Upgrading from SD to 1080i - monitor choice?

NickHope wrote on 6/24/2006, 4:03 AM
I'm currently very happy with my monitor setup for SD DV editing which is 2 x 17" 1280 x 1024 Philips DVI displays and monitoring on an external Sony trinitron S-video TV via an IEEE1394 mini VCR.

I'm about to upgrade from my VX2000 to an HDV Z1 so I'm wondering about monitor options for use with Vegas 6.

Option 1: I'm considering something like an HP 24" 1920 x 1200 display. I guess I could output to it over DVI ("secondary Windows display") when editing, and just spread my desktop across it and my 17" display when not editing. I like the thought of pixel-for-pixel display for my 1080i material and the cost is reasonable (£863 inc VAT at Dabs.com p.s. Can't get Dell here in Thailand).

Question:
- How could I preview video to this display as well as keeping my 2 x 17" monitors for my Windows desktop (i.e. 3 monitors total)? My current Asus Video Suite graphics card just has 2 x DVI outputs. Would I just add another graphics card with a DVI output or what?

Option 2: Splash out on a Sony LMD-232W 23-inch 16:9 pro monitor. With stand and signalling processing unit the total cost is about £3000. This should of course be better than option 1 for colour correction, but I'm concerned that this won't give pixel-for-pixel display (1280 x 768) so would not be as sharp as as 1920x x1200 display. Also with that extra £2100 I could buy a 2nd HDV camera.

Questions:
- What would I really achieve with the Sony pro monitor that I couldn't achieve with the regular computer display?
- Am I overrating the importance of pixel-for-pixel display (1920 x 1200)?
- How would you connect the Sony monitor... over DVI or do I need a new card? I'm not really up with SDI, Decklink etc. yet.

What would you choose?

Thanks, Nick

Comments

farss wrote on 6/24/2006, 7:11 AM
Very difficult choice in my opinion. I recently bought the Dell 2407 which unlike the HP will do 16:9 via component inputs however I see you cannot get one in Thailand.
We've also got the HP and it's quite good and the 16:10 thing is not that big an issue. When you use it as the second display in Vegas of course it is true 16:9.
I've also used a glass 14" Sony PVM monitor via SDI (only SD) and to be honest for HD work it's just too small, 24" is as small as I'd go for HD work.
The best 24" LCD seems to be the Eizo, 3D LUTs etc but very expensive. I don't know much more, I'd go with the HP. Also some of those Sony monitors never looked that good to us, they seem to be improving them a lot lately with better panels, I'd be nervous about buying something that was about to be superceded and at that price you could buy the Eizo.

Bob.
NickHope wrote on 6/24/2006, 8:24 AM
Thanks very much Bob. If I was in the UK the Dell would be the natural choice. I wonder if another brand in the Dell $ ball park has the component inputs?

So how could I preview video to the HP display as well as keeping my 2 x 17" monitors for my Windows desktop (i.e. 3 monitors total)? My current Asus Video Suite graphics card just has 2 x DVI outputs. Would I just add another graphics card with a DVI output or is 2 the maximum?

Nick
GlennChan wrote on 6/24/2006, 10:18 AM
Depending on whether your current video card is integrated, AGP, or pciE... you can get a PCI or pciE video card to get additional monitors (obviously make sure your motherboard has the right slot). However, you do need to make sure the drivers/video cards play well with each other.

2- I'm not a big fan of the Sony Luma series LCDs... I'd say to get something reasonably good for now. If you splurge on the Luma, it's going to get obsolete rather quickly- its color reproduction and resolution is not as good as future monitors will be.
NickHope wrote on 7/9/2006, 1:22 AM
Thanks for the reply Glenn. I'll forget the Luma and go with a standard 1920px DVI LCD display like the HP.

I'm a little confused about the HDV workflow here. What I would like is my desktop spread across my 2 Philips 17" monitors (as it is now) with external preview on the HP widescreen monitor as well. But Vegas is looking for a "secondary windows display" and I suspect it will want to find the 2nd 17" display and not a 3rd monitor hooked to a 2nd display card. Unless someone knows differently.

So how can I do this? Do I need to get another card or something like a HDlink? If I had an HDlink what hardware would I need to get SDI out of the computer for the HDlink's inputs and which "Preview Device" option would I choose in Vegas' preferences. Or do I need to spend more and get a Decklink?

Sorry for my ignorance.

Nick
farss wrote on 7/9/2006, 5:31 AM
You could add a HD Declink card to get HD SDI output but a 24" monitor that'd accept it is pretty pricey as they're broadcast monitors although I think there's the odd LCD TV that you can fit such a card to but just the Decklink card is USD 1,000.

You could run two PCI-E video cards with SLI, that'll give you provision for 4 monitors, I know someone here was saying they're running such a rig with 4 monitors and Vegas. However that'd probably mean a new mobo and two not cheap video cards, you really want dual DVI cards from my experience.

Or else you could do what I do, run the 24" as the second monitor and all switch to secondary display device when I need full screen preview. However running different sized monitors is a PIA so you might start thinking about 2 24" monitors. I plan on another 2407 once Dell get them working minus the banding issues.

Bob.
epirb wrote on 7/9/2006, 6:43 AM
On my older machine I have been running3 monitors two 19" and one 24" (all Samsung) this was on a Sony Vaio with a single PCi-e (DVI/VGA) slot. I added a std PCI vga card, ran 1 19 on that and the 24 on the PCI-e 's DVI port and the other monitor on the PCI-e vga port.
you can choose which monitor that you want the secodary display on from the vegas preview properties.I used the 24 for preview when I want to turn it on and when its not on use it for things like the MM or project media bins.
Its worked out fine.

My new machine i have just completed has 2 PCI-e SLI slots, I bought one decent Dual DVI 7800gt SLI card(for future uses, plus some apps that use GPU ie Ultra, Bluff etc) and for now bought another std dual dvi card $60.00 since vegas doesnt really take advantage of SLI or GPU power)
this set up the primary card is running my main monitor 19' dell and a 24" 2407 new Dell like farss. the second is running a third monitor plus will out put to a DLP projector for client demos from time to time.
the other advantage I have discovered it that I can use the 2407 in two ways either a secondary monitor via DVI or component out at native 1080i .And it doesnt affect my resolution of the other monitors , like alot of older AGP card used to do when you use the component outs.

Bottom line is if you have a spare PCI slot go get another video card youcan pick up a card for 35.00.
just make sure you stick with like drivers as mentioned above.(ie you have a Nvidia card get another or if you have an ATI get another ATI etc)
NickHope wrote on 7/9/2006, 12:39 PM
Thanks for the replies guys.

Bob I did wonder about 2 x 24" displays but I'm so used to working in SD with my timeline spread right across 2 x 17" monitors and external preview on my TV that I would like to continue working in a simlar manner, just adding a 3rd display instead of the TV (not to mention saving the substantial cost of the 2nd 24" display).

My existing PC gear is 2 years old but I'm really hoping I can still use most of it when I go to HDV to keep costs down...

At the moment I'm running an Asus V9520 Video Suite Nvidia FX5200 AGP 8x 128Mb dual DVI card (no VGA). My 2 x Philips 17" are off this.

I do have spare PCI slots on my Asus P4C800-E motherboard so if I understand correctly I should just be able to add a basic Nvidia PCI DVI card like this one to drive the 24" HP monitor?

Epirb, assuming I'm careful with drivers as you say, do these 3rd or even 4th monitors just appear under the list of "Displays" on the "Settings" tab of XP's "Display Properties" dialogue? I see my 2 displays listed there now.

Thanks again. Nick
epirb wrote on 7/9/2006, 4:01 PM
Yep that card will work, supports the resolution, and yes when you click on the displays tab you'll see the third monitor. you can then place it appropriatly and the attach it too.
Then in Vegas set it as the secondary monitor.
Spot|DSE wrote on 7/9/2006, 9:16 PM
The Luma may become obsolete, but it's a hugely used standard in a lot of HD facilities. Wish I owned one, but have had opportunity to use one for lengthy periods of time.
Personally, I use a Sony 234b for my own work, and have access to an HD CRT for really critical color correction work. (even tho it's HD, it's still not 1080)
NickHope wrote on 7/9/2006, 11:08 PM
Cheers epirb.

By the way, anyone who has 2 monitors and an Nvidia card like mine, set the "nView Display Mode" to "Dual View" if you want to preview on one of your monitors as a "windows secondary display" in Vegas. This achieves the same as checking "Extend my Windows desktop onto this monitor" in XP's "Settings" tab on "Display Properties". "Horizontal Span" does not work.

Nick