mjroddy, I don't think you are contributing to a flame war, I think you are expressing a real concern, that's all. If we didn't care we wouldn't speak up at all. I was saying the same thing in another post. I almost wish another company would buy Madison Media.

Not showing up to NAB pretty much invites negative speculation... especially an NLE where customers want to see it in action and compare head-to-head with other products all in one place.

Here's to hoping that Vegas 7 is a leaping frog.

I too make my living in this everchanging business, i use Vegas and really believe they are falling big time behind. I'm not comparing apples and oranges, I'm talkin about software in the same price range.We have 2 editors plus myself, and like I've stated before I am the lone ranger left using vegas. This can create problems if we all are working on parts of the same deal, so what is going to happen, I make them use Vegas, or i use what they use. Vegas 7 or whatever it is called has to be huge . Not that my little company will make much of difference if we quit vegas, but if a bunch of little companies do, well maybe a big tax writeoff is all sony wants anyway.

I'm done now.

I'm moving this over here as well. I really agree with jkrepner, "Not showing up to NAB pretty much invites negative speculation". I know Vegas was there, but it was on a laptop, right next to a bunch of other NLE's - some of which I had never even heard of. It would seem that Sony could do a bit more to promote it's mid priced NLE, especially since it has nothing to hide - this is great software!

Anyway...

Just wanted to chime in on the Sony support of Vegas at NAB. This was my first NAB (Holy crap - talk about information overload!) and I was also pretty disapointed with the lack of Vegas presence..well pretty much anywhere...

There were so many sexy NLE set ups, Premiere Pro running on an AJA box at the Apple/AJA booth - 2 big apple displays and playing back friggin' gorgeous HD on a big Plasma, my jaw was on the floor. I looked all over and could only find Vegas running on a laptop and also on a machine that was demoing Cinescore (which looks incredibly cool by the way) at the Sony booth.

It seems to me that Vegas is definetely a major player in the NLE community as far as online presence goes, it has a very active and vocal user base. It also seems to be one of the major players in the industry - so I was a bit shocked at how it was totally un-promoted at NAB. To be honest it kind of freaked me out a bit - I was hoping to see some sexy Vegas set ups and get some tips and ideas for hardware/raid/etc configs.

It's such an amazing program - seems a shame...

So,---the emporer may be naked?

Just as a little bit of a different view....
Did you see Canopus Edius in Grass Valley's booth? Yes. In a back room, hidden behind everything else.
Did you see Sony XDCAM HD shown in Avid's booth? Yes, back near the media management display.
Sony is the only company that makes it all, soup to nuts. Vegas was in 5 pods in the Sony booth, more than any other application. It was in the HDXchange booth, in the XDCAM booth, in Sony Media Software booth, in the HDV pod, and in the Audio pod. Out front were the 35,000.00 XDCAMs, HDV cams, switchers, storage, and other myriad product that Sony makes. Grass Valley had a sign and a Viperstream in the old Canopus booth, and otherwise you wouldn't have seen Edius and Grass Valley together at all. Should Vegas have been more on the front aisle? I sure wish it had been. But at NAB, the XDCAM HD and HDV were their main pushes, and HDXChange as well, which were all out front. No other Sony product was found in 5 booths in Sony excepting maybe monitors. Additionally, Sony had Vegas in many, many booths on the show floor from Blackmagic Design to Main Concept's booth, as well as being shown at the Boris booth and in the plug in pavilion. Could they do it better? I'm sure they could. Is Vegas behind the curve right now? A little. On the other hand, they haven't shot their wad yet, but get to see what everyone else announced at the show or prior ot the show, providing them with a potential strategic advantage.
Bear in mind that Apple doesn't make cameras, switchers, monitors, microphones, broadcast servers, network storage for HD, IP-configurable editing support systems, or other broadcast hardware. Just keeping things in perspective in terms of what was what in the booth space...
It DEFINITELY is stupid that so many Sony employees have no clue what Vegas is though.

Spot - just speculating here - do you think the concern that is coming up is because they / we are sometimes head to head with PP, FCP, and the like in our own headspace?

I imagine it would seem disheartening to be at a trade show like NAB where the software you are passionate about appears to be 'hidden", and something like FCP is storm-troopin' across huge monitors, making a big marketing splash.

Bingo!! Hey Sony might want to ask JVC again why VHS was better than Beta?

I think you've described it quite well, David. Vegas definitely isn't shown with the presence I wish it could be shown with, but in the grand scheme of things, it's still part of a monstrously large company. FCS doesn't get nearly this sort of attention at other sorts of tradeshows, just like Photoshop barely gets shown at NAB as well. Photoshop users aren't worried about Photoshop even tho it's only in one pod at NAB, but we all use Photoshop. Nobody comments on the fact that the NAB bookstore monitors had Vegas advertised there very heavily, or that Vegas was on the shelves of the bookstore for the first time in the history of the show. Or that Vegas was used for many presentations in many booths. It only appears to be hidden when in truth, it's not. In our minds, it's all about Vegas. And if you compare Sony's presentation of Vegas on the stage compared to FCS, Avid Xpress, or Premiere Pro...it's woefully lacking. But those companies don't have other products to really show, either. Soundtrack for example, barely is noticable at NAB. But all videographers need to make soundtracks...

I was not at NAB, but the photoshop info i find interesting, they have a great product ,they know it, so be it.
I'm not concerned about Vegas not having a big high tech booth at NAB, but it is interesting the way sony operates, one division does not even know another division exists. weird, kind of like a chevy salesman never having heard of a Buick.
Just make a great up to date stable product and I'll be a happy vegas user, and i dont care how big their booth is next year.

Lets be frank about it, Sony Corporation has major, major problems. There is no way of knowing if this is effecting the folks over in Madison, but based on the new release of Acid, I would have to say that they are still doing extremely creative things. I think the key for Vegas is the next release.

The next release should be special. They key to winning customers in the software field is to give them features they didn't know they even needed. (I sort of stole that from someplace... not sure where)

Sony acquired Vegas I assume for new revenue source.
What is Sony’s plan for Vegas?
Top management over Vegas please informs us.
What road are you on? If you are going down a road I can’t follow I would really like know now.
I hope my concern is totally baseless; but someone hold my hand please...

So a question/thought comes to my mind…
Is it an intentional lack of marketing at NAB or Vegas is really intended for consumer use with a pro-sumer fringe?

If a Sony rep would have just said: Vegas does not make much revenue – hence the small presence – but do not worry we have solid planes for Vegas with long range goals...

So my concern is not so much the size of the Vegas presence, but more of the why it was a dim presence at NAB.

Low cost NAB marketing ideas for Vegas at NAB:
Maybe adjust just a ONE of the many spot lights above and hit the Vegas booth – or a neon sign? Perhaps a large orange box above the booth would help.
Next year at NAB assuming I can find the Vegas booth – I’ll bring some Orange cones and drop them around the Vegas booth so we can find it.

Logan5

I've stated before I am the lone ranger left using vegas. This can create problems if we all are working on parts of the same deal, so what is going to happen, I make them use Vegas, or i use what they use. Vegas 7 or whatever it is called has to be huge

what are you other editors using? - if they're FCP guys - you could use HDXchange for your workflows - create basic storyboards and export different sections from different editors - and then PTT those different sections (using your application of choice).

HDXchange lets you ingest and log simultaniously and has the ability to browse based on image information alone (not requireing text searching) and gives you the potential to work collaboratively with Sony Vegas, Avid Liquid, and FCP on the back end (or at least it will Sept. 1), and they will probably add support for more editing softwares in the near future - as I saw a lot of requests for a couple of editing platforms that weren't currently supported. All your editors need will be a network jack and your editing software of choice.

Course - if you guys would have talked to me at the HDXchange booth - I could have told you this already :)

Dave

edius guys, i wish i could have talked to ya, but i was in charlotte working, not vegas working :(

I've been a Vegas user since Vegas 3. This is the best editing software available, and I credit the innovative people behind it. I've done numerous projects, and even edited a feature film on it last year (www.sirenthemovie.com) That being said, I think that when Sony purchased Vegas, we all knew it was a mixed blassing. Yes, they got some great financial backing, but with Sony's proprietary attitude, I sensed dark clouds on the horizon. It was Vegas being the first to support 24p editing that helped put them on the map, but now it seems they are no longer free to support the best technology available, unless it belongs to Sony. So just when Vegas had the opportunity to really take over, they are hamstrung by corporate politics. I'm a holdout, but all of the people in the last 5 years that I sold on Vegas now use FCP. They hate it, but they still switched. I was at NAB and yes, I had to ask 3 people before I found a station with Vegas on it, and as mentioned above, it was showing the music program.

"Course - if you guys would have talked to me at the HDXchange booth - I could have told you this already :)"

"Sony had Vegas in many, many booths on the show floor from Blackmagic Design to Main Concept's booth"

Oh man, you guys are killing me :) I admit I'm a NAB newbie but I would have loved to have seen this stuff - I even looked for Vegas at the Blackmagic booth but must have missed it, crap!

Did they have a separate booth for the new release of Acid or is that app not promoted at NAB?

I did show Vegas from my booth some, but even the guys that were at my booth were wondering why there wasn't a Vegas dedicated booth out. They really loved some of the tools available to it etc... Course they hated Windows, (those that were editors) so they were all I don't use it... much, but I like it. etc....


Dave

I understand what Spot says that Vegas did indeed have a decent presence at NAB. But if experience and devoted Vegas folk had to HUNT for it, that's bad.

My bottom line is that I need a fast system (29.97 as much as possible) that can keep up with other edit systems - keeping up with The Jonses, as it were.
That's why I'm on the verge of purchasing an Axio setup for the cable company I work for (for my freelance work, I'm sticking with Vegas for the time being - we'll see what 7 brings).

I don't want much: I just want Vegas to be faster, better, easier and have more power and capabilities than any other system out there. And I'd like it to be equally priced (though I can afford to pay a little more since it IS, after all, Vegas). Last, I'd like this all to happen Yesterday.
Honestly, if it was as fast (29.97) as, say, Liquid Chrome, I'd be happier. Honestly, as much as I dearly love Vegas, if 7 isn't as fast/powerful as Liquid, I may feel complelled to migrate. That won't be a big loss to Sony, Vegas or anyone else for that matter, but I'll be really sad.

Apple was serving kool-aid in abundance.
I was willing to drink some Vegas kool-aid if they would have put a few cups out at NAB

NLE followers are like a small cult of sorts – Sony is too secular in that sense.

Logan5

liquid has very little going for it.

and the BG rendering / frame rate is about it, IMO.

it has a few perks, but overall - I'd still stick with Vegas over liquid, and it seemed to me that NOBODY that I was demoing to cared that Liquid was supported, save 2 or 3 folks.

I think that Liquid has some power in it's corner (so to speak), but I'm not about to switch, that's for sure.

Dave

"liquid has very little going for it."
I'm not going to be in Liquid's corner here. I don't want to fight for it. But the demo I saw was VERY impressive (this wasn't at NAB, it was a product demo by a vender in Santa Monica, CA).
I'm not easily knocked out. I think any editor can do a fine job. But what I was shown had me wishing Vegas would make that next leap.