Dynamic RAM Preview Max and how it affects render speeds VP16

mintyslippers wrote on 5/1/2019, 11:34 AM

Been testing the red car test now I have it and found the following. All testing done using VP 16 Build 424

Changing the dynamic ram preview max affects rendering speeds quite a lot. As you increase the preview ram the amount of ram used during renders (not previews) goes up AS WELL as the GPU Ram used. So if I set my dynamic ram preview ram to 5GB, it will use 5GB of system RAM and GPU RAM during the render. But the best bit is how it affects render speeds as more isnt necessarily good. My specs in my sig but I have 32GB RAM and 6GB GPU RAM.

The following are the times to render the red car test using MAGIX AVC - 30fps 1080p NVENC

RAM 0mb - 38 seconds

RAM 50-2000mb - 20 seconds

RAM 2500mb+ - 28 seconds

I know a lot of people set the ram to zero to improve stability (no problems here with VP16) but this seems to increase final render times by 20% and using more RAM over 2.5GB also has the same, negative effect.

For me I use a sweet spot of 1024mb. I can build a dynamic ram preview of most clips if needed and I also maintain my max render speed.

While I was in there I also tested max number of render threads and no matter what I set it to the speed remained the same.

Comments

eikira wrote on 5/1/2019, 11:46 AM
I know a lot of people set the ram to zero to improve stability (no problems here with VP16) but this seems to increase final render times by 20% and using more RAM over 2.5GB also has the same, negative effect.

lucky you. it affected me in the last builds just rarely, but now...

https://www.vegascreativesoftware.info/us/forum/new-update-more-freezes-notreacting-crashes--115612/

but how came you to that anyway? since you had no problems with stability why would you test that?

mintyslippers wrote on 5/1/2019, 11:54 AM

I wanted to see how much I could use. Upped to 5gb and noticed a massive drop. So played with different settings to see the effect. Highest I can go is 2100 before it slows down. Also tested 0 while I was at it and biggest slow down of all

Norbert wrote on 5/2/2019, 10:57 AM

Vegas just can't use RAM normally since version 15

OldSmoke wrote on 5/2/2019, 11:57 AM

Vegas just can't use RAM normally since version 15

What do you consider as normal?

Proud owner of Sony Vegas Pro 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12 & 13 and now Magix VP15&16.

System Spec.:
Motherboard: ASUS X299 Prime-A

Ram: G.Skill 4x8GB DDR4 2666 XMP

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3POINT wrote on 5/2/2019, 2:00 PM

I know a lot of people set the ram to zero to improve stability (no problems here with VP16) but this seems to increase final render times by 20%

Setting RAM to 0 is indeed slowing down rendering time, but switching GPU OFF instead is even more slowing down rendering time. Just rendering a few clips, what is here often shown as a rendering test, doesn't effect stability, but as soon as some composting is done ( a few PIP's for example) the stability of Vegas or Movie Studio is gone=crash. With stability problems expected, I just try first RAM set to 0, when that doesn't work I put it back to 200 and switch OFF GPU, that always helps, despite slowing down the rendering speed.

Better having ONE slower render without problems, than SEVERAL fast ones with crashes.

I see this problem existing already several Vegasversions and at the moment after the 5th update, I´m really afraid if this problem will ever be solved. It also keeps me waiting to buy a new PC, because I hear here the same problems from users who have far better hardware than I have.

3POINT, Theo Houben, Vegasuser since version 5

Recware: DJI Osmo Pocket, GoproHero7Black, PanasonicFZ300/HCX909, Sony PXW-X160.

Software:VegasPro17/VegasMovieStudio16/PowerDirector18

Hardware:i7 4770, 16GB, GTX650ti, 1920x1200 display

Playware:Samsung Qled QE65Q6FN, Philips 55PFL7108

wilvan wrote on 5/2/2019, 2:36 PM

@3 point : here the same issues on both systems . I re-installed build 307 and that seems to behave better and seems to be using dynamic RAM and all cores ( when previewing ) as sony vegas pro 13 did .

In that version , I can dedicate 32 GB of dynamic RAM ( GPU=OFF ) and enjoy realtime working and previewing and use dynamic RAM as before ( i.e. sony vegas pro 13 ) .

All  later versions , RAM is barely used as is CPU power when previewing .

So something ( at least here ) must have changed dramatically in versions later than build 307 .

Am only interesting in comfortable realtime editing , rendering is done while working at the other station and whether that takes 3 seconds longer ( after 72 hours and more of editing ) is the very very last of my concerns.

My system specs are in my profile and the tests at my systems are done with a very simple m2t file , captured by vegas ( 1440x1080 PAL ) , so very simple short 10 minute file ( old part of video which we had to add into a new clip  which we are editing in sony vegas pro 13 , to be sure ..... )

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

3POINT wrote on 5/2/2019, 3:04 PM

Am only interesting in comfortable realtime editing , rendering is done while working at the other station and whether that takes 3 seconds longer ( after 72 hours and more of editing ) is the very very last of my concerns.

My system specs are in my profile and the tests at my systems are done with a very simple m2t file , captured by vegas ( 1440x1080 PAL ) , so very simple short 10 minute file ( old part of video which we had to add into a new clip  which we are editing in sony vegas pro 13 , to be sure ..... )

@wilvan +1

That's also my opinion, I need smooth editing and quality rendering. I'm also re-editing older projects (since 2006) with HDV footage and do stabilize those now with the Mercalli4 plugin and that use makes VegasPro later than Version 13 necessary.

I also edit with VMS16, which looks to me also more stabile than VPro16. When I render a VMS16 project in Vpro16, I get earlier stability problems than when I render the project in VMS16.

Last changed by 3POINT on 5/2/2019, 3:09 PM, changed a total of 1 times.

3POINT, Theo Houben, Vegasuser since version 5

Recware: DJI Osmo Pocket, GoproHero7Black, PanasonicFZ300/HCX909, Sony PXW-X160.

Software:VegasPro17/VegasMovieStudio16/PowerDirector18

Hardware:i7 4770, 16GB, GTX650ti, 1920x1200 display

Playware:Samsung Qled QE65Q6FN, Philips 55PFL7108

mintyslippers wrote on 5/2/2019, 5:04 PM

@wilvan it's your quadro cards. They don't play nice with Vegas. More info and a workaround here https://techgage.com/article/exploring-magix-vegas-pro-16-gpu-performance/

wilvan wrote on 5/3/2019, 12:04 AM

@mintyslippers : As I did explain here above  , GPU=OFF , meaning I don't make use of the quadro cards in vegas pro but instead make use of all CPU power and lots of RAM . And that stopped workig properly after build 307 . ( by the way , that workaround , when turning GPU=ON , is somethng I am doing for a long time in nvidia control panel , also for After Effects and Avid Media Composer )

fifonik wrote on 5/3/2019, 2:50 AM

On my system there is almost no difference in render time with Dynamic RAM Preview: 0, 200, 1000. Render time is almost the same (tried not red car project with MagicAVC, 1080-60p, 32-bits, encoder -- CPU only).

There is big difference when I switch OFF GPU in Vegas settings (render time is doubled).

Last changed by fifonik on 5/4/2019, 8:06 PM, changed a total of 1 times.

Camcorder: Panasonic X920

Desktop: MB: MSI B450M MORTAR TITANIUM, CPU: AMD Ryzen 3700X, RAM: G'Skill 16 GB DDR4 3200, Graphics card: MSI RX470 4GB, SSD: Samsung 850 EVO SATA 250MB, HDDs: Seagate & Toshiba 2TB, OS: Windows 10 64-bit 1903

NLE: Vegas Pro [Edit] 11, 12, 13, 15, 17

bitman wrote on 5/3/2019, 3:00 AM

I ran the red car again with different DRAM preview settings, and for my system (see profile) I do not see any benefit for increasing DRAM preview. All renders from 0 to 3000 MB are 26s, then they start to increase in render time. I made a chart, horizontal scale is logarithmic. I always render with DRAM preview to 0 as it avoids crashes and even when it is stable it can avoid artifacts in the final render. Especially complex compositions with speeding up/down and a lot of plugins are vulnerable.

 

Current system: VP 17 post (build 353), VP16 (suite) build 424, (uninstalled VP 13,14,15), Vegasaur, Magix Video Pro X (VPX11), Corel VS ultimate 2019, a lot of NEWBLUE plugins, Titler Pro 6, Mercalli 4.0, Respeedr, Vasco Da Gamma 12, VASST stuff, Production Assistent pro3, Boris Continuum 2020, Davinci Resolve Studio 16,...

  • OS: Windows 10 Pro 64, version 1903
  • CPU: i9900K stepping R0 (since October 2019), previously, der8auer i7-8700K (advanced edition), default speed (no overclock), Cooler: Noctua NH-D15s
  • RAM: G.Skill Trident Z 3200C14 DDR4 64GB, XMP set to profile 1 in BIOS
  • Videocard: NVIDEA RTX 2080Ti (Founders edition), NVIDEA studio drivers
  • Monitor: LG 38 inch ultra-wide (21x9) - Resolution: 3840x1600
  • C-drive (games & APPS): Samsung NVMe SSD 2TB 960 pro

  • Current Video source work drive: Samsung NVMe SSD 2T 970 EVO plus

  • Mass Data storage & Backup: WD gold 6TB + WD Yellow 4TB

  • MOBO: Gigabyte Z370 Aorus Gaming 7, BIOS F14
  • PS: Corsair HX1200i, Case: Silverstone fortress 2,
  • Misc: Logitech G910, Evoluent Vertical Mouse, shuttlePROv2

 

mintyslippers wrote on 5/3/2019, 3:11 AM

I wonder why my ram at zero has such a negative effect. I too have an RTX although a 2060. Just less cores. Amd processor.

bitman wrote on 5/3/2019, 3:33 AM

@mintyslippers I remember from the past that there was a (slightly) longer render with DRAM to 0 on my system, but that could have been with a different project or even a previous videocard or processor combination (Intel + Nvidea). And certainly with a different Vegas Build. But even then it was never worth the risk to not use 0 with the very small increase in render time.

Last changed by bitman on 5/3/2019, 3:35 AM, changed a total of 2 times.

Current system: VP 17 post (build 353), VP16 (suite) build 424, (uninstalled VP 13,14,15), Vegasaur, Magix Video Pro X (VPX11), Corel VS ultimate 2019, a lot of NEWBLUE plugins, Titler Pro 6, Mercalli 4.0, Respeedr, Vasco Da Gamma 12, VASST stuff, Production Assistent pro3, Boris Continuum 2020, Davinci Resolve Studio 16,...

  • OS: Windows 10 Pro 64, version 1903
  • CPU: i9900K stepping R0 (since October 2019), previously, der8auer i7-8700K (advanced edition), default speed (no overclock), Cooler: Noctua NH-D15s
  • RAM: G.Skill Trident Z 3200C14 DDR4 64GB, XMP set to profile 1 in BIOS
  • Videocard: NVIDEA RTX 2080Ti (Founders edition), NVIDEA studio drivers
  • Monitor: LG 38 inch ultra-wide (21x9) - Resolution: 3840x1600
  • C-drive (games & APPS): Samsung NVMe SSD 2TB 960 pro

  • Current Video source work drive: Samsung NVMe SSD 2T 970 EVO plus

  • Mass Data storage & Backup: WD gold 6TB + WD Yellow 4TB

  • MOBO: Gigabyte Z370 Aorus Gaming 7, BIOS F14
  • PS: Corsair HX1200i, Case: Silverstone fortress 2,
  • Misc: Logitech G910, Evoluent Vertical Mouse, shuttlePROv2

 

bitman wrote on 5/3/2019, 4:29 AM

Here is the same graph, but I redid the test on Vegas 15, interesting enough there is a difference between DRAM at 0 for Vegas 15, and in general Vegas 15 red car renders almost 30% faster than Vegas 16 on my system (less feature heavy maybe?), shocking!

Render as usual for this types of benchmark: all default settings MAGIX AVC/AAC - NVENC

Last changed by bitman on 5/4/2019, 3:25 AM, changed a total of 1 times.

Current system: VP 17 post (build 353), VP16 (suite) build 424, (uninstalled VP 13,14,15), Vegasaur, Magix Video Pro X (VPX11), Corel VS ultimate 2019, a lot of NEWBLUE plugins, Titler Pro 6, Mercalli 4.0, Respeedr, Vasco Da Gamma 12, VASST stuff, Production Assistent pro3, Boris Continuum 2020, Davinci Resolve Studio 16,...

  • OS: Windows 10 Pro 64, version 1903
  • CPU: i9900K stepping R0 (since October 2019), previously, der8auer i7-8700K (advanced edition), default speed (no overclock), Cooler: Noctua NH-D15s
  • RAM: G.Skill Trident Z 3200C14 DDR4 64GB, XMP set to profile 1 in BIOS
  • Videocard: NVIDEA RTX 2080Ti (Founders edition), NVIDEA studio drivers
  • Monitor: LG 38 inch ultra-wide (21x9) - Resolution: 3840x1600
  • C-drive (games & APPS): Samsung NVMe SSD 2TB 960 pro

  • Current Video source work drive: Samsung NVMe SSD 2T 970 EVO plus

  • Mass Data storage & Backup: WD gold 6TB + WD Yellow 4TB

  • MOBO: Gigabyte Z370 Aorus Gaming 7, BIOS F14
  • PS: Corsair HX1200i, Case: Silverstone fortress 2,
  • Misc: Logitech G910, Evoluent Vertical Mouse, shuttlePROv2

 

fifonik wrote on 5/3/2019, 6:29 AM

Sorry for stupid question, but should I modify the VP11_benchmark project or render template to get compareable numbers? Like changing rendering quality to Best?

Camcorder: Panasonic X920

Desktop: MB: MSI B450M MORTAR TITANIUM, CPU: AMD Ryzen 3700X, RAM: G'Skill 16 GB DDR4 3200, Graphics card: MSI RX470 4GB, SSD: Samsung 850 EVO SATA 250MB, HDDs: Seagate & Toshiba 2TB, OS: Windows 10 64-bit 1903

NLE: Vegas Pro [Edit] 11, 12, 13, 15, 17

matthias-krutz wrote on 5/3/2019, 10:21 AM

Now I have also done this test on my system. VP16 build 424, Ryzen R7 2700 no OC, AMD R9 380, MAGIX AVC/AAC - VCE

0MB 27s
10 - 200 MB 19s
256 MB 23s
1000 MB 29s

If the rendering speed decreases at higher values, I can see a significant increase in GPU copy activity.
My conclusions: The default value is suitable for rendering. Only if the known problems occur must be chosen 0 MB. Larger values are required only for dynamic RAM preview (Shift-B or Num-0) and should be reset before rendering because they slow down rendering.

fifonik wrote on 5/4/2019, 3:05 AM

VP15, Ryzen 2600 (no OC, chipset driver 18.50), RAM 16GB (DDR4-2400), AMD R9 470 (GPU driver 18.5.1, the latest that works with no issues in Vegas on my system), Magix AVC

DRAM   VCE     MC
0      0:27    1:34
10     0:21    1:36
100    0:21    1:34
200    0:21    1:36
1000   0:31    1:36
10000  0:31    1:39

 

Last changed by fifonik on 5/4/2019, 8:05 PM, changed a total of 5 times.

Camcorder: Panasonic X920

Desktop: MB: MSI B450M MORTAR TITANIUM, CPU: AMD Ryzen 3700X, RAM: G'Skill 16 GB DDR4 3200, Graphics card: MSI RX470 4GB, SSD: Samsung 850 EVO SATA 250MB, HDDs: Seagate & Toshiba 2TB, OS: Windows 10 64-bit 1903

NLE: Vegas Pro [Edit] 11, 12, 13, 15, 17