A simple solid frame around a smaller-than-full-frame image

Parser wrote on 5/29/2023, 8:43 PM

In Vegas Pro 20, can I add an outline (a few pixels, solid color, even width) outside a scaled-down video? By "scaled-down" I mean: Pan/Crop makes the video look smaller (both horiz. and vert) than the full frame. My 3 attempts:

1) "Border" (placed before Pan/Crop): I can control the color, but the frame is on the inside the video, not outside

2) Layer Dimensionality/Drop Shadow, Height 0: I can't control the color. I get a dark outline outside my video (the drop shadow), but it has to be blurry to be visible at all

3) Layer Dimensionality/Bevel I can put the light in the center and tweak the "Background" to get an outline effect, but I can't control the color

I'd prefer to use only one video track, i.e. not comp on top of another track with a solid color shape etc.

Comments

mark-y wrote on 5/29/2023, 9:08 PM

I add the "Border" fx, then I use Track Motion to reduce the image to fit the frame.

Former user wrote on 5/29/2023, 9:29 PM

@Parser  Hi, have you tried Track Motion, that has a shadow/glow that works on the outside & can be reduced to just a few solid pixels

Parser wrote on 5/29/2023, 9:35 PM

Thanks, this would work. Somehow, changing the color doesn't affect the track's shadow, it's always black, but it works with the track's glow.

Former user wrote on 5/29/2023, 9:59 PM

@Parser Hi, the shadow does change colour ?

Why did you want it outside the image, if you're only working to few pixels could you not just use Border as you mentioned & adjust the image to compensate for it being on the inside instead of the outside?

 

Parser wrote on 5/29/2023, 10:23 PM

In my case, when I change the track's shadow color (Glow is off), I always see a black shadow, regardless of the color in the color swatch. I don't know why, but it's not worth pursuing, since glow works.

The Border doesn't matter now, either but...

if I place the Border effect after Pan/Crop, I get the border around the full project frame, not just the scaled-down video (scaled down with Pan and Crop), so it's definitely not what I wanted.

If I place the Border effect before Pan/Crop, I get the border around the scaled-down video (the frame on the inside). Since Pan/Crop is already doing the basic scaling (to the less-than-full-frame size), how would I then additionally scale the video to compensate for the Border going in? If I just rescale with Pan/Crop, the border will just move with it, changing nothing. Is there some additional way of scaling a video, on top of Pan/Crop?

 

john_dennis wrote on 5/30/2023, 2:00 AM

Teaser

You can do the whole thing with Pan/Crop and the Border fX if you don't mind getting down and dirty with nesting and a little arithmetic.

/Teaser

Then use 3D Track Motion for other stuff...

Mindmatter wrote on 5/30/2023, 3:22 AM

Being able to free form a needed border really is an elemental feature that's somehow missing in Vegas.I ended up using a solid generated media in the color i need as a background, then using masking to draw it to the size I want to form a border around the media on the upper track.
I bought a border plugin years ago by FBmn software, which allowed you do draw a border and control thickness, color, length and hight. But I lost the serial and the guy seems to have disappeared, and isn't responding to mails.

Last changed by Mindmatter on 5/30/2023, 3:26 AM, changed a total of 1 times.

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3POINT wrote on 5/31/2023, 1:54 PM

I know there is a (not so fantastic) workaround to solve this issue, but I would like to use the BorderFX as it is meant to be used. Unfortunately this bug is already several Vegasversions old. I still don't know if this is typical NVidia issue or just a Vegas bug.

I can only use BorderFX (on a cropped event) when disabling the NVidia GPU support:

When enabling NVidia GPU support I get this:

Parser wrote on 5/31/2023, 2:01 PM

If Border worked like on your second image, it would work for my purpose. But I always see the border around the entire project frame, never the scaled-down media (I have an Nvidia card)

Former user wrote on 5/31/2023, 2:52 PM

 

If I place the Border effect before Pan/Crop, I get the border around the scaled-down video (the frame on the inside). Since Pan/Crop is already doing the basic scaling (to the less-than-full-frame size), how would I then additionally scale the video to compensate for the Border going in? If I just rescale with Pan/Crop, the border will just move with it, changing nothing. Is there some additional way of scaling a video, on top of Pan/Crop?

 

@Parser Ah I think I see now, you want the border to fit the scaled down image,

When you were ref to 'inside & outside' I presumed you meant inside or outside the image, like this -

Parser wrote on 5/31/2023, 3:11 PM

I should've uploaded an image to clarify what I mean. The outline I want is outside (i.e. tightly surrounding) the scaled-down media, within the whole project frame. The whole project frame has no outline. If the Pan/Crop dimensions change, the outline should adapt, without changing its thickness. Yes, if it's only a few pixels, it's OK to ask why it matters if the outline is inside or outside. But it was hard to get ahold of this particular clip, so, psychologically, I don't want to hide any of its pixels :) In general, it would be nice if the Border effect had all 3 possible options, like in Photoshop: inside, centered, or outside.

 

jetdv wrote on 5/31/2023, 3:26 PM

The border effect needs to be placed LEFT of Pan/Crop. Then it will work with the scaled version and not the full screen size.

3POINT wrote on 5/31/2023, 3:38 PM

The border effect needs to be placed LEFT of Pan/Crop. Then it will work with the scaled version and not the full screen size.

You're sure? This is what I get than:

Parser wrote on 5/31/2023, 3:47 PM

The border effect needs to be placed LEFT of Pan/Crop

See OP, #1. I prefer the outline outside the scaled-down content. Not on its inside, hiding some pixels.

Former user wrote on 5/31/2023, 4:19 PM

VP20

VP19

VP18, no need to swap with Pan/Crop

3POINT wrote on 5/31/2023, 9:48 PM

The border effect needs to be placed LEFT of Pan/Crop

See OP, #1. I prefer the outline outside the scaled-down content. Not on its inside, hiding some pixels.

You could also try this alternative solution I described in my last comment in this thread: https://www.vegascreativesoftware.info/de/forum/borders-the-bane-of-my-existence--134419/

john_dennis wrote on 5/31/2023, 10:32 PM

@Parser

I updated Borders - The Bane of My Existence to include my experience with Vegas 20-403 on my latest hardware.

mark-y wrote on 5/31/2023, 11:28 PM

In general, it would be nice if the Border effect had all 3 possible options, like in Photoshop: inside, centered, or outside.

For this reason, I have often done my work with an image sequence and Photoshop Actions (batch) when I needed a border (hopefully not often!). Just more intuitive it seems.

3POINT wrote on 6/1/2023, 12:49 AM

In general, it would be nice if the Border effect had all 3 possible options, like in Photoshop: inside, centered, or outside.

Indeed that would be nice, the Borderfx needs a complete overhaul, also I would like to have the possibility for rounded corners, but I'm afraid this is wishful thinking since a simple border isn't even possible yet.

jetdv wrote on 6/1/2023, 7:53 AM

The border effect needs to be placed LEFT of Pan/Crop. Then it will work with the scaled version and not the full screen size.

You're sure? This is what I get than:


@3POINT, yes, I'm sure:

Here's where I added a smaller image to the timeline. As it was full height, I used Pan/Crop to make it slightly smaller:

The I added the Border effect to that event. As you can see, it processes the FRAME and puts the border around the entire frame.

Then I moved it left of Pan/Crop so it would process only the image in the event instead of the entire frame.

3POINT wrote on 6/1/2023, 1:54 PM

@jetdv but you didn't crop; the border issue only occurs when cropping an event (doesn't matter if cropping is done with CropFX or Pancrop Tool). Just putting an event with other AR as project doesn't produce the issue at first sight, but as soon as you also start cropping that event the issue occurs.