What field order for Interlaced Video?

Matt L wrote on 1/10/2007, 1:34 PM
Hi All,

I've captured my first VHS video using Canopus ADVC110 with WinDV in DVType2 format from my Vcr via Firewire, that according to GSpot, is Interlaced and TopField First. When I import this video into Sony Vegas 7.0c, what field order, and deinterlace method should I use on the project settings, for DVD play back on 4:3 TV or computer? Progressive or Upperfield?

Also when I render to MainConcept, what settings should I use? I read some where if your video is interlaced it needs to be kept as interlaced using progressive. When I tried this I noticed the frames weren't lined up correctly unless I use TopFieldFirst, with blend field set on deinterlacing on the video.

I'd appreciated if a vegas user could tell me what my projects settings should be set to, for this type of video for dvd play back.

Also let me know if I'm capturing incorrectly, since this is my first time. I'm not sure if this VHS type video should be 23frames or 29frames?

I do have a sample video clip, BUT BEWARE! Its 84.8mb download!!!!!

www.lwintegrationtest.com/SampleVideo70th.avi


Thanks.

Matt

Comments

RBartlett wrote on 1/10/2007, 1:52 PM
1394/Firewire based DV, the type you'll get from the ADVC110 is lower frame first. This is a convention for 25Mbps PAL 4:2:0 50fields-per-second:25frames-per-second and NTSC 4:1:1 ~59.97fields-per-second:29.97-frames-per-second.

Why Gspot says the AVI is Top field first is unusual. However there is a lot of fuss and confusion over the field names with video. Top/upper/1/odd : Bottom/lower/2/even


Some limited scope guidance
Watch for special cases like DVCPro50, 486line NTSC etc.

As for de-interlacing - you don't want to unless perhaps you are restricting the playback to a PC based DVD-player (and the player itself doesn't provide a de-interlacing service or interlace-mode-renderer).

DVD MPEG-2 576i PAL and 480i NTSC has a frame order automatically set in the Vegas MainConcept encoder - as long as you set the appropriate DVD profile template (for DVD Architect etc).

23.xxx, 24 and 60 frames per second are outside the scope of VHS conversions within Vegas. If your source was ciné or a commercial product that you had a release to use - then you wouldn't attempt to recover the original frame rate using Vegas. VHS never had this flexibility - to resolving such special cases is more for the 2nd day of video editing than for your first. ;-)

To recapitulate, Progressive is about destroying the fielding. Almost always at the expense of perceived resolution (and certainly mathematical/informational resolution)
Matt L wrote on 1/10/2007, 2:25 PM
<< Why Gspot says the AVI is Top field first is unusual. However there is a lot of fuss and confusion over the field names with video. Top/upper/1/odd : Bottom/lower/2/even>>

I believe there is a bug in Gspot. I've been pulling my hair out, when I drop a video in Vegas, and vegas tells me the video is BFF, but Gspot tells me TFF. I then took a commerical NTSC Widescreen DVD, and drop the VOB file into vegas, vegas says it's widescreen 1.2121 (NTSC DV Widescreen) with a field order of (progressive scan). Which makes sense to me because it looks good on TV, and my computer. When I open the same file in GSpot, it has everything correct except the field order is Interlaced.


Matt
Matt L wrote on 1/10/2007, 2:27 PM
<< 23.xxx, 24 and 60 frames per second are outside the scope of VHS conversions within Vegas. If your source was ciné or a commercial product that you had a release to use - then you wouldn't attempt to recover the original frame rate using Vegas. VHS never had this flexibility - to resolving such special cases is more for the 2nd day of video editing than for your first. ;-)>>

Any idea what frame rate can be used when transfering VHS video to DVD?

Thanks.

Matt
farss wrote on 1/10/2007, 2:56 PM
If you're in NTSC land it's 30fps, 60i
If you're in PAL land it's 25fps, 50i

I've done more of this than I'd care to remember and it's drop dead simple. The ADVC 110 will give you DV25, just treat it like you would any other DV material.

The ONE thing you should be aware of, if you're in the USA, is the 7.5 IRE setup switch on the ADVC 110. I think by default it's on but check anyway.

Bob.
JJKizak wrote on 1/11/2007, 5:52 AM
I noticed that rendering progressive eliminates all of those squiggly horizontal jumps on jpg stills with pans and zooms. Does rendering progressive have any problems that I haven't heard about?
JJK
Former user wrote on 1/11/2007, 6:10 AM
IF you render progressive and are watching the video on normal interlaced tv, then you are losing half of your video information.

Progressive works by either using field 1 or 2 or blending them both, Either way, you have cut each frame information down to 1 field instead of the normal two fields per frame.

Dave T2