If patrick is referring to the project he spoke to me about some months back - I think I would give my seal of approval on it being a decent idea, not entirely MY type of movie, but sounds like it is right up your alley and I thought it sounded like a decent deal to invest in if I had the bling.

Dave

I worked on a pilot with Shannon last summer and people, he's a great guy to do a project with.
Very professional.

Patrick, same script I saw a while back???

Cheers,
Gary
[edit: mis-spell]

Yep same script. I have tweaked it a bit but it has definitely improved with my writing ability.

Thanks for the endorsement guys :)

Shannon...
how do you market and distribute a $10k feature?

v

Yeah that's what i would like to know -- how do you make a 10k feature? Even with friends in the biz pitching in and tons of great connections on rental deals i don't think i would be able to pull it off.

Vic, what he didn't mention was that he's budgeted $75 million for marketing.

;o)

inspiring,, hell i couldn't produce a :30 sec HD spot for 10 K

Looks like a horror film is what they are shooting for.

Look at the budget of 1978 Halloween. Then look at how much it's made Trancas Int and Akkad family...much less where it planted John Carpenter as a horror king (in his prime).

It can be done (but agreed, the $10k should be broadend).
This person sounds completely "green", I would avoid.

Let me assure you Shannon is anything BUT green!

It can be done, well you can shoot anything for any sum of money, just how good it'll turn out is another matter! One way it's done is no one gets paid, they just get their name on the deed. If it does make money everyone gets a slice of the pie.

Certain genres that have a cult following are pretty easy to market, there are people here doing it.

Bob.

believe me guys it is possible and you can pay your cast...I recently finished my second feature for $8,000 called The Craving Heart...last year I shot Bred IN The Bone, a 90 minute feature for $5,000...you do have to work with very little but it is possible and both films were SAG...Craving even stars Golden Globe winner, John Saxon and Adriam Zmed. I have a book coming out on it soon...I hope it answers some of the questions on how to do this but for now, bear in mind that you can shoot an ULTRA LOW BUDGET feature with only one SAG actor...you do not have to pay the non-union actors and the actors you do pay get $100per day. Believe me it is possible with some sacrifices...but be a good writer!
You can find more SAG info on sagindie.com
you can also google my name for info on the movies I mentioned

Best,
Stan Harrington.
www.xristosproductions.com

Yes, it can be done (see my example "Halloween").

But...
10k?
A film release where everyone gets a "piece of the pie"?

WHAT "PIE" at $10k?
Even if the aim is for some high school hack flick...there's no pie.
And praying for a cult film and luck?, sure.I suppose you can take a chance on "luck" once again, but she better be ready for all that entails. Negotiations on ownership and control would be in order with anybody with a backbone and I.Q. How are the lawyer fees being covered at $10k

Sure sounds green to me, I sure as hell would avoid.

It's 2006. Tell your friend to learn the ropes of wrangling financial backing and then she can play producer.
Sorry.
* you think there might be reason her first project had "other things to do"?

At the risk of sounding awfully gruff...
It's common for film producers to try and f**k you going out, but f**king you going in?...that's your fault.
If your art and ideas are solid - shop it to those that are CAPABLE.

At 10k the only chance of success is if you have a really great gimmic... "Blair Witch Project," (great marketing) "El Mariachi" (on man feature)... etc. Aiming to shoot a "normal" movie for that money... I don't know. I for sure wouldn't sign up for that.

>>> I have nothing to do. I am bored now and I need to do someting. I'm going out of my friggin' mind! So....<<<<

lol.
Yes, definitely up there on the "must follow-up" list.

I wonder if she would like to mow my lawn (if she's really looking for something to do).

"I wonder if she would like to mow my lawn (if she's really looking for something to do)."

She?

Have you accomplished this much?
http://www.imdb.com/name/nm1394728/

Yeah gods and little fishes.

$10K is the production cost!
The participants don't get a slice of that, they get a slice of the PROFITS! Sell the thing for $100K and the slice isn't so bad, sell it for $1M and that's a pretty big pie.

Deep Throat cost $25K to make and made around $300M, that was shot on 16mm, today your costs would be lower. Sadly there was no deed so the makers didn't profit, only the distributors, aka The Mob.

I'm not saying this is easy, it's hard, very hard but I've helped out in a small way on two productions that were made for $0, the first was sold to a major network, probably only covered what would have been real costs, the second is currently doing the rounds looking for a buyer. I think it'll do OK, good script and decent talent. These productions are primarily designed to get exposure for the talent so making a quid isn't the primary aim but thanks to the deed if they do hit the big time there's something in it for everyone.

Bob.

I don't care who it is - male or female, and no I didn't care to "investigate" further after reading "I'm bored, I need something to do". it was comical at best (thanks for the laugh).
That settled?

>>>$10K is the production cost!
The participants don't get a slice of that, they get a slice of the PROFITS! Sell the thing for $100K and the slice isn't so bad, sell it for $1M and that's a pretty big pie.<<<

And you know this for a fact? Re-read my reply, any participants better get their shit together with negotiations and contracts, because there are ZERO specific promises layed out in the orig post (and I doubt you'll see much leeway in this dept. with Mr. "...the other guys left. I'm bored - let's make a movie".

Again, after reading the post, it left little question the scenario one would most likely be dealing with and my reply still stands. GREEN (borderline - offensive to those who are studied).
If you're work is worth a damn - SHOP IT TO THOSE WHO ARE CAPABLE. ONLY those who are capable.
*if you're a noob/high school or college film student who doesn't know where they are, nor his as* from the hole in the ground...by all means, go ahead and learn the hard way.
Caveat: Yes!!! You MAY get lucky with a cult hit (like another replier mentioned), but you better be damn sure you work out the negotiating or you more likely to see jack-sh*t.

>>>These productions are primarily designed to get exposure for the talent so making a quid isn't the primary aim but thanks to the deed if they do hit the big time there's something in it for everyone.<<<

Exposure. yeah, yeah...blah-blah. Welcome to 2006,enough of this "exposure" for suckers game. If you're good - know it and act it. The biz is about persistence, who you know, and luck. Or get off the pot.

Making your art, learning the "biz" and the importance of negotiation...and finally making $$ go hand in hand.
Learn that or lube up. Same rules apply for PROFESSIONAL musicians.

Really - I'm sorry to sound so gruff, but this stuff is important (to all artists really).
It's time to quell "the exposure game" with those that are experienced and more than capable. YOU dictate your future and business - not anybody else.
Especially when you're the goddam*ed TALENT!

The subject of no-budget filmmaking is very close to me because almost on daily basis somone who got my name from a friend of a friend calls me up and tells me about this great project of theirs that they want me to film. They tell me that the film will go to film festivals and such but they have no money to pay and very little if any for the lights....

In the proces of working on low budget films i have learned a few basic rules:
1. On average only those films that cost something do get finished (out of 20 or so short films i have worked on less then 1/3 saw the light of day; a no-budget $25,000 feature got abandoned after shooting 90% of the material).

2. No budget production are often bigger pain in the ass becasue the filmmakers are still learning so their is no concideration to art direction, costumes, often even good acting or casting, make-up etc so the final result ends up looking less proffesional if it could if only the filmmakers knew what they were doing.

3. Since i actually DO get paid even working on no-budget productions it hurts to see crew that often doesn't get paid. Or working with inexpereinced crew and havind to show them how each light actually works (thus loosing valuable shooting time).

Again there are exceptions.

yada yada yada - one more time:

Shannon...
how do you market and distribute a $10k feature?

I'm very interested in that subject. We are in the midst of a huge media production and distribution revolution.

I saw Stan Harrington's $5k feature, and you know what? It was pretty damn good - proving, "a good story makes a good movie". Did it look like "The Sound of Music"? Hell no - but I watched the whole thing, which is more than I can say for Mission Impossible II.

I have heard the stories of "direct to DVD" success, but I haven't heard HOW. It seems to me without the theatrical splash it's super hard to get the audience recognition necessary to promote the eventual sales of the DVD's.

Now I don't know Shannon Rawls, but if he's interested in putting up his own bucks to produce a quickee feature, then he MUST have a sense of how to market it, and thus pay for it.

It's true! "Blair Witch" (production budget under $10k) grossed over $157 million bucks - so there's the facts. You CAN make a profitable feature for a little money (well maybe YOU can't, but someone can and HAS).

It's the marketing and distribution that makes the money, though. Not the production budget. And it's the same catch 22.

You don't put an inexperienced DP on a $3 million dollar film. And you don't put a million dollars in marketing on a $10k dollar unless you've proven the ground swell is there. So how do you promote and market a $10k film???

Shannon??? You out there???
v

I don't think Shannon is going to need to be shown how a light worked...
___
Guys, count me in as a 2nd unit cam op / fx / editor...
I'll have to work around my F/T Vegas editing job and would have more time the end of Sept, but I'm down for whatever you need to get that script shot!

Gary

gary [at] laminatedsushi [dot] com

Vic, this is like asking DSE to give us all his teaching notes and contacts for his VASST training. Publicly listing contacts is a fast way to become unwelcome. Since you have a finished product already, just email him directly.

No... I'm not asking for names.

I'm trying to grasp concepts.

How do you market a "feature DVD" without getting theater play and attendant newspaper and TV ad coverage?

If the answer is, "I've built a list of distributors who know and trust me", then so be it. Even so... how do THEY market this kind of media.

Look... I've owned a self produced library of "How to" videos about Radio Controlled hobbies for 17 years.

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/search-handle-url/104-6258976-7243934?%5Fencoding=UTF8&search-type=ss&index=dvd&field-keywords=victor%20milt

For a long time we'd market them strictly through one or two of the major hobby catalogers (who did all the marketing in their catalogs). Recently we've added the "new" marketing resource of Amazon. And we've added a "personal" store on-line which people find via Google.

Now I've just given good knowledge on my hobby DVD marketing.

I'm asking a feature producer for the same concepts.
You see, people wanting to fly model airplanes will Google "Model Airplanes" or they will read the attendant magazines, or look at the specialty catalogs.

But who will look for a feature about a (for instance) "young man's trip through Europe in the '60s"? And how would they find it?

Hollywood and the studios have a huge machine. But it doesn't include $10,000 features. Mr Rawls seems to have an answer. That's what I'm interested in.

Amazon can work because they link similar things, you buy a book on ABC and their smart matching says 'hey, you might be interested in ABD".

But in general I think you're right, to market a video without the Hollywood behemoth behind it you need something that has a cult following or fills a niche market, I think the buzz word is 'viral marketing' although there's more to it than that. If it was just that everyone would be jumping on the bandwagon, so for what it is, it has to be good in way that appeals to the target group, that might be contrary to how Hollywood would judge the product too, after all the quickest way to kill a cult is having it go mainstream.

In the brief time I've been in this game I've come across people making a decent living producing some of the wierdest stuff imaginable. They find a market no one else is servicing and develop it, a lot of it is having the right contacts, some of it is doing business outside your home country.

I've also come upon way more people who think they have a great idea or script or whatever but no clue as to how to make it happen, much less how to market it, I think the trick is to start with the market and work backwards, like your videos on RC planes or Light It Right.

Bob.