Blink, why does your User Info show a Web site with a dead link?

?????
It works for me.... maybe the site was down for a bit.

Your link on the User Info page says "http://blink3times/"
Not surprisingly, it doesn't work.

Your link on the User Info page says "http://blink3times/"

Ahhh... now I understand.

I don't have a webpage and I have NOOOO idea how that got there!? Anyway it has been fixed and I thank you for pointing that out!

Blink:

I can't believe I am going to say this, but you are right blink. The PS3 can not, and will never be able to (without a hardware upgrade) to, bitstream DTS-MA etc. It's a hardware problem. The HDMI port Sony uses, they don't make it them selves, doesn't support bitstreaming of DTS-MA etc.

Is it a big issue? Maybe, probably not. The PS3 can decompress audio to LPCM and stream this to the receiver, but currently the PS3 doesn't decode DTS-MA internally. Decoding DTS-MA is on the Sony PS3 list of to-do's, so the PS3 will support DTS-MA, but it currently does not.

There should not be much difference between bitstreaming DTS-MA and decoding in the PS3, the only "problem" is that the receiver can process the DTS-MA audio stream differently (better possibly) than the PS3 and therefore yield better sound. I do not know how likely it is that an Onkyo DTS-MA decode is superior to a PS3 DTS-MA decode, and how likely it is that you will be able to tell the difference.

Rumor has it that the 40G PS3 uses the newer version of the HDMI port from whoever the HDMI port vendor was, a version that does support DTS-MA bitstreaming. It seems unlikely that Sony will take this into account though, since that would mean that they would have to maintain different versions of the BD playing software, which is never an ideal situation if you are developing a set-top box/whatever you want to call the PS3.

"can't believe I am going to say this, but you are right blink. The PS3 can not, and will never be able to (without a hardware upgrade) to, bitstream DTS-MA etc. It's a hardware problem. The HDMI port Sony uses, they don't make it them selves, doesn't support bitstreaming of DTS-MA etc." ?????? Again, there is still some miss understanding. The PS3 HDMI interface is not a DSP/DAP ic like you'll find in a simple player. PS3 is a computer based HDMI with a large freq range because of the DDR3 memory subsystem. The Cell constructs the bits stream buffer then moves it out the simple HDMI 1.3 circuit interface. These audio/video streams are just wrappers in this case. The PS3 firmware can and probably will be updated to include DTS-ma if there is a market interest.

I do not know how likely it is that an Onkyo DTS-MA decode is superior to a PS3 DTS-MA decode, and how likely it is that you will be able to tell the difference.

I doubt there would be a difference at all with an onkyo decode vs a PS3 decode, but it is nice to have the option. One of the reasons I bought the Onkyo was for its endless number of connection and routing options.

But if the PS3 could internally decode DTS-MA then that would be good enough to satisfy me.

The PS3 firmware can and probably will be updated to include DTS-ma if there is a market interest

Are you kidding me??? You don't think there is "market interest" in this??? Go to the Avs forum and see how many hits you get when searching for DTS-MA.

Don't misunderstand me Apit.... I don't call you wrong... I simply don't know if the PS3 can be upgraded for such a thing through Firmware updating or not. My PURE GUESS is that it can't, but then I have been wrong before. It *MAY* be that this is all just simply an attempt on Sony's part to keep the price down on the PS3 to a minimum.... that has crossed my mind as well. They gone as far as to remanufacture the PS3 to get its price tag more in line with the other game consoles.

What I do know is that at present it can't do the newer audio formats at all...period... bitstream or otherwise. So if the audio side of things is important to you, the question mark to all of this becomes pretty significant.

"The PS3 firmware can and probably will be updated to include DTS-ma if there is a market interest" I should have expanded that statement. Many features are controlled by marketing and cross marketing concerns in most products and that includes Sony PS3 . Audio boxes are big business in the home theater market, so Sony "may be" waiting on sales analysis of the high end BD players by all partners before expanding the cell in the current market, one does not want to "beatup" partners too early in the BD growth stage.

one does not want to "beatup" partners too early in the BD growth stage.

Apit.... come on..... Sony has already (on record) stated that "the PS3 is the only player that we can presently recommend"

I don't think you can beat up your partners any better than that.

Blink said: Go to the Avs forum and see how many

The AVS forum was what you kept referring to in your "HD will beat BR" nonsense, so forgive me if I give it even less credence now than I did back then. Besides, the AVS forum is hardly a representation of mainstream market interest. If they were, HD would have won.

One more thing: You have said several times (and also based on things you've read on AVS) that the general public is happy enough with DVD and upconverting, so BR will not end up replacing DVD. Tell me, does a mass public that doesn't even see a need or difference with high definition video really give a damn about yet another audio format? How many people even have the audio equipment to have the slightest *chance* of noticing a difference? With video all you need is to look at virtually any HD screen and compare it to NTSC to see the world of difference, but the same is not true of audio. With audio you need a much better (and more expensive) system to even hope to hear any difference between the various high quality audio formats. And even then it's unlikely you could tell (unless the mixes were very different).

The AVS forum was what you kept referring to in your "HD will beat BR" nonsense, so forgive me if I give it even less credence now than I did back then. Besides, the AVS forum is hardly a representation of mainstream market interest. If they were, HD would have won.

Well first, there is NO "mainstream market interest" for BD. People have made that pretty clear by avoiding HDM and sticking with DVD..... for the moment anyway.

Second, you GREATLY misunderstand the AVS forum. It is a rather large science forum with a great many topics and an absolutely HUGE user base. It is not pro/con HD DVD or BD and has in excess of 50 sub forums to it... and that's just the forum section and does not include the daily science write-ups, information columns.... and such. You will find Denon reps, Onkyo reps, Microsoft reps.... etc, on the AVS forums answering various customers questions and concerns, so it is no small rinky-dink operation.

As to the rest of your post.... I'm simply not going to get into it Fred.

Here's a link to the AVS foums for you to peruse:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/index.php?

"rather large science forum with a great many topics and an absolutely HUGE user base" Ha,HA, HA , Blink, stop, you're killing me! "science forum", oh, yes, really, you're killing me with humor! After reviewing the many forums links posted and studying the contents, it would be pushing the limits if more than 1% had real content value---- actual science, engineering, math, ----- a lot of spin, very poor speculation, second guessing, etc. As a general public forum, AVSFORUMs is OK.

Blink, remember when you were quoting Sony CE that the Format war was stalled/tied/even matched? Sony has been understating it's position for a while, so Sony believes PS3 is the ultimate PC media center today, but soft peddles it. It pushes the BD movie player feature, like games, because all the studios make money selling content. But does not to "burn" partners investment in high-end or medium BD players for when the market for movies grow, there will be many player choices.

"AVS Science Forum" is simply its name. The term "Science" however covers a great many areas.

But if it is true sciencs that you are interested in, then the last thing you want to do is play on the internet. Good old fashioned books (where people actually have to place their name and credentials for the public to see) is what you should be looking at.

But does not to "burn" partners investment in high-end or medium BD players for when the market for movies grow, there will be many player choices.

Yes... all very nice and good.... but it still doesn't change the fact that the PS3 can not stream/decode the newer audio formats.

I have picked up a lot of information from the AVS forum around my area as far as what is going on with all of the service providers and how they are screwing you. Also much info from engineers at TV stations relating their problems with equipment and money. What speeds they download their programs from satellite, sound syncing problems, antenna coverage problems etc. I also check the LCD panel section and found similar problems with my units and the units to stay away from. The only negative that I found on the forum is from the head guy himself (forum author) who if he doesn't like you exhibits profound communication problems. I have a pretty good view of this forum and check it out regularly.
JJK

Blink, rest assured, that Sony marketing known that grandma and grandpa wants a simple player with non complex features, so PS3 is not going to meet everyone's image. And selling content is the main focus of this BD business adventure.

"then the last thing you want to do is play on the Internet" Blink, the DOD and science community where the first big users of the Internet. Many big colleges have online classes as well as live boardcast classes. Campus access to libraries thru the Internet is big, tho, actually looking at a real book has an education benefit too.

I have picked up a lot of information from the AVS forum around my area as far as what is going on with all of the service providers and how they are screwing you. Also much info from engineers at TV stations relating their problems with equipment and money.

I agree completely... a lot of knowledgeable people there... and a lot of help too. The AVS forum is where I went when I didn't know too much about HD DVD players and wanted to buy. It helped me buy my flat panel TV, as well as my Onkyo AVR. It will also help me in picking out the proper BD player too.

So much of this stuff out there can be a total disappointment when you buy it, bring it home and plug it in. The AVS forum is a GREAT place to go to learn about this stuff BEFORE you buy

"antenna coverage problems" Since antenna propagation is usually model by graphs, I would think detailed data discussion would be tough in a text based forum, but if the forum works solving problems, that would be very useful.

"The AVS forum is a GREAT place to go to learn about this stuff BEFORE you buy" Blink, not trying to be too big of a jerk here but isn't that what convince you to buy HD DVD and join the HD DVD crusade. The fact is, there is a lot of marketing spin by individuals claiming to have " inside information" in the AVSFORUMS and the question is how many people have been burned by their posts.

Now, AVSFORUMS may have some value if you "weighted" the information accordingly in your analysis, but the word "weighted" means less 60% reliable, at best. Of course, there will be real individuals with valuable information, but sorting out the real contacts can be a challenge if you don't check out the details.

but isn't that what convince you to buy HD DVD and join the HD DVD crusade.

Not at all.

I got into HD DVD because of the ability to make 3x dvd and the inability (at that time) for BD-r to properly work.

I turned to the AVS forum to assist in choosing a machine... and did a good job as a result

As I have already stated, the AVS forum is not pro or con towards any camp/company/machine/format or brand. It's about gaining info on what ever you are interested in. There is (and always has been) as much helpful info on BD as there is HD DVD.

The Cleveland section of the AVS forum has all of the color coverage charts for all of the local stations in the viewing area on one of the threads on OTA discussions concerning signal strength. And they are highly detailed engineering charts in full color.. There are some very heavy hitters on that forum.
JJK

Yup.... lots of that kind of stuff. That BD audio comparison chart I have in a link above.... born and raised on the AVS forums.... pretty good little chart too! There's a BD video comparison chart around there somewhere also. Between those 2 charts, you can narrow in on EXACTLY the right BD player for you.... all in a matter of minutes.