You need to think about which frame rate was used a) in the camera, and b) in your Vegas project settings.

Could it be 29.97 vs. 30.00?

@farss

Well. I don't know whether to thank you or not.

Look my paradigm is more along the lines of video editing in general and working to make sure what I produce is accessible to all including FCP.

My editor was a developer for liquid years ago...he is good at what he does and has tried this in other applications with the same result.

I would like to know my choice with the investment with new sony cameras and software is one not exclusive...but inclusive.

I didn't go with Mac because of this attitude...but I also don't want to be a hypocrite.
To me the more sony does to make people with other applications think of sony as friendly....and those of us working with sony friendly as well.

In this respect I think we guarantee sonys growth and improvement which benefits us all.

My editor has gone from PC to mac in the last two years...and issues like this without answers and a hostile response give credence to his move.
I don't want a war....I want a finished product with cooperation.

If I am at the wrong forum...sorry. - have come here before and gotten great answers and would like to think I have contributed.

I didn't know where else to go.

And I think I did ask for direction if in the wrong place.

Why don't I do it? I am more the project manager...and creating products. If I had time I guess I could convert 48 hours of footage for him.

I am also willing to pay someone who might know the answer to this issue.

Or I am willing to take this to a different more relevant forum.

Thanks,

Mark

PS again he used all kinds of players and software including PC apps and got the same results.

PPS why the heck does sony look at these boards...that seems crazy

If you want help on any forum, you need to specify the camera and project settings.

Without that, it's working in the dark, taking potshots at shadows.

@Coursedesign

Thanks for this response!

We thought that too but it constantly imports in other applications as an average of 6 frames out.....throughout the whole clip.

It doesn't get progressively more.

When he syncs the six frames it stays synced throughout.

I just don't want to have have every editor who works outside of vegas to have to resync everything I send them.

I think I'd rather return the camera.....or better yet get the issue fixed and help others who buy this new camera solve the issue quick

Thanks again,

Mark

If you don't want to return the camera, you still need to specify the camera and project settings.

That is the only way I can think of to narrow down the problem from "my camera and NLE setup is not working, what should I do?" to "shooting 23.976P with 3:2 pulldown, editing in a 29.97i project, I get a 6 frame lag" or whatever it is.

Or just wait for the next person to have the problem and publish the solution.

@Coursedesign

Good point....sorry!
I will get them as soon as I can to you.
I am in a pickle as I am at a seminar attending the last 3 days away from camera.....with my editor trying to figure it out.

I do know it is the replacement for the sony hcr-z5u ...it is the new NXCAM 5

I bought a video for the operation of z5u from BH Photo
I believe it was Vortex and he recommended a setting he uses as a pro and if you have seen the video it is the vortex setting PP2....I have been using it with great results in the z5u....so I used the exact same settings for the NXCAM 5.
I know for most of you this will not mean much...but it is the best I can do from the seminar until I can get my hands on the camera.

Also we seem to be narrowing it down to the content management software sony gave me with camera. It changes file types when I import them from .mts to .m2ts in the software...might be something there

Thanks for your patience!

"I didn't know where else to go"

I gave you directions. Here's a direct link to the subforum for exactly the camera you have:
http://www.dvinfo.net/forum/sony-nxcam-hxr-nx5u/

This forum here is for users of Sony Vegas, a product of Sony Creative Software, a small business in Maddison of around 20 people that just happens to be owned by Sony. Exactly which Sony I'm not too certain of but it is a long path from Maddison to the division that designed the camera, trust me on that one.

I note that at DVInfo there are people using FCP with this camera, i don't find anyone having the problem you're having. I did find plenty of posts regarding other problems people are experiencing using this camera with FCP when using PCM audio and long clips!

Apart from DVInfo there are heaps of forums for FCP. That's where the problem is and that's where your editor should be trying to get Apple to fix the problems. Good luck to him though. Over the years there's been an ongoing parade of problems with FCP and new cameras. If you're regularly having to interchange files with your editor using FCP and yourself running Vegas or PPro or After Effects then investing in a codec from Cineform would make a lot of sense.

Bob.

@farss

Thank you so much...it puts a different perspective on things!

Read the recent Cineform posts here, this can save you a LOT of time and aggro.

Been a rough day.

Final cut editor getting mad at me saying it is the camera and not final cut pro....sony folks telling me i am at wrong place and not camera but final cut pro.

Dont care what it is really...just want it solved so i dont have to pay him all that money to re-sync 48 hours of material.

Guess ill have to pat to learn huh!

And will be searching for a new editor as he told me it is an easy fix...alls i have to do is never send him a .m2ts file again.
this will teach me to try an untested camera....i think ill wait next time for the bugs to be worked out

Thanks for all your help on this one....for those did help!

Mark

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This makes no sense at all. You started off by saying you downloaded the card to your machine and there was no OOS at that time, so how could it possibly be the camera???

FCP does not do well with avchd... that's a known fact. One of the reasons for this is the audio. Avchd has the capacity for Dolby Digital for example which FCP is not very good at accepting.

Now this is CLEARLY a fcp issue.... either that or a data-transfer-rate problem with the hdd you stuck the files on. At any rate you'll have to solve it from that end. Looking at it from the cam end would be the WRONG end.

FCP does not do well with avchd... that's a known fact.

That is certainly true, most FCP editors use ProRes (and Avid editors use DNxHD) for this.

On the other hand it seems difficult to find any FCP editor who has problems with NXCAM footage.

The problem here is inter-NLE workflow with a Sony-created format (.m2ts) with a gazillion possible features that I can imagine is nobody's joy to support.

I would imagine that if the OP used Cineform for his NXCAM footage, he could edit much faster and he wouldn't have a problem transferring the output to FCP editors.

Yes i am starting to think this forum is accurate and my editor is being stubborn even though he has many years with this and was a developer of Avid, Liquid, Pinnacle.

I have another friend who was at the seminar who is over here now and he is a system engineer and programs for o sx mac.
He also has a power book and when downloading the same files from a duplicate hard drive...it played in sync on mplayer and Aimersoft video converter on his mac.

He seems to think it might be a codec from an install on the editors machine.
The editor also said he used Popcorn 4 to convert it...because clipwrap was screwing up and he was in contact with their team who was working on it as a known issue.

Sorry for all this guys...even though i saw it in sync i defaulted to me editor with much more experience.
Looks like the sony part of this equation is working well.

I will let you know how it works out if my editor now will stop defending his FCP.....this all started 2 years ago when he switched over from Liquid.
What happens to these mac folks to get so arrogant:-)

Thanks again!

Mark

Coursedesign, clearly, you need to re-read his post! This is not vegas related but a FCP issue. He clearly states he used "new sony content manager" that's for the NXCAM which is not vegas or an SCS product. ;-(

"The problem here is inter-NLE workflow" NOT really, but you could not directly avoid trying to push FCP issues onto vegas........... maybe the FCP editor is clueless and just a bit lazy.

Apit,

FCP doesn't seem to have a problem with NXCAM.
Vegas doesn't seem to have a problem with NXCAM.

One person has a problem transferring his edited footage from Vegas to FCP.

I guess the next Apple board meeting will be dedicated to allocating resources to make that easier, being that it is a high priority.

It's a workflow issue, this sort of thing has happened between every permutation of two NLEs I have ever heard of.

With new stuff, you test your workflow first, and based on that testing, you choose how to get the job done.

This, if there is a paycheck on the line.

Otherwise, it's OK to sulk that the other product won't talk to yours.

"It's a workflow issue"

A workflow issue??

How the heck do you arrive at that conclusion? There is no OOS at the source end but all of a sudden at the mac/fcp end we have OOS and you label that a workflow issue? This is a hardware/fcp compatibility issue, cut and dry. From where I sit it looks like FCP IS having a problem with nxcam.

"One person has a problem transferring his edited footage from Vegas to FCP."

Wrong. From the original post the footage is fine in Vegas. He only used that to check the footage.
He sent the exact same files form the camera to the editor with FCP and his FCP system had a problem with it. Logical conclusion, the problem is in FCP.
Some research shows no other FCP users having the same problem with NXCAM footage although there's plenty of other gripes and one workaround is to switch the camera to record Dolby rather than PCM audio.

Further investigation seems to show that in fact another FCP guy has not problem with the footage, it plays just fine on 3rd party OSX media players. Wierd huh.

My gut feeling was that something might have gone awry duing the rewrap with the Sony utility. It took quite a while for Sony to get all the bugs out of their software for FCP and XDCAM EX. One nasty bug several of our clients had would only occur if the TC generator was set to TOD, do that and there was problems stitching the files together.

The challenge is these new class of cameras record vital data not just in a single file. That and things such as active metadata seem to pose a real challenge to Apple's Quicktime file structure. It's taken Cineform years to get their codecs to work under OSX and I'm not certain if even now they can support active metadata in Quicktime. On the other hand it's been working a treat in AVI files for years.

There is one lesson in the tale and it applies no matter which NLE, operating system or file based camera is used. Always backup the camera original files in three places first before you do anything else. I heard directly of too many disasters from people not doing this. It can happens using FCP and it can happen using Vegas. It's not the fault of either of them. It is a problem that they encourage sloppy workflows that are quick and convenient but a road to disasters unless you are uber well organised. Much, much safer to ALWAYS backup the camera original files exactly as the camera recorded them.

Bob.

ah bob, the voice of logic!

i love my mcr1k recorder, but i have yet to shoot a job on it alone! i love not working with tape any more - however, i still work with tape - i put one in, shoot, take the tape out and put it on the shelf (correctly labelled) - and that's it.

no matter what happens, tomorrow, next month, next year, that tape will still be on the shelf whereas my cf card('s) will have been long wiped, and the files either erased after editing or more likely lost among the myriad hd's accumulating on another shelf.....

How is it not a workflow issue if he captures on a PC and sends the captured files to a Mac?

Or did the OP have the cards recaptured by the FCP user?

With the multilevel complexity (that Bob mentioned), it seems that with the latter everything would have been fine.

NXCAM owners who capture directly to their FCP systems don't have this problem.

So there is some incompatibility between the Windows and OS X camera files that may well come from the presumably two versions of Sony's utility.

Did you follow the instructions on page 5 and 9-10 in this Sony instruction manual for working with NXCAM files?

It struck me that if you didn't tell Windows to show hidden files before copying to the Mac system, you wouldn't get all the clip info.

"How is it not a workflow issue if he captures on a PC and sends the captured files to a Mac?"

You don't "capture" files, you copy them.
And to be frank the only operating system that does cause problems doing such a simple task is OSX's Spotlight that writes its own files onto the camera's media.

In the words of Barry Green, P2 cards should never be put anywhere near a Mac. The SxS cards seem to be more resilient, worst problem I've had requires only a Media Restore in the camera to undo the damage.

Bob.