Using keyframe to smooth out the end

yassera-s wrote on 12/17/2020, 1:47 PM

I am testing a new credit roll which is moving across the screen as usual at constant speed. I want to make the last 2 seconds of the credit roll to slow down gradually (as in a curved slope) until it finally stop. I tried adding a keyframe before the last 2 seconds and in the last keyframe where the credit roll stop I changed its curve to smooth and set the smoothness to 100%. See screenshot:

However the end result is not what I was expected. instead of starting to slow down at the keyframe I added it, actually speed up first then slows down gradually until it stops! Watch it here:

Why this is happening?

Comments

Jack S wrote on 12/17/2020, 4:39 PM

@yassera-s You need the previous keyframe fade to be Fast.

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yassera-s wrote on 12/18/2020, 2:19 AM

@yassera-s You need the previous keyframe fade to be Fast.

Thanks @Jack S  I tried it and it made it worse .. see video:

Any idea why? BTW I am using Event pan crop and your screen shot shows that's track motion

walter-i. wrote on 12/18/2020, 2:53 AM

An often rumored tip is to set the previous keyframe to "smoth" and the last to "slow".

yassera-s wrote on 12/18/2020, 3:18 AM

An often rumored tip is to set the previous keyframe to "smoth" and the last to "slow".

Thanks @walter-i. but that didn't work as well. I remember that it always worked when I set the last keyframe to smooth but don't know why it's not working now

So is that mean I should use other software to achieve the results I want ?

Jack S wrote on 12/18/2020, 5:01 AM

@yassera-s What's happening is that the keyframe 2 seconds from the end is interrupting the linear transition of your text. When the playhead reaches this keyframe the fade type of this keyframe takes over. That's why it appears to speed up before it slows down. For your purposes, you need a fade type of 'linear to slow', and unfortunately, that's not one of the fade types available.
There must be a way of achieving this, but I can't think of it at the moment. I'll have to chew it over because it's a method that would be very useful for transitions.

I remember that it always worked when I set the last keyframe to smooth but don't know why it's not working now

The last keyframe fade type has no effect. The fade effect of keyframe number 1 (say) only affects the fade between keyframe number 1 and the next keyframe. So, because there's no keyframe after the last one, the fade type of the last one is irrelevant.

My system
Genshin Infinity Gaming PC
Motherboard Gigabyte H610M H: m-ATX w/, USB 3.2, 1 x M.2
Power Supply Corsair RM750X
Intel Core i7-13700K - 16-Core [8P @ 3.4GHz-5.4GHz / 8E @ 2.50GHz-4.20GHz]
30MB Cache + UHD Graphics, Ultimate OC Compatible
Case Fan 4 x CyberPowerPC Hyperloop 120mm ARGB & PWM Fan Kit
CPU Fan CyberPowerPC Master Liquid LITE 360 ARGB AIO Liquid Cooler, Ultimate OC Compatible
Memory 32GB (2 x 16GB) DDR5/5200MHz Corsair Vengeance RGB
MSI GeForce RTX 4060 Ti 8GB - Ray Tracing Technology, DX12, VR Ready, HDMI, DP
System drive 1TB WD Black SN770 M.2 NVMe PCIe SSD - 5150MB/s Read & 4900MB/s Write
Storage 2 x 2TB Seagate BarraCuda SATA-III 6.0Gb/s 7200RPM
Windows 11 Home (x64)
Monitors
Generic Monitor (PHL 222V8) connected to GeForce RTX 4060 Ti
Generic Monitor (SAMSUNG) connected to iGPU

Camcorder
SONY Handycam HDR-XR550VE

Jack S wrote on 12/18/2020, 5:59 AM

@yassera-s Problem solved. You need to use the Titles & Text plug-in to create your scroll. Set your keyframes as you did when you used Pan/Crop. Change the Lanes/Curves mode to Curves. Set the next to last keyframe fade mode to split manual and adjust the right-hand node to get a 'linear to slow' curve.

This is the Help section on it

and this is my attempt

My system
Genshin Infinity Gaming PC
Motherboard Gigabyte H610M H: m-ATX w/, USB 3.2, 1 x M.2
Power Supply Corsair RM750X
Intel Core i7-13700K - 16-Core [8P @ 3.4GHz-5.4GHz / 8E @ 2.50GHz-4.20GHz]
30MB Cache + UHD Graphics, Ultimate OC Compatible
Case Fan 4 x CyberPowerPC Hyperloop 120mm ARGB & PWM Fan Kit
CPU Fan CyberPowerPC Master Liquid LITE 360 ARGB AIO Liquid Cooler, Ultimate OC Compatible
Memory 32GB (2 x 16GB) DDR5/5200MHz Corsair Vengeance RGB
MSI GeForce RTX 4060 Ti 8GB - Ray Tracing Technology, DX12, VR Ready, HDMI, DP
System drive 1TB WD Black SN770 M.2 NVMe PCIe SSD - 5150MB/s Read & 4900MB/s Write
Storage 2 x 2TB Seagate BarraCuda SATA-III 6.0Gb/s 7200RPM
Windows 11 Home (x64)
Monitors
Generic Monitor (PHL 222V8) connected to GeForce RTX 4060 Ti
Generic Monitor (SAMSUNG) connected to iGPU

Camcorder
SONY Handycam HDR-XR550VE

yassera-s wrote on 12/18/2020, 7:18 AM

Thank you @Jack S using Titles & Text plug-in could have worked but unfortunately it does not support images as I will need to use logos in credit roll

yassera-s wrote on 12/18/2020, 7:19 AM

@yassera-s What's happening is that the keyframe 2 seconds from the end is interrupting the linear transition of your text. When the playhead reaches this keyframe the fade type of this keyframe takes over. That's why it appears to speed up before it slows down. For your purposes, you need a fade type of 'linear to slow', and unfortunately, that's not one of the fade types available.
There must be a way of achieving this, but I can't think of it at the moment. I'll have to chew it over because it's a method that would be very useful for transitions.

I remember that it always worked when I set the last keyframe to smooth but don't know why it's not working now

The last keyframe fade type has no effect. The fade effect of keyframe number 1 (say) only affects the fade between keyframe number 1 and the next keyframe. So, because there's no keyframe after the last one, the fade type of the last one is irrelevant.

@Jack S also thank you for the explanation

rock-c wrote on 12/18/2020, 7:27 AM

So is that mean I should use other software to achieve the results I want ?

Vegas has big problem in keyframe. You should give free Resolve a try.   Yes, it's free, you can use both Vegas and Resolve. 😅

yassera-s wrote on 12/18/2020, 9:35 AM

So is that mean I should use other software to achieve the results I want ?

Vegas has big problem in keyframe. You should give free Resolve a try.   Yes, it's free, you can use both Vegas and Resolve. 😅

Thanks @rock-c  obviously keyframing doesn't always work correctly in Vegas and as i said before Vegas becomes very unpredictable sometimes some functions work and sometimes it stop working for no reason. Vegas team should focus on fixing bugs and other problems especially those inherited from older versions of vegas but seems they are only busy making new useless features that most editor dont use . Vegas becoming less and less appealing especially for its high price and they should learn to compete with resolve

I am now forced to use other software to achieve the results i want and i was thinking in premiere pro or after effect or hitfilm pro but will try resolve as well. truly i am not expert in any of the mentioned software so will need to watch tutorials.

yassera-s wrote on 12/18/2020, 3:01 PM

UPDATE: I watched some After Effects tutorials and it was very easy to get the result I was looking for. I hope vegas will address the key frames problems in next updates so that we dont have to jump to another software for just simple credit roll effect.

set wrote on 12/18/2020, 3:09 PM

I had similar trouble in the past... but what I did previously is just try make a trick of adding more keyframe in the pan crop 'before end' but then readjust the keyframe position to where it 'fit' between beginning to mid before end for 'Linear' and 'Fast' from mid to end in order to keep the overall motion 'not jumping'

Last changed by set on 12/18/2020, 3:09 PM, changed a total of 1 times.

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yassera-s wrote on 12/18/2020, 3:12 PM

I had similar trouble in the past... but what I did previously is just try make a trick of adding more keyframe in the pan crop 'before end' but then readjust the keyframe position to where it 'fit' between beginning to mid before end for 'Linear' and 'Fast' from mid to end in order to keep the overall motion 'not jumping'


@set thanks will try that next time though i don't think it will be better than after effects

rock-c wrote on 12/23/2020, 6:52 PM

The keyframe problem has a long history 😂 There are many posts about it.

https://www.vegascreativesoftware.info/us/forum/bug-of-vp17-ofx-keyframe-bezier-curve-can-t-make-a-super-fast-fade--118793/

https://www.vegascreativesoftware.info/us/forum/bug-report-ease-in-and-ease-out-handles-can-t-work-normally--124775/

This problem disable you to create high-end smooth animation 😂 

But actually this problem doesn't occur in other pro level NLE, including PR, ED, AVID, FCP, Resolve, Video Pro, etc. So the VEGAS team should have a serious look at these posts 😅 @VEGASPascal @VEGASDerek