Vegas 10 First impressions

Sebaz wrote on 10/11/2010, 2:34 PM
Overall I would say my first impression is positive, although scrubbing the timeline with AVCHD footage crashed it about a minute into opening it for the first time, but it hasn't happened since. What I still can't understand from programmers of most software companies is why the user settings are not saved until the program closes. Whatever preferences you set, if the program crashes, you lose them. You have to waste time setting them all over again. This is not only in Sony software, but almost in every piece of software that I have ever used, and it's just retarded.

Regardless of that, when I got Vegas 10 up and running I was gladly surprised to see that Sony had put some effort in reworking the H.264 reader, like Eugenia had mentioned the other day. Playback of AVCHD footage is faster. I was able to play real time with keyframed color correction and levels in Preview Full mode, and if I didn't keyframe color correction, only levels, I was able to play the footage in real time with both filters on.

The GPU accelerated AVC encoding still needs some work. I took three files of AVCHD footage, I put them on the timeline and ran some encoding tests. The total time of these three files together is 00:01:09;02. I didn't put any filters on them. Without GPU encoding, it took 6:30 to encode. With GPU acc., it took 4:52, what I would say a small gain. Premiere CS5 took 1:43 to encode the same exact footage, and in Premiere the GPU is not used to accelerate encoding. In fact, I selected MPE software only and it took exactly the same. This is with the two settings for high quality checked.

I also encoded the same footage with x264 to compare visually, and I couldn't find any difference between the three, so Premiere wins the contest hands down because it encoded in almost real time, while Vegas took about four times more than real time with GPU acceleration. The good news is that at least using the GPU in Vegas doesn't degrade the quality of the encoding.

One thing that annoys me is that now to keyframe filters you have to press an Animate button where the keyframes were until now, and I don't see the point of adding an extra step even if it's just pressing a button.

As for DVD Architect 5.2, it brings some really nice new themes, but I was very disappointed to see that it still doesn't support MBAFF (Macroblock Adaptive Frame-Field Coding), so if I want to encode in x264, which is the best quality h.264 encoder, I'll have to keep using Adobe Encore to author BDs.

I think that if you work a lot with AVCHD footage it's a worthy upgrade, especially if you get the email with the $140 upgrade.

Please feel free to add to this thread with your own first impressions and/or tips.

Comments

PeterDuke wrote on 10/11/2010, 5:02 PM
"What I still can't understand from programmers of most software companies is why the user settings are not saved until the program closes. Whatever preferences you set, if the program crashes, you lose them."

I had always thought that this was a Windows caching problem - the cache is not flushed immediately. I could be wrong - I usually am.
Jay Gladwell wrote on 10/11/2010, 5:08 PM

"It seems all you people are forgetting about what a bug infested piece of junk Vegas 9 was at the beginning, and it took at least three updates to get it to a point where you could use it as a primary editing tool. I will laugh in a few weeks when everybody is bitching about the bugs in 10, saying that they got on board too fast."

Did you "get on board too fast"?

Sounds like you're whistling a different tune, today.


DGates wrote on 10/11/2010, 5:10 PM
V10 would have to be pretty stellar with AVCHD for me to forgo using NeoScene.
Sebaz wrote on 10/11/2010, 5:43 PM
Did you "get on board too fast"?

Do you work for Fox News? I'm asking because you edit things to your convenience to make it look like I said one thing when I didn't. If you read the second paragraph, which says:

"Although I hope that I won't laugh, that finally SCS learned the lesson and that it will work great, in which case I will gladly upgrade, but when they lower the price, which eventually happens."

I did precisely that, I played with the trial, saw that minus a few annoyances it worked pretty well, and I decided to purchase it when they lowered the price, which in this case happened right away.
Jay Gladwell wrote on 10/11/2010, 6:03 PM

"Do you work for Fox News?"

LOL -- Yeah, and you work for CNN, talking out of both sides of your mouth. That way, regardless of what happens, you're right!


craftech wrote on 10/11/2010, 6:06 PM
There's a difference between the two? I hadn't noticed.

John

EDIT: Have they changed the Vegas 2.0 credit roll generator??
rs170a wrote on 10/11/2010, 6:13 PM
Have they changed the Vegas 2.0 credit roll generator??

Nope. It's still the same POS it's always been :-(

Mike
craftech wrote on 10/11/2010, 6:27 PM
Thanks Mike.....................I think?

John
rs170a wrote on 10/11/2010, 6:32 PM
John, that's why I use the basic titler and fake my roll in it.
Much better control over everything.

Mike
craftech wrote on 10/11/2010, 6:48 PM
I guess since that is the only request on this forum for each new version I have made for years and years it gets really annoying. There isn't anyone here who doesn't think the Credit Roll has sucked since it's inception and is amateurish. Yet despite the laundry list of requests by most here, that has been my only request and it never happens. I don't get it.

John
rs170a wrote on 10/11/2010, 6:55 PM
After seeing what SCS considers an improved titler (Pro Type), I've given up asking for a new one.
IMO, if they really think that's a pro titler, they just don't get it :-(

Mike
GenJerDan wrote on 10/11/2010, 8:22 PM
"I had always thought that this was a Windows caching problem - the cache is not flushed immediately. I could be wrong - I usually am."

The cache can be flushed (written to disk) at any time, but it takes a positive acrion, i.e. user pushed a Save Now button.

Doing it automatically? You could, but you'd have to put code in the "changed" event of every possible option individually; there's no blanket way of doing it. It gets messy.
Sebaz wrote on 10/11/2010, 9:29 PM
"What I still can't understand from programmers of most software companies is why the user settings are not saved until the program closes. Whatever preferences you set, if the program crashes, you lose them."

I don't think it's a matter of cache. I'm not a programmer, but to me it's as simple as saving an ini file. The user makes changes to the preferences, it's all written to an ini file right away and saved as soon as the user hits Apply or OK. Nothing easier than that.
A. Grandt wrote on 10/11/2010, 10:01 PM
GenJerJan

I've done something like this in the past, though I only saved the settings/preferences when the preferences window was closed.
DGates wrote on 10/12/2010, 1:15 AM
I DL'd the trial, and I'm seeing quite a decent improvement in AVCHD behavior/playback. In V8, when I import a series of raw AVCHD clips on the timeline, the thumbnails on the video track would be all screwed up. They would have no relation to the actual clip. And playback was sketchy and not reliable.

While V10 is not entirely quirk free with AVCHD, it's looking pretty darn good. Probably nothing that a good couple of updates couldn't smooth out.
DGates wrote on 10/12/2010, 1:17 AM
C'mon John, you're griping about a credit roll? If you don't like it, then don't use it. Have your titles pages fade in and out. Looks just as professional, if not more so.
PeterDuke wrote on 10/12/2010, 1:58 AM
"I don't think it's a matter of cache. I'm not a programmer, but to me it's as simple as saving an ini file."

Ini files went out of fashion when the registry came in. Why do something simple when there is a complicated way of doing things?

Anyway, the write to the ini file could still be in a cache, the same as writing to registry or any other file. This is transparent to the programmer. Caches are used to speed up reads and writes because disks are much slower than RAM.
GenJerDan wrote on 10/12/2010, 3:34 AM
"Anyway, the write to the ini file could still be in a cache, the same as writing to registry or any other file. This is transparent to the programmer. Caches are used to speed up reads and writes because disks are much slower than RAM."

According to Microsoft: ' If your device has persistent storage, aggressive flushing can cause performance issues.'

-from http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/ms885460.aspx
craftech wrote on 10/12/2010, 6:20 AM
C'mon John, you're griping about a credit roll? If you don't like it, then don't use it. Have your titles pages fade in and out. Looks just as professional, if not more so.
==============================
I just don't thin that after this many years (since the first Vegas) it's that insignificant that it couldn't be improved (a little?) maybe. It's basically the only thing I have been harping on fr years and years. Most people have laundry lists of things they would like to see. Mine is consistent and really simple. I know the workarounds as well as anyone, but one could say that about any request for any improvement in the software right? As long as there is a workaround then there is no need to change anything. The credit roll is a ridiculous amateur implementation as we all know.

John
Jay Gladwell wrote on 10/12/2010, 6:44 AM

I agree with and fully support John on this. There is nothing, nothing more basic than a credit roll (regardless of what others may think). The fact that Vegas cannot provide smoothly rolling credits is unacceptable.

Oddly enough, I never had any problems with it when shooting/editing SD video. Now that I've moved to HD it's a real problem, one that should have been addressed versions ago.

Since there is no workaround, it needs to be resolved, e.g., "fixed." The question is why hasn't been?


scissorfighter wrote on 10/12/2010, 6:53 AM
There is nothing, nothing more basic than a credit roll...

you forgot Page Peel!

But I agree, the next most basic thing is a good credit roll. V10 is great so far; hopefully SCS will put some effort into improving credit tools in the near future.
dibbkd wrote on 10/12/2010, 7:26 AM
Hey Sebaz, are you coming and bringing Vegas 10 to the meetup this week?
PeterWright wrote on 10/12/2010, 7:26 AM
>"Since there is no workaround.."

I'm not saying it shouldn't be improved, but I've only ever used a workaround, the normal Text Generator, and the Placement tab used to position the beginning and end of the credits. I've used it with many many lines of text, and it works and scrolls fine - the duration of the event controls the speed.

But I agree with the main point - when you think of the amazingly clever things which Vegas does easily, a really good credit roll, with free choice of fonts, colours etc., should be, excuse my French, a piece of piss.

Randy Brown wrote on 10/12/2010, 7:36 AM
....should be, excuse my French, a piece of piss.

For those of you that don't know French, that means easy (I think)