Widescreen template questions

keith314 wrote on 6/17/2003, 9:57 AM
I am using Vegas 4.0 + DVD, and I have three problems with the widescreen 2.21:1 template in Vegas:

1) When I render a movie using that template, DVD Architect insists on reencoding the file, even though everything about the render settings is EXACTLY like other valid render settings that do not have to be reencoded, except for the change from 16x9 to the Vegas 2.21:1 selection.

2) Plus, if I encode a progressive scan MPG2 in the 2.21:1 format, when DVD architect reencodes it, reencodes it as interlaced.

3) It appears that I actually lose resolution in my movie in that format. I made some pictures in POVRay to test the different widescreen formats, and my standard 4:3 clip had the whole 480 lines of information, my 16x9 had 480 lines of information (and the DVD player supplied the black bars for free), but the DVD architect-reencoded 2.21:1 file appears to have fewer lines of information with at least part of the black bars encoded into the data, replacing some of the real 480 scan lines.

Can someone shed some light on this for me...Thanks,
--Keith

Comments

SonyEPM wrote on 6/17/2003, 10:04 AM
DVD Architect supports no-recompress for 4:3 or 16:9. DVD Arcchitect will not encode progressive.
mikkie wrote on 6/17/2003, 10:44 AM
"When I render a movie using that template, DVD Architect insists on reencoding the file, even though everything about the render settings is EXACTLY like other valid render settings that do not have to be reencoded, except for the change from 16x9 to the Vegas 2.21:1 selection"

To stay within the DVD spec to my knowledge you have to letterbox already anamorphic 720 x 480 (or PAL version) to get the widescreen aspect you want.

IMO, if you're starting with POV Ray or similar, create avi files in mjpeg or lossless or uncompressed at the correct frame size for what you want your finished project viewed, say ~853 x ~360 or whatever [note, don't forget about overscan and safe areas, so pad your content accordingly].

Bring your avi files into vegas, make sure clips are set to the correct frame rate (23.976?) and aspect of 1. Set your project to match, but with DVD spec height of 480 (or PAL). Render to lossless or uncompressed to get your letterboxing.

Bring the newly rendered video into a new vegas proj., again making sure the clip properties are correct, that maintain aspect is off for the clip, setting the proj to DVD frame size, pixel aspect 1, progressive and correct frame rate. This should give you a preview window with a squished appearance. Render to DVD mpg2 changing the frame rate and progrssive as needed, selecting 16:9 for the aspect.

This should give you a DVD compliant file that does what you want on a TV screen. Optionally you might want to use something like restream to set the mpg2/vob height to 540 - optionally check the ifo files produced with ifoedit.

It is possible to shortcut the procedure by rendering originally to a letterboxed frame, or perhaps reduce render times letterboxing in V/Dub (Have not rendered an test this way). It may also be possible to render in one step, but things get complicated fast. You don't want to resample more then absolutely nec., so I tend to stay away from pan/crop & track motion. It might work if you set the clip properties to a narrower pixel aspect, then select a widescreen aspect for the proj, then 720 x 480 & 16:9 for mpg2 render, you might get close, but I couldn't swear that the aspect will be anywhere near the original as you've got to go with the choices in the drop down boxes.
keith314 wrote on 6/17/2003, 11:36 AM
What is the purpose of the 2.21:1 template, then?

When I render my video with the 2.21:1 template, the resulting MPG file has 480 scan lines of information in it. Then DVDA guts it and adds black bars to the data.

What is the point of the 2.21:1 template if the system is going to do this to your data using the least flexible part of it? (i.e. I would rather the Vegas do any data loss so that I could at least maintain more control of the data, and so that I can render progressive scan streams)
SonyDennis wrote on 6/20/2003, 5:19 PM
The DVD specification does not support the MPEG-2 2.21:1 frame aspect setting. We don't provide a DVD 2.21:1 "template" like you imply. Our MPEG-2 encoder offers the setting, but then you're not making compliant MPEG-2 for DVD.

If you truly have 2.21:1 material (where'd you get that, exactly?) then encode it to the 16:9 display anamorphic widescreen format, with letterboxing. If you play it on a 16:9 display, it will have a little bit of letterboxing (the part you encoded). If you play it on a 4:3 display, the player will add more letterboxing electronically. This is as good as you can get within the DVD specification.

Also, you can use the 24p templates if your source material is 24p, and DVD Architect will accept these files. They have the MPEG-2 pulldown flags in them, and will play on both progressive and interlaced (standard) players.

///d@