VV, Storm and RT.X100

rrrromz wrote on 11/6/2002, 1:52 PM
Does VV support the Canopus Storm2 or Matrox RT.X100 output AVI files? I'm considering of buying one of the two, but want to make sure I can still use my VV with it.

Does anyone know which one of the two is more stable? And, does the Storm2 can output to a DV file in realtime? I know the RT.X100 is advertised to do realtime output to DV file and Mpeg2.


swarrine wrote on 11/6/2002, 10:06 PM
No and no.

VV3 works with an OHCI firewire card. Realtime preview (sort of), render for output. The nice thing is that you can set it and forget it on the output render side of things. From what I have heard - no plans to hook up with an RT card. Personally, I think that is a bummer, but the theory is in the next couple of years computers will be so fast it won't matter.

I own a Storm and have seen the new Matrox. VV3 is still my first choice. No regrets.
CasaLoma wrote on 11/7/2002, 11:19 AM
I own the Storm/ Premiere setup. Alot of time to set it up properly. It does output DV in realtime if you dont exceed the limits (4 to 5 simultaneous filers and transtions). You get a realtime preview on a monitor as well. Analog capture.
MPEG2 encoding is at realtime on a P4 2 gig system.
Only problem is Premiere is crap. It crashes on a regular basis. The user interface is antiquated. I have recently switched to VV3 and loved every minute of it. No crashes. Easy install. Easy user interface. Did I mention no crashes.
All I use my Storm card for now is encoding MPEG2.
rrrromz wrote on 11/7/2002, 3:34 PM
Thank you all for responding. The reason why I am considering of buying one of the RT cards is because I wanted to be able to output my projects in realtime. I have done two events last September, back-to-back and finished both projects in about 6 weeks using VV. The finished projects were 2hours each. I spent many, many hours editing to meet my deadline and waited many, many, many hours rendering. Thought if I used one of the RT cards, my projects would be done half the time. I have upgraded my system to Dual CPU's AMD 2000+, but found the rendering takes almost the same time as my single AMD 1600+.

I have three possible weddings lined up for next year, the dates are not confirmed yet. Not sure if this is going to be another back-to-back project I will be faced with. I just wanted something to eliminate the many hours I have to wait rendering and maybe I can deliver the finished production in two to three weeks.

I love using VV. I used to use Premiere myself and totally agree that VV if far more superior. But, my time is also important since I have a regular 9 to 5 job to hold and the extra time I have left is the time spent for my new part time home business. I also have to put some time aside for my kids.

Any of you have the same issue? If so, do you have a workaround to meet your deadlines using VV?

Tried researching the RT cards but not sure if it is worth the investment, considering the stability, support and future upgrades. One of the biggest buying decision I have is whether I can go back to using Premiere.

Is the StormEdit from Canopus similar to VV. I've read, you can have several instances of StormEdit, just like VV.

Thanks again
jetdv wrote on 11/7/2002, 4:14 PM
Just start the rendering before you go to bed. Then, it has all night and the entire next day while you are at work. If it can't finish in 16 hours, you have built something mighty complex (or applied track or project effects).

Also, I find it helpful to edit in segments. I then render each segment and delete the original files. Then I create one final project and combine all the pre-renders. On this final project I use Print To Tape which prepares extremely fast as it only has to render where the segments overlap.
swarrine wrote on 11/7/2002, 6:47 PM
For the $1,200 you would spend on Storm or Matrox you could buy or build another computer. Work on one, let the other render.

Overnight renders work for me, most of my stuff is under an hour.
rrrromz wrote on 11/19/2002, 8:23 PM
Thanks to all. I've decided to stick with VV after checking several forums for Storm and RT.X100. There are many users having difficulty tweaking their system just to get the cards to work right. I don't want to waste my time troubleshooting my system and the thought of going back to using Priemire. Right now my system is rock solid with VV. Can't wait for VV4.0, I hope it will have more 3d effects built in.
wcoxe1 wrote on 11/19/2002, 9:09 PM
Even if you have extremely complex things which take forever to render, you can do it in 10 second fragments by just printing to tape each time you stop for a break, sleep, or work. By the time you have "Finished" editing, you will also be almost finished rendering. Never presents a problem for me, and I also have a 9/5.
kkolbo wrote on 11/19/2002, 10:06 PM
In my last long project I did not loose so much time in rendering and here is how I did it.

#1 Check your transitions etc with a RAM preview as you go.
#2 Do a selective pre-render of any new areas each day when you knock off.
#3 One last render at the end.

I did not loose any time in the fact that it was not RT. I also started doing small chunk selective prerenders as I went along. A little slower than using a Symphony, but not much that way.


watson wrote on 11/19/2002, 11:28 PM
Don't forget with a dual CPU or a faster single you can background render as you work. Just takes a bit to get used to but it seems to work very well. I can do this with my dual 600 Pentium three without problems. Working in segments is the key. Once you get used to this system with longer projects it actually starts making more sense to do it this way. You stay more organized.
the_rhino wrote on 12/12/2002, 7:29 PM
Quote "I have done two events last September, back-to-back and finished both projects in about 6 weeks using VV."
Since you don't do editing full-time, you would be better off dividing projects into segments [like others have said], and then combine all the AVI's into the final project. For Weddings, divide them into pre-ceremony takes, ceremony, and reception. Your color balance, sound settings, etc. will be different for each of those segments anyway, so it makes sense to break it up.

Quote: "Thought if I used one of the RT cards, my projects would be done half the time."
You are probably feeling the crunch on the weekends when you are trying to do maranthon editing sessions to get everything done. Actually, if you are spending 6 weeks on these projects, the 5-13 hours it takes to render them is only a fraction of your time. I used to flip out when I saw the "Approximate Time Left" climb up past 4-5 hours, but now I just plan my time around it.

FYI, I had a dual 1800mhz Althon system and replaced it with a portable P4 2.53mhz Shuttle SS51 so I can edit at both home and work. The P4 2.53 renders at least 30% FASTER than my dual system did and in a case that's 1/4 the size of my Tower.

Hope this helps.
zemote wrote on 12/12/2002, 11:48 PM
Rendering is a complex CPU intensive process. Movie studio's have these huge rendering farms for rendering movies and takes a long time. I would just render at night or build a second machine just for rendering.
Have fun,