Comments

FPP wrote on 4/8/2014, 9:17 AM
I hope people don't just purchase this new version just to be able to be the first ones to bash it.. If you are happy with the workstation you currently have why complicate your life trying to figure out what may or may not be wrong with VP13?
If it ain't broke don't fix it.
I am currently on the home stretch with 2 projects now and I wouldn't want to jeopardize all my hard work trying to figure out why 13 won't do what 12 was doing just fine for me.
My question is.. Do we have to purchase a new version of the same software every time one is released just because they added some new already released bells and whistles?
CJB wrote on 4/8/2014, 9:22 AM
How 'bout a NAB first adopters discount........?
OldSmoke wrote on 4/8/2014, 9:47 AM
@FPP
Well, you don't have to purchase it, just download the trial version and see what it does.

Proud owner of Sony Vegas Pro 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12 & 13 and now Magix VP15&16.

System Spec.:
Motherboard: ASUS X299 Prime-A

Ram: G.Skill 4x8GB DDR4 2666 XMP

CPU: i7-9800x @ 4.6GHz (custom water cooling system)
GPU: 1x AMD Vega Pro Frontier Edition (water cooled)
Hard drives: System Samsung 970Pro NVME, AV-Projects 1TB (4x Intel P7600 512GB VROC), 4x 2.5" Hotswap bays, 1x 3.5" Hotswap Bay, 1x LG BluRay Burner

PSU: Corsair 1200W
Monitor: 2x Dell Ultrasharp U2713HM (2560x1440)

larry-peter wrote on 4/8/2014, 10:20 AM
+ infinity, OldSmoke.

I used to be a consistent early purchaser of all Vegas releases, and as much as I intend to support SCS as long as possible, we have to do a reality check and be good consumers. That's our role in ensuring consistent releases. Try the software thoroughly, then reward the good releases with $$$. If you don't want to be a beta tester, don't pay to be one. Money talks, and you know the rest.
VMP wrote on 4/8/2014, 10:39 AM
+ 1 OldSmoke.

Even though I am sure I will be upgrading to VP13, surely trying it out first would be the first step. On a second PC to be sure.

VMP
videoITguy wrote on 4/8/2014, 10:47 AM
The inference that downloading a trial of 30 days adequately allows a consumer to do a thorough test is patently ridiculous.

To begin with, here is what a trial does justify - for the adventuring hobbyist consumer, there is an approach to sell the consumer usually newly acquired, by allowing a preview of the overall system.

However, as we understand the actual customer market out there, the trial does not serve any real purpose. 1) With an NLE installation of some clout it takes probably six-months to a year to adequately test against plug-ins and workflows. 2) If the market defined by SCS should be television stations with the reach into the "cloud" - then the performance during a trial is moot - the software needs to have a footprint and integrity over history that is impeccable - perhaps think Adobe Premiere.

So indeed, SCS remains pretty much always in beta. You can test it during a beta period, you can test it during a 30-day trial, and finally you can test it buy purchasing the download or retail package. Note your money is a vote, but SCS holds the cards in such a way, that your money casted as a vote is only to support the beta introduction to the marketplace.
OldSmoke wrote on 4/8/2014, 10:55 AM
Well, everybody is entitled to his/her own opinion.

I for one don't want to see Vegas Pro disappear and will support it. I never had any issues with any version of VP, I started at VP7, and I still own all of them. Smart rendering of XAVC is already a plus and worth the upgrade anytime... at least for me.

Are you saying PPro is flawless?

Proud owner of Sony Vegas Pro 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12 & 13 and now Magix VP15&16.

System Spec.:
Motherboard: ASUS X299 Prime-A

Ram: G.Skill 4x8GB DDR4 2666 XMP

CPU: i7-9800x @ 4.6GHz (custom water cooling system)
GPU: 1x AMD Vega Pro Frontier Edition (water cooled)
Hard drives: System Samsung 970Pro NVME, AV-Projects 1TB (4x Intel P7600 512GB VROC), 4x 2.5" Hotswap bays, 1x 3.5" Hotswap Bay, 1x LG BluRay Burner

PSU: Corsair 1200W
Monitor: 2x Dell Ultrasharp U2713HM (2560x1440)

NormanPCN wrote on 4/8/2014, 11:07 AM
hope people don't just purchase this new version just to be able to be the first ones to bash it..

I think the first ones to bash 13 will be for bugs that have been in Vegas 12, and acknowledged, and not been fixed. If you want/need a fix then 13 will be your only option.
Lovelight wrote on 4/8/2014, 11:58 AM
I never felt like more of a lemming than with Vegas 13. No great reason to upgrade but I will anyway.
Woodenmike wrote on 4/8/2014, 12:08 PM
This is the first release since i came onboard that says...nothing to me. unless everyone starts totally raving about it, this is the one i will pass on. I am seeing a trend in how to get the loyal Vegas users to spend more than they normally would by adding more plugs and gimmicks, none of which is needed by this user. This may be the year to take my upgrade money and put it towards equipment, so that's a win!
larry-peter wrote on 4/8/2014, 12:13 PM
@videoITguy. I agree completely with your assessment for a new user, but I think most users of previous versions can test their problem .vegs, render templates, bugs they have noted in their workflows, pretty thoroughly in 30 days. You're right that there are things that won't be discovered until someone tries something they haven't before.

I won't be testing everything - just the issues that have previously hampered my workflow. I would love to see Vegas work for everyone, but my priority in testing will be if it works for me, and what I typically do.
VMP wrote on 4/8/2014, 12:29 PM
+1 atom12.


VMP
videoITguy wrote on 4/8/2014, 12:49 PM
atom12 - your suggestion is good but be sure you isolate all the variables - are you going test against a new videocard? diff drivers? new mobo? decide what you are going to exactly test -

VegasPr013 versus VegasPr012 on the same platform, in the same drive partition, will you apps be running concurrently with the same settings? Decide as you bite.
larry-peter wrote on 4/8/2014, 1:05 PM
Good reminders. I'm in early mourning for those who have asked, "What system should I build to run VP 13 on?" I won't be upgrading in hopes I can use a bleeding edge video card. Just daily smooth sailing on a system I already trust.
Spectralis wrote on 4/8/2014, 1:08 PM
It would help if there was any information about Sony developing closer links with NVidia and AMD to ensure GPU compatibility. Has there been any information about this in the run up to NAB and v13?

Considering that most 3rd party FX now support GPU then this seems to me to be the utmost priority to get right in VP. I've not found any meaningful information about GPU integration and improvements in the v13 advertising.

I suppose Sony had to offer the cloud as this is the latest buzzword in the industry but if that's been prioritised over fixing ongoing bugs then that's very sad.
NormanPCN wrote on 4/8/2014, 3:29 PM
It would help if there was any information about Sony developing closer links with NVidia and AMD to ensure GPU compatibility.

Strictly speaking Vegas GPU code is GPU agnostic and it should be. They program to the OpenCL language to "use" the GPU. They compile the OpenCL code on the fly as needed (GPU and/or driver version change) and save the binaries in your appdata folder. The OpenCL driver folks provide the compiler with their driver install.

OpenCL can be implemented on a GPU but it can also be implemented on the CPU. Vegas does not let us select the CPU OpenCL device, although their detection logic does see the CPU driver. appdata folder, gpu_video_x64.log.

Really what SCS needs is to squash their bugs, and push AMD/Nvidia to fix their driver bugs if that is what it turns out to be. SCS support needs to figure out how they can reproduce possible bug reports, other than telling you to reinstall or stick their head in the sand when they can't figure it out.

It seems to me that with regards to Vegas, and GPU implementation, the tail has been wagging the Dog. The tail being Vegas and the Dog being the SCS developers.

Most GPU compute development experience has been typically very monolithic in nature. Vegas has numerous effects that can be combined in any random order, and you can have multiple tracks of video and so on. Far more degrees of freedom and more opportunities to shoot yourself in the foot (aka bug).

3rd party FX is brought up. A lot of those actually use a completely different GPU programming API, called OpenGL. Now you need OpenCL and OpenGL to seamlessly, a reliably coexist.

Given this level of complexity I give SCS some slack. However VP11 is when GPU came around and we have reached the end of the VP12 lifetime and they still have serious GPU issues. With that, I take back the given slack.
Spectralis wrote on 4/8/2014, 4:24 PM
I was thinking about some people having problems running 6xx and 7xx GPU's because VP isn't compatible with them for some reason. That seems incredible if that's still the case.

For example, Adobe and OTOY (Octane Render) which I also use have much closer connection to NVidia so that they can ensure their software will work with NVidia's GPU's especially new versions in production. Even though it does support both NVidia and AMD, Sony doesn't seem to demonstrate any of this kind of collaboration which is a bizarre business strategy when such collaboration might benefit all parties involved - including us. Especially considering that NVidia's 8xx GPU's are around the corner.

Kit wrote on 4/8/2014, 4:35 PM
Worse than sad in my view. I don't want cloud based products or cloud integration. I can't see it improving stability, just the opposite. Cloud integration is a reason for me to ignore an upgrade.
set wrote on 4/8/2014, 6:44 PM
Kit, so far I don't see 'Cloud' things in this VP13?
The cloud is only available in Ci...
ushere wrote on 4/8/2014, 7:39 PM
in ci ad...

Upload video through your web browser with blazing fast upload speeds

yeah, right, it's going to change your isp max upload speed!

any video i upload to anywhere always uploads at my isp's max upload speed (as embarrassingly slow as it is) - i'm so tired of marketing hype and b*llsh*t...

farss wrote on 4/8/2014, 7:54 PM
[I]"any video i upload to anywhere always uploads at my isp's max upload speed (as embarrassingly slow as it is) - i'm so tired of marketing hype and b*llsh*t..."[/I]

The marketing people have never really understood the technology they're trying to sell and you can be certain of at least one gaffe per campaign.

In fact you don't need a fast internet connection at all to make use of what's on offer. Low res proxies can be very small files and they're more than adequate for clients to see and comment on work already done on a project. Sure they're not going to see the video in all it's 10bit 4K glory but they don't need to, to be able to say "we don't like that shot" or "that's the wrong title"

Bob.
[r]Evolution wrote on 4/8/2014, 8:01 PM
Yuck!!!
Same 'ole Windows 2000 GUI/look.
VMP wrote on 4/8/2014, 8:23 PM
+1 farss.

Indeed.
NormanPCN wrote on 4/8/2014, 8:36 PM
In fact you don't need a fast internet connection at all to make use of what's on offer. Low res proxies can be very small files and they're more than adequate for clients to see and comment on work already done on a project.

I watched a video where they did something like this. It is about the production of the movie, The girl with the dragon tattoo.

They streamed 720p files via the internet (itunes/podcast) from Europe back to Los Angeles daily for screening. Then in a few days the ProRes LT 1080 files arrived via physical delivery. The film was cut on those files. Then of course the actual RED RAW files were used in final mastering.

It is an interesting watch if you are interested.