly says you can "mix 5.1 tracks"... and you can... but then try and export your AC3.... FU@#$ @(&^&!!!

All in all... I think this whole thing gives SCS and Vegas a black eye.

Funny... I mentioned this B&H thing before in another thread and people didn't agree with me.

http://www.sonycreativesoftware.com/forums/ShowMessage.asp?ForumID=4&MessageID=588226

"but not being able to render AC3 audio from the editing timeline seems like a huge negative."
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You can make a DVD without using ac3.

Bob.
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"What I don't understand is how one can do without the AC3 encoder."
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Lots of AC3 encoders out there. Export your tracks as wav files and import to something like AC3tools Pro (which costs all of $50 Canad
Blink
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Space is the primary reason for AC3 as far as I am concerned. Less space for audio leaves more space for video of better quality.

What I said was that it "seems like a huge negative". It takes seconds to minutes or so to render the entire AC3 file right off the timeline in Vegas. Any other methods seem like a huge negative to me. Enough so that this cheap CD isn't worth it.

John

John,

You asked, "What I don't understand is how one can do without the AC3 encoder. I can understand using another authoring program to master the DVD instead of using DVDA, but not being able to render AC3 audio from the editing timeline seems like a huge negative. How are you encoding the Dolby Digital Audio?"

From Vegas Pro 8 (without DVDA aka B&H issue) I can render out to MPEG-2 video stream and a separate AC3 file. I do this on my quad-core machine.

However, on another machine I have a license for Vegas Movie Studio 8 Platinum which came with DVDA Studio and that can read in the MPEG-2 + AC3 streams and I finish my DVD there on a slower P4 2.8GHz machine.

What should I not be able to do from Vegas Pro timeline if I don't have DVDA? I don't seem to be missing anything so far -- keep in mind I don't make BluRay discs at the moment.

"Space is the primary reason for AC3 as far as I am concerned. Less space for audio leaves more space for video of better quality. "

I don't understand this. Are you saying that an AC3 soundtrack is smaller (in size) than a stereo stoundtrack? If so, by how much?

AC3 5.1 is compressed. PCM isn't. AC3 stereo is even smaller than 5.1.

John,

You asked, "What I don't understand is how one can do without the AC3 encoder. I can understand using another authoring program to master the DVD instead of using DVDA, but not being able to render AC3 audio from the editing timeline seems like a huge negative. How are you encoding the Dolby Digital Audio?"
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From Vegas Pro 8 (without DVDA aka B&H issue) I can render out to MPEG-2 video stream and a separate AC3 file. I do this on my quad-core machine.

However, on another machine I have a license for Vegas Movie Studio 8 Platinum which came with DVDA Studio and that can read in the MPEG-2 + AC3 streams and I finish my DVD there on a slower P4 2.8GHz machine.

What should I not be able to do from Vegas Pro timeline if I don't have DVDA? I don't seem to be missing anything so far.
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You linked the B&H CD version and said that is what you bought.

I said not having the AC3 encoder was a negative and explained why.

If you click on the B&H link and read the description it says "Does not include DVD Architect and AC-3 Encoder".

It sounds like from your post that it actually does have the AC3 encoder.

Is the B&H description wrong? Does it in fact have the AC3 encoder after all? Is it only missing DVDA contrary to the description on that page?

John

What should I not be able to do from Vegas Pro timeline if I don't have DVDA? I don't seem to be missing anything so far.

I think DVDA is what gives Vegas access to the AC3 Pro plug-in, which gives you more options as to how you encode the audio.

Without DVDA, you can only use the AC3 Studio encoder, which limits you to the default templates.

I think if a person *really* knew all the features of DVDA, you'd be surprised at what you could do. Gary Kleiner told me he was working on a DVD instructional course for DVDA right now, available within the next month or so. After being blown away by his Vegas Pro 8 training DVDs, I will be one of the first to buy his new release.

While I am sure there are many alternate choices for DVD authoring that people are using, upgrading to DVDA Pro is one of the best things I could have done. The seamless transition from Vegas Pro to DVDA has enabled me to spend my time learning the features of the software--not struggling to figure out why things aren't working between one format or another. And that to me is worth many times more than the upgrade price SCS charged me. In fact, they even gave me credit for the DVDA 'Studio' version I bought a week before the upgrade. It simply doesn't compare, IMHO.

TB

"I think DVDA is what gives Vegas access to the AC3 Pro plug-in, which gives you more options as to how you encode the audio."

That's correct. The AC3 encoder is located within DVDa.

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"If you click on the B&H link and read the description it says "Does not include DVD Architect and AC-3 Encoder".


I believe he is saying that he's using DVDa STUDIO that came with his Vegas Movie Studio package to render out the AC3.

It's only the Platinum version of VMS that has ac3:

From the VMSP help file:
"AC-3 and 5.1 surround are available only in Vegas Movie Studio Platinum software."

John,

No, the B&H version of Vegas Pro 8 did not come with a the pro version of the AC3 encoder. As AtomicGreymon said, I can 'Render As' only the Studio version of AC3 which has only two templates, Stereo with & without AGC turned on. No 5.1 encoding.

So now I see what I am missing without the AC3 encoder, but it for my purposes it's not a big loss. I was more interested in the scripting capabilities in Vegas Pro. Like I said, I'm going to see what the upgrade offers are when Vegas Pro 9 is released. For now I could probably use SVMS 8 Platinum if need to work on a 5.1 project I guess.

No, the B&H version of Vegas Pro 8 did not come with a the pro version of the AC3 encoder. As AtomicGreymon said, I can 'Render As' only the Studio version of AC3 which has only two templates, Stereo with & without AGC turned on. No 5.1 encoding.

I believe the Studio version does do 5.1... but for you to have access to those templates, the project you're rendering from needs to have 5.1 Audo selected instead of Stereo.