Media (version) replacement - chapter/marke issues

fausseplanete wrote on 2/21/2010, 8:07 AM
How best cope with media replacement (eg media version update) in DVDA, especially when chapter-markers are involved and want to retain distinguishable versions of those media files (eg the files have version numbers)?

Scenario:

Given a DVDA project, with several pages of scene selection buttons arranged just-so. Now I realize something needs tweaking in the edit, so I render out a new '.mpg' file. There's no Media Replace function as far as I know in DVDA. It's possible to replace individual items one-by-one but the process is fraught (I've tried it e.g. some buttons can inadvertently be left based on the previous version of the MPG file or DVDA can behave weirdly). Don't want to have to create a new DVDA project from scratch (all that button-positioning etc.). Workaround: ensure the rendered file has the same name as the media originally used in the DVDA project.

Is that reasonable so far?

But now, trying to maintain some "self-documentation" among my media files, I render out the new version of the edit to a different filename (e.g. differing in terms of incremental version number). For example "RECEP 032.MPG". I copy that new rendered file to a standard name that I will always use for DVDA input media, e.g. "FINAL RENDER.MPG". So I have one copy for safety/archiving and one copy for onwards use in DVDA.

Still good practice?

Now a further complication - chapter-markers, i.e. markers placed in the edit and enabled during the ".MPG" render from Vegas (e.g. to "RECEP 032.MPG") with the intention of them becoming chapters in the DVD. The rendered file's markers are stored in an associated '.SFL' file ( "RECEP 032.SFL"). I assume the name means, historically, "Sound Forge Labels". That file is binary but it can nevertheless be loaded into Notepad, whereupon the marker labels can be seen. Also that file can be seen to contain the name of the rendered ".MPG" file, e.g. "RECEP 032.MPG".

If I Insert the file "RECEP 032.MPG" into DVDA then it appears there OK and the markers become chapters as expected.

Now suppose instead I copy that file to "FINAL RENDER.MPG". Naively I also make a copy of "RECEP 032.SFL" to "FINAL RENDER.SFL". However when I then Insert "FINAL RENDER.MPG" into DVDA, no marker-based chapters appear. Presumably something to do with the fact that the SFL file, even though it has the right filename, still contains in its binary/text fthe name of the original file, "RECEP 032.MPG".

So what's the best thing to do here? Or is there some other recommended workflow to permit media replacement in a DVDA project?

Maybe could dtry the inverse i.e. render from Vegas out to e.g. "FINAL RENDER.MPG", thereby also generating a consistent "FINAL RENDER.SFL" and copy them so that either their path or filename contain the required version number.

What do other people do?

[Edit]: Some previous posts related to this:
http://www.sonycreativesoftware.com/forums/ShowMessage.asp?ForumID=22&MessageID=684845
http://www.sonycreativesoftware.com/forums/ShowMessage.asp?ForumID=22&MessageID=587075

Comments

johnmeyer wrote on 2/21/2010, 3:52 PM
I do this all the time. Here's my workflow.

First, create the initial DVD. You've done that already.

Next, render the revised video, but go ahead and use a different name for your MPEG-2 file (and AC-3, if the audio has changed). This is true whether you are re-rendering just to fix a few problems, or whether you are rendering a large project to multiple DVDs, and you want to use similar navigation logic and scripts for the next DVD. I use scripts all the time for navigation control, and it is nice to be able to use the same scripts from one DVD to the next. I often create boxed sets of DVDs with 8-10 DVDs per box, and I use the same project file for each DVD.

The final step is to load the new MPEG-2 file (and AC-3). All you do is double-click on the media file in the left-hand pane in DVDA. Then, on the right side, click on the Track Media tab and under the video entry, click on the down arrow and then select "replace." Find your new MPEG-2 file and select it. Repeat this for the audio file, if necessary.

Now, the "trick" here is to make sure you fix things up on the DVDA timeline. If you select the timeline tab, you should see your new video there. You need to make sure you do both the following things. The first thing you should do is grab hold of the yellow triangle on the right side of the DVDA timeline and make sure it is dragged all the way to the right. If your new video is longer than the old video, this end of file marker will still be at the original end location, and your new video will be truncated unless you make this change.

The second thing you need to do is go to the little "open folder" icon that is immediately above the timeline and click on it. This is the "load markers" icon. If everything is happening correctly, you should notice a slight delay before anything happens, and then you will see the markers from your latest render appear. Whatever you do, do NOT rename ANY rendered file after you render, or this step will not work correctly.

At the end of this, if you didn't add or delete any chapter markers, all your navigation logic and submenus should operate exactly as before, but the buttons in those menus will now point to the updated locations.

If you use this method to create multiple DVDs, you will have to re-create your scene selection menus for each new DVD because obviously each DVD will have a different number of chapter marks, and these will all have different labels. However, much of your navigation logic in your scripts can often be re-used without having to re-write it all. This is important to me, because I often have between thirty and fifty chapter marks in long projects, and have scripts which ensure that if the user presses the "return to menu" button on the remote, they get returned to the scene selection menu for that MPEG-2 file, and most important, that the button for that scene is selected, so they can see where they are, and can easily navigate, relative to that point, to the next or previous scenes. Since I have to have one or two lines of script for each chapter, that is 50-100 lines of code which I really don't want to re-write for every single DVD in a 10-DVD set.

Sony unfortunately changed some subtle behavior when they updated from 4.0b to the later revisions, so I still use 4.0b for all my work, and only use the later versions when I absolutely need a specific feature.
fausseplanete wrote on 2/22/2010, 12:33 AM
John,

Many thanks for your information, on the mark as always.

Your key point seems to be scripts. I have little familiarity with "advanced DVD" (from my point of view) as my traditional product has been just web and computer videos, and such DVDs I produced years ago were via a different product. I do not know what a DVD script is, or whether such a thing is specific to DVDA or generic to DVDs. Is there a good "entry point" to this topic anywhere? I looked in Spotted Eagle's Vegas 8 book but it doesn't really cover DVDA. I googled [DVD script] but nothing relevant in first few screens-worth (and have to go to work now).

Your instructions re track media replacement are more thorough than the procedure I have followed in the past. One additional issue after track media replacement is that the buttons' thumbnails / posterframes nevertheless still point at the previous media, so either I have to keep that media or else go through each button (and Button Properties > Media) re-pointing it at the new media.

Incidentally my current project is a set of two DVDs, and a consistent style is needed. Each DVD has about 30 scene selection buttons, 6 per page, buttons and text boxes larger and more spread-out than the default. I go through each page repositioning and resizing them by manually entering X/Y numbers, also changing text colours and background etc.. Thankfully DVDA interface's "multiple item selection" allows changing properties (eg position) en masse but still takes time. Is there a better way for doing that?

Thanks again
David
john_dennis wrote on 2/22/2010, 10:15 AM
See the DVD Architect Pro 5 User Manual, Chapter 11, Using Scripting, Page 135 for an overview. If you have zero coding experience, it might seem a little obtuse.
fausseplanete wrote on 2/22/2010, 1:37 PM
John Dennis,

Thanks for that pointer, following which I took a look at that chapter, though it seems more focussed on reference information and the application's interface than on anything introductory. I kind of expected a few example scripts or something, just to get the feel of it.

But of course the web provides -at the cost of time. To help save others time I recount my experiences here:

A Web Search first on [dvd script] was unsuccessful but retrying on [dvd scripting] I came across loads of material, including a thread http://www.videoforums.co.uk/blu-ray-dvd-svcd-vcd-authoring/24646-dvd-architect-scripting.html highlighted the following great example of a DVD script-based game, even if it was for another product http://www.mediachance.com/dvdlab/tutorial/quiz.html. Also at http://library.creativecow.net/articles/alexzander_alex/code_lock.php I found an example for pass-code (number) restriction of DVD sections.

johnmeyer wrote on 2/22/2010, 3:42 PM
When you replace media, if you follow my steps, then ALL references to that media will be updated. I am scratching my head as to how other buttons are still pointing to the old media UNLESS you have dragged that same media into DVDA more than once. DVDA allows this, and it is often a useful thing, because you can have the same media treated in different ways, but without actually duplicating that media on the final DVD. If you indeed have the same media showing up multiple times (and you can tell this by looking at the assets shown on the left side of the DVDA interface), then you will indeed have to go to every instance and update the media.

In the future, if you don't actually need to use the media in different ways, it is probably better practice to simply add a blank button, and then have that button point to the same media as another button that you've already created.