Photoshop competitor is coming to Windows!


PeterDuke wrote on 3/17/2016, 6:29 PM
I can understand the need for constant development in the video editing scene, with new encoders and hardware coming out all the time, but I (in my ignorance) would have thought that image editing was a relatively mature art by now. For instance, what is in PS CC that is not in PS CS6 that is such a deal breaker?
JackW wrote on 3/17/2016, 6:48 PM
I"ve used Paint Shop Pro since version 2, but the Serif product looks like a good reason for change. Anything to stay ahead of Adobe and out of the cloud.

wombat wrote on 3/18/2016, 3:44 AM
Thanks for that - maybe I can dump my ancient version of Ulead's PhotoImpact!
I have signed up for the beta too.

VidMus wrote on 3/18/2016, 4:55 AM
My system is not set-up for beta testing software right now, so I will have to wait for the release version.
DGates wrote on 3/18/2016, 6:03 AM
Wow, a lot of Adobe hate here. I get it. It's nice to own software and be done with it.

But I'm on Adobe's subscription plan, and for me, it's much better than having to fork over big bucks to buy the software suite outright. I've played these subscription games before, so I know how to get a better deal. After getting the trial and not wanting to pay $50 a month, I contacted support to cancel. After much hemming and hawing, the price Adobe offered eventually dropped down to $29 a month. To have up-to-date versions of everything Adobe offers for a buck a day is a steal.

I'll go through the same cancellation rigmarole when the 12 months are up to get the same price on a month-to-month plan.
ushere wrote on 3/18/2016, 7:54 AM
bought cs6 and it'll probably see my future commercial work out. there's not really much difference to what i use if for than when i was teaching and using 7, and in fact, 7 is much quicker and lighter for doing basic work than cs6 anyway.

i did play with gimp, but since i had ps i wasn't too concerned with getting into it.

affinity looks good, but since i OWN cs6 i don't think i'll be diving in...
FixitMad0 wrote on 3/18/2016, 2:23 PM

Thanks for the heads up on this very promising Photoshop replacement. Since I am only on Windows, I have signed up for the Beta. I currently use other Serif products and have always like their programs. I just never liked calling them and the person on the other end trying to get me to buy another product when all I wanted to do was register their product.

Thanks again for sharing this info and Congrats to Serif!
Gene Aum wrote on 3/18/2016, 7:22 PM
Good luck with your yearly haggle with Adobe. I used to be able to get lowered cablemodem charges this way but a number of years ago they got very hardas***
about it and would no long haggle/bargain/deal.
It was full amount or cut the cord.

musicvid10 wrote on 3/18/2016, 7:54 PM
CS2 is pretty happy on my Win7 notebook.
Call me a lightweight.

DGates wrote on 3/18/2016, 9:49 PM
"Good luck with your yearly haggle with Adobe. I used to be able to get lowered cable modem charges this way but a number of years ago they got very hardas***

That's true. It could happen. I also went through the games with cable and satellite, and you're right, they're not as keen to give you a good deal anymore. I think it's because so many have cut the cord, they need to keep as many people paying full price as possible.

If it happens with Adobe, so be it. But like I said, for $29 a month, it's a bargain.
subchaz wrote on 3/20/2016, 9:01 AM
yeah i did the same with Adobe,but i got them to go even lower we only £19 for everything now,but this does look good,i wonder if they are going into the video editing game as well
Byron K wrote on 3/20/2016, 3:46 PM
Is $29/month ($348/year) every year a bargain for the personal user? It seems that Adobe is looking to cater to only the pro market. They could eventually loose a large market share similar to how IBM brushed off the PC market. I don't understand why the Adobe user base would be for such a model. Did they conduct a survey if this what the user base wants?

I've been using Cubase for a loooong time and Cubase listens to it's user base:

Dear customers, we conducted a survey a couple of months ago in which we asked if subscription might be an alternative model.
The result was a clear "no." Of course we will respect this. There are definitely no plans or whatsoever for a subscription model.
If you like to update to the latest version or if you stick with the version you originally purchased is entirely up to you.

Frank Simmerlein
Marketing Director

I work for one of the evil cable companies and I spoke one of the guys in our production department, while working on their network, and even though the company pays for the Adobe subscription, they don't like it.
DGates wrote on 3/20/2016, 6:34 PM
If you want to buy it outright, you can still find sellers on the internet that will sell you brand new CS6 software for a measly $3300. Of course, that 'new' version is already 4 years old and you can't update it anymore. And one would never get much in the resell market if they decided to sell it.

So yes, for me, the subscription model is an obvious bargain by comparison.
winrockpost wrote on 3/20/2016, 8:53 PM
will check it out, cs5 photoshop here...and does well...I do have ae on the monthly far a bargain to me...just my opinion , no issues at all upgrades painless..and no forking out 1200 for the program and hundreds for each upgrade...and if I don't need it I cancel ...not for everyone I get it, but works so far for me
DGates wrote on 3/20/2016, 9:07 PM
Ditto. It's whatever works for most people. And I'd think that for those who say they just want to use Photoshop a little for personal use, then Photoshop Elements would more than suffice. And you can download that to own.
rmack350 wrote on 3/20/2016, 9:11 PM
The software itself looks reasonable, at least in their demos and in the tutorial. It's curious that they're asking for half the dollars of their main Serif image editor app but maybe they're trying to get some market share.

Where it gets hairy is in trying to work with other people. For example, I upgraded my CS4 suite to CS6 at work because I needed to keep up with a contractor we were hiring. She couldn't downgrade for us and some of the work files she needed to deliver weren't readable in some of the CS4 apps.

For 50 bucks you can actually buy the Affinity image app for a regular contractor, but since by their nature *you* can't be their only client, this just adds up to another bitmap editor they have to get familiar with.

I've also played with Gimp over the last decade or so but the main thing that stopped me was the way it used up screen real estate. It's very easy to get stymied by little details in a new software candidate when you're already proficient in something like Photoshop, which I am.

All that said, my workplace doesn't even want to upgrade their adobe suites past CS4. There's just no obvious reason if unless you actually use the apps, which they think they do, but not really, and in that case it's just incremental improvements.

Laurence wrote on 3/20/2016, 10:53 PM
Thanks JR. The demo video looks killer. I signed up for the beta and will likely buy it as soon as it comes out.

Will they let you do a second laptop install on a single license?
JohnnyRoy wrote on 3/21/2016, 12:51 AM
> "Will they let you do a second laptop install on a single license?"

I don't know what they will do for Windows, but for the Mac you can buy it from the Apple Store (which is what I did) and install it on as many Mac's as you own. I have it installed on my 2012 MacBook Pro, 2010 Mac Pro 12-Core, 2008 Mac Pro 8-Core, and Mac Mini.

BTW, that's something you can't do with Adobe (i.e., use it on 4 computers). They not only hold you hostage for a monthly ransom or else it stops working, but you can only use it on 2 computers simultaneously. So ever after you pay them, they still treat you like a common criminal and don't trust you to install it on all of your computers. (as you can tell I really dislike Adobe's business practices) ;-)

Byron K wrote on 3/21/2016, 5:23 AM
Thanks DGates for your reply.
I researched Adobe's Creative Cloud pricing structure and I concur that in your case you got a good deal. (:

I signed up for and looking forward to the Windows beta. Thanks JR!
wwaag wrote on 3/21/2016, 12:15 PM

So ever after you pay them, they still treat you like a common criminal and don't trust you to install it on all of your computers. (as you can tell I really dislike Adobe's business practices) ;-)

You may dislike their business practices, but I doubt they are going to change back given their success. Here is their press release for 2015.
Apparently, they added 2.71 million new subscribers last year alone for a total of 6.17 million. Seems like a lot of incoming revenue to me.

While I'm not a fan of subscribing, $10 a month for Photoshop and Lightroom doesn't seem all that outrageous.


AKA the HappyOtter at System 1: Intel i7-8700k with HD 630 graphics plus an Nvidia 1050ti graphics card. System 2: Intel i7-3770k with HD 4000 graphics plus an AMD RX550 graphics card. System 3: Laptop. Dell Inspiron Plus 16. Intel i7-11800H, Intel Graphics. Current cameras include Panasonic FZ2500, GoPro Hero11 and Hero8 Black plus a myriad of smartPhone, pocket cameras, video cameras and film cameras going back to the original Nikon S.

winrockpost wrote on 3/21/2016, 9:27 PM
It is not outrageous, and frankly having it on 2 systems seems fair to me... vegas allows you to have it on how many you want but trusts that you will not run them at the same time...yeah right! I have deactivated AE on one system and activated it on a laptop for an out of town shoot, came home and switched back... was no big deal...not an adobe fanboy but ..20 a month is ok with when it goes up I may have another opinion.....
JohnnyRoy wrote on 3/24/2016, 12:28 PM
> "While I'm not a fan of subscribing, $10 a month for Photoshop and Lightroom doesn't seem all that outrageous."

...unless you also need Illustrator because you are a Graphics Designer and those are the two tools that you must have to get a job, and then it jumps 5x to $49 a month. So now you are paying for an entire suite of programs (Premiere Pro, After Effects, Audition, etc.) that you will never use because all you needed was Photoshop and Illustrator.

What's outrageous is not so much the the price...

What's outrageous is that it stops working if I stop paying instead of being frozen at the last version you paid for. I have annual maintenance contracts with other software vendors. I pay them a fixed amount every year and I get the next version free as long as my maintenance agreement is in place. But if I cancel the contract or let it expire, the software keeps working. THAT is the difference in Adobe's business model and why I call it "ransomware". They are hold me for ransom and if I don't pay the tools stop working. Likewise if I stop using Adobe products and move on, but a customer comes back a year later and needs an update on an old project, I have to pay Adobe again just to edit an old project with tools I no longer use day-to-day. It's like a cancer.

VMP wrote on 3/24/2016, 1:39 PM

I have done some stuff in the past with Illustrator.
But, with photoshop one can draw splines too (which can be enlarged endlessly).
Like with the rectangle tool, line tool then manipulate it with the pen tools.
Fonts can be enlarged endlessly too.
What does Illustrator do more which Photoshop can't?

Steve_Rhoden wrote on 3/24/2016, 2:19 PM
I listen to all of you here saying Adobe subscription pricing is not all that bad and
isn't outrageous and what-not.... But you are all mistaken when all that monthly
cost adds up on you, plus basing your logic on just one of their tools when you actually
will use more than one, plus the cost of plugins etc., Plus having a few slow seasons
where the work comes in..... I could go on and on...
The bottom line is, Subscription pricing is NOT good for none of you here in the long run.
Adobe is the only one that's gonna benefit, and all of you here who are singing them
songs of praise, are gonna be changing your tune pretty soon, especially when those
subscription prices starts hitting the roof.