Vegas 11 is CRASH HAPPY

GregO wrote on 3/18/2012, 3:45 AM

Just upgraded from Vegas 9 to 11 because I couldn't even load some new Canon DSLR video on to 9 without it crashing. Other than that... had no problems with 9. Rendered every time ( just about) and I loved it.

(BTW... Desktop uses a 2.67 gigahertz Intel Core i7 920 - 6GB ram - Win 7 - 64bit. With a ATI Radeon HD 4800 GPU)

Anyway... My buddy with the DSLR camera said He upgraded to Vegas Pro 11 and that fixed his problems with editing his DSLR footage. So... since it was a paying project on a tight deadline, I dropped the big bucks to upgrade immediately and have had a massive domino of problems.

First issue: it says that the GPU is not compatible with the GPU accelerator. (Bummer number one... Now I have to drop even more money for new GPU... But still have to get my project done ASAP)

Second issue: Love the new blue titler that comes with 11! BUT... It says my GPU is not compatible with it and may have issues or need new drivers. so I installed the new drivers and at least the new blue titler would now open in Sony Vegas.

Finish the big edit using the great new blue titler affects all over it and then go to render. First time it renders just great, looks great, sounds great. I going to make a few tweaks and try to render again. This time it crashes on me part way through. I try several other times with my client coming the next day to see the final project. Nothing but crash after crash in the middle of rendering.

So then I tried to render it in other formats the next morning (original crashes in Windows media video format) turns out it won't even start to render in other formats. So then I had the bright idea to load Vegas and the new blue titler and my production onto my new laptop to at least have the project rendered once my client arrives (now 2 hours away).
(It's an HP Pavilion dv7-6163cl. Intel Core i7-2670QM Processor 2.20 GHz - With 8GB DDR3 SDRAM. Radeon (tm) hd 6770m GPU.)
Just got it a few months ago... So This thing SHOULD be just screaming along without any problem! Right?

Nope!!! I load up Sony Vegas and open it up. Then I load the new blue titler program and now Sony Vegas crashes immediately when I try to open Vegas and won't even open any project at all. A warning comes up again saying that I may need updated drivers or to upgrade to a newer GPU. Seriously? A newer GPU than December? (Can you tell I'm a little P.O.'d about now?) So I update all the drivers on the laptop… And still Sony Vegas still won't even run when the new blue titler is installed.

So back to the old computer. I have to render it until it crashes... See where the video ended... Render it from there until it crashes... And do that four times to complete the whole 6 1/2 min. video. I patched back together at least to play for the client.

The request a few tweaks which should just take minutes to fix... But NO!!! Crash! Crash! Crash... It renders 19%… Than 37%… Then 8%… Than 64% before crashing. I keep trying and once in a while get a full render... But when I listen back to it… It has all kinds of weird sound anomalies in the middle of the project that randomly show up in some renders and not on others. So… After hours and hours and hours wasted… I finally get one good render to send to the client.

Sorry to vent all of the details... But I'm at my wits end and have no idea what to do for my laptop.

I'm guessing I need a new GPU for my desktop... But… Will that really fix the problem? Obviously I have a new GPU in my laptop and it doesn't like that.

Any suggestions???

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Comments

VanLazarus wrote on 3/24/2012, 6:23 PM

@Hulk.... You should ask SCS if you can become a beta tester for Vegas. I just recently joined. Having come from a video game background where code had to be bulletproof BEFORE release, I'm as frustrated as you are by SCS's current QA system. The jury is still out if my input will have any positive impact, but I'm trying to be as constructive as possible, giving as much detail as I can on every problem I encounter. I'll be pushing for real stability on Vegas 12 BEFORE it's first version is released.

Duncan H wrote on 3/24/2012, 8:48 PM

VanLazarus,

I've read many of your posts & great to hear you're part of the Beta test team. One request, how about we collectively push for a stable v11, before anyone is asked to shell out more for v12. !!

ushere wrote on 3/24/2012, 9:23 PM

@ van.

didn't you have to sign a non-disclosure agreement?

i've beta tested quite widely and all my nd's stated i wasn't to mention i was a beta tester....

GregO wrote on 3/26/2012, 1:21 AM

I just figured out why Vegas 11 is soooo LAME.

Now that they have us all hooked on using their product... they found a way to make even more money by selling us a "support plan." ("Support Plan members receive person-to-person support via a toll-free telephone number and email support
Cost: Packages Range from $29.95 - $149.95")

HEY SONY... That is a HUGE conflict of interest. In my mind... your product should be so good that you don't NEED a "support plan." Like the Maytag repairman... your support team should be one completely bored guy from the lack of calls (ie: lack of problems with the software).
So to charge me for your faulty product... and then charge me even more for a support plan is "double dipping" and as
I mentioned, a complete conflict of interest. You see... you actually make more money by making a faulty product that requires your users to purchase an additional support plan to navigate through YOUR faulty product. Sounds sort of like government to me.

I think I've figured out your scam...

Grazie wrote on 3/26/2012, 1:56 AM

Greg0, VP11 needs particular Graphics Card for acceleration. What Card are you using and the driver? I've read your specs, I'm guessing SONY Suppport would do the same.

Cheers

G

farss wrote on 3/26/2012, 2:30 AM

"You see... you actually make more money by making a faulty product that requires your users to purchase an additional support plan to navigate through YOUR faulty product."

I think many here would gladly pay the extra $149.95 to get a version of V11 that just worked.

Bob.

PeterWright wrote on 3/26/2012, 3:11 AM

I've been having a pretty good time with V11, but just out of interest, and for the first time for months, I just tried the New Blue Titler again. Vegas crashed.

Simple lesson - Unless you happen to have a system that somehow can accommodate this add-in, leave it alone. Unless you like having problems and complaining.

I went back to the original Titler and produced a beautiful white title on a black background - looks fabulous.

Grazie wrote on 3/26/2012, 3:25 AM

"I think many here would gladly pay the extra $149.95 to get a version of V11 that just worked."

Does that include you?

My personal experience, after investing in my PC upgrade last year, I too am desperate to have VP11 work sweetly. There are some very fine features - which I like.

G

ushere wrote on 3/26/2012, 4:32 AM

+1 happy to pay for a version that worked - that said, my only problems at the moment seem to involve newblue, especially the titler.

getting near the point where i'm simply going to dump all my newblue plugins and write them off.

farss wrote on 3/26/2012, 4:40 AM

"Does that include you?"

Absolutely and I've said the same several times over the years. If doubling the cost of the upgrades got us a stable release I'd gladly pay the money. After all it's a small amount compared to what we spend upgrading our computers, our cameras and all the other stuff we use.

Still though the main point of my post was that (sadly) paying $149.99 doesn't seem to buy you anything and the notion that users are held to ransom for an extra $149.99 to get a stable version of Vegas is wrong.

Bob.

deusx wrote on 3/26/2012, 7:26 AM

I don't see anything wrong with Sony charging extra for support. Most other companies with good support, or even not so good just charge you up front for all that and you often end up not using support anyway or just using it to figure out how to install and activate the &%'&$ thing.

Prices of $2000 - $5000 and yearly maintenance fees of $500 - $1000+ are pretty common with professional software, so when you pay what you pay for Vegas and extra support you're still way ahead. Works fine for me. Vegas 11 works and I didn't pay for support I don't need.

Hulk wrote on 3/26/2012, 7:47 AM

deusx makes a good point on the support issue. I think there are many novice to intermediate users who require support for issues that expert users would either not have in the first place or would quickly solve themselves. If everyone got free support then everyone would have to pay for this support in the purchase price of the product. Nothing is free. The people who built solid systems and knew how to set them up and use them would pay for the support of those who did not. Finally, but reporting and fixes should not be something the user should pay for since they are design flaws in the software.

Now if additional Vegas purchase money actually went into development. . . that's a different story

Laurence wrote on 3/26/2012, 8:01 AM

Seriously? You think that because you use Vegas at maybe 10% of it's capacity that that has some bearing on the experience of those who push it a little, only to crash and burn?

My difficulties have nothing to do with user error. Paid support is for bringing people that need extra help up to speed on complex software. I can assure you that I know this software very well. The crashes that many of us are experiencing have nothing to do with user error.

deusx wrote on 3/26/2012, 9:44 AM

I don't know how much I'm pushing or not pushing Vegas percentage wise, but it works for me. maybe that is one of the problems. people pushing it, in other words using it as something it's not necessarily designed to do. It's not really supposed to be Fusion or After Effects even though it has some of those features built in.

Anyway, what's that got to do with support and additional pricing. Fusion support used to be considered great, probably still is, but that's why it cost $5000 not long ago ( I believe now it's 1/2 that ). Price of support is a big chunk of that. I only needed to contact them regarding license purchases/renewals and they have always been quick, but I never needed to contact them regarding the actual program ( I guess that's a good thing, it works ). Sony sellsVegas for $600 + extra for support if you need it instead of selling Vegas for $999 straight.

As for those Vegas crashes, why am I not experiencing them. I'm not saying yours are not real, but I drop video or audio in there, drop effects, slide pieces of video or audio around. Same thing everybody else is doing. Once you find something that causes it to crash, find a workaround. You'll find these bugs in any software. I still haven't been able to crash it though. Maybe my secret is keeping it simple. For audio all of my effects are the old school rack effects so I don't need any Vegas plugins ( outboard gear sounds better anyway ). For video effects I use Fusion, that is what it's for.

It's a given. The more crap you add to the mix the better your chances of encountering bugs and problems. It's always been like that. Nothing new.

Leee wrote on 3/26/2012, 10:27 AM

The problem in "finding a workaround" is that most of my crashes (and the ones I've read about) seem to have no rhyme or reason. So it's pretty hard to work around randomness. In my case it seems that whatever I might be doing, it's not a matter of IF its going to crash, but WHEN. I have about 15 minutes, maybe 30 if I'm lucky, then it will crash, no matter what I'm doing.

It's also true that everyone has a different setup, like snowflakes, no one computer system is the same. Recently, ALL of my NewBlueFX plugins refuse to work at all. I'll load the plugin onto the video clip, and press one button or slider within a second and Vegas stops working. But if I try the same thing on my laptop, it works fine.

The bottom line (at least for me) is that I am SO tired of walking on eggshells when using this software. I'm tired of the crashes, I'm tired of waiting for the next release in hopes it MIGHT make things better, I'm even tired about talking about it. But, I really don't have a choice. I have too much invested in this software. So I'll continue to wait and try and be patient, and ignore the subtle accusations from people who aren't having any problems, that its somehow my fault.

mikelinton wrote on 3/26/2012, 11:59 AM

You are so correct. We've been using Vegas for years, since version 4 I believe. We have 3 suites running it here and it's been our main editing software for nearly 7 years. We've applied to the Beta program probably a half dozen times, and have NEVER been accepted. Despite the fact we use it daily and often have multiple sessions on the go at once, and we've done just about anything and everything you can do in Vegas (except cut a feature)... TV spots, motion graphics, animation, compositing, broadcast documentaries. They've never even responded saying 'thanks for your interest, but...'

GregO wrote on 3/26/2012, 1:57 PM

Windows Version:7 64-bit
RAM:6gb
Processor:Intel(R) Core(TM) i7 CPU 920 @ 2.67Ghz
Video Card:ATI Radeon HD 4800 Series
Sound Card:Avid Mbox Pro

I know I should probably upgrade my ancient 3 year old system and that the Video card isn't supported by the GPU accelerator... but had no problems hardly at all with version 9 on this same system. The reason I upgraded was to be able to use new DSLR footage (which 9 didn't even allow me to load to my timeline). So... I figured "maybe it's just the DSLR footage, or the new blue titler." So, tried a project with good old AVCHD footage (that works flawlessly in 9) and a few jpg's and music. Nothing fancy. The thing still crashed on me in 11 and worse than that... won't render in various formats like "Main Concept AVC/AAC mpg4." Rendered in this hundreds of times in vegas 9 with no problem... but crashes in seconds on 11.

By the way... thank you all for trying to help. I've been a Vegas fan for a long time and made them a lot of money from referrals to their product. I'm not a complainer and can usually figure my way around problems. This version 11 though is just killing me. I'm running it on this desktop and my brand new fairly top-of-the-line laptop... and it's having issues on both.

To those who use the excuse that other software companies charge more...Sorry! If you put a price on a product your selling (and have a name and reputation like Sony), I expect to pay that price and have it work. Period! None of this bait and switch used car salesman krap.

And if you advertise all the "bells and whistles"... I'm buying it to USE all the bells and whistles. Not to dumb it down and only use it like a piece of basic freeware. They call it Vegas "Pro." I expect it to live up to it's name and be better than a simple LE version.

MPM wrote on 3/27/2012, 9:31 PM

>"Vegas 11 is CRASH HAPPY"

==============

It's a LOT of things, not all of 'em good, but unless I've given it a good reason to crash -- like adding some *really* iffy HD vid files -- Vegas has always been terribly stable for me since v. 3. To a fair extent Vegas uses what you have installed in/on your system when it comes to decoding imported vid -- if the way your setup handles whatever format is less than bulletproof, Vegas &/or alternatives can have problems. That said, personally think if it had AviSynth support that'd go a long way to ironing out, improving import/decode issues.

RE: GPU acceleration, it's hot, everyone's gotta have it, & it's a can of worms. Fastest is supposed to be Intel Quick Sync, used with Virtu so you can still have a graphics card with decent capabilities. Research I've done shows Nvidia lacking a bit in quality compared to pure software renders, though their new chip means a new ballgame well worth checking out. For me ATI's been pretty cool, with hardware vid accel available since the 2k series, but it's supported in very few video apps, & basically if you have ATI, you have driver issues. And if you have other software installed that has Direct Show filters that use ATI accel, they can & often will effect how Vegas behaves. With ATI Vegas can use DX, DS, DXVA, & often OCL -- the OCL part seems a work in progress, understandable since how well AMD/ATI cards work with video varies month to month with their newly released driver set... Sony's aiming at a moving target. Worst case I convert whatever video to UT with AviSynth -> VDub & import that, & haven't found anything I couldn't handle going that route [knock wood].

VanLazarus wrote on 3/28/2012, 12:16 AM

@ushere... Yes, I did sign a NDA, and nowhere does it say that I can't tell others that I'm a beta tester. And I'd encourage other heavy Vegas users to become beta testers as well.

@Duncan... Yes, I want Vegas 11 to be stable as well. I started a thread "Boycott Vegas 12 until Vegas 11 is stable", which I believe got the attention of some at SCS.

I'm now doing my best, and spend significant time, informing SCS of every problem I encounter and constantly give information that I hope will assist them in solving some of these problems.

I will eternally encourage SCS to hold off on releasing the next version of Vegas until it is as stable as humanly possible.

ushere wrote on 3/28/2012, 3:09 AM

so van, what exactly are you beta testing? new point release or ver 12?

curious.

2knowone2 wrote on 3/28/2012, 11:50 AM

THANK GOODNESS I'm not the only one having these issues!!! Everything seems to go just fine until I need to animate a text...or use this supposedly wonderful "New Blue Pro Titler" which basically a waste of space in my effects folder! And to get and answer from tech support??? HA! Hope you have lot's of time to wait around for and answer while your clients wonder where there video is!!! While you suffer through crash after crash!!!
Common SONY! If you want to play with the big boys you have to have a software that is TESTED BEFORE YOU LAUNCH! I shouldn't have to PAY YOU to beta test your product for you!
And Tech support should be a perk of buying this wonderful software! Not an ADDITIONAL EXPENSE! Your a multi billion dollar company! You should be thankful that we call you and tell you that there are issues that we would like to help you resolve so that we can continue using YOUR PRODUCT!
And then we can tell others how wonderful the tech support is! But then again...if the product works as well as it's supposed to...there won't be a lot of tech support issues!

I like Vegas's platform, interface, ease of use! It's has amazing potential!
But I see now why Final Cut and Adobe have seperate individual editing suites because it's painfully obvious that it's asking too much of Vegas to handle all the bells and whistles!

So for now I will have to use another software for graphics and import to the final render!

2knowone2 wrote on 3/28/2012, 11:57 AM

BETA TESTING??? That's what I've BEEN doing for Sony for several years now! I'ts just that I've had to PAY FOR IT! LOL!!!
So How do you become a beta tester?

david-ruby wrote on 3/28/2012, 12:36 PM

We get a few crashes everyday. Still not sure where the problem lies.

GregO wrote on 3/29/2012, 4:37 PM

So... Here are a few fixes that combined to work that tech support sent me. I just included the conversation below in case it helps anyone else in this situation. BTW the "specific issue to the SMALL number of users" he talks about was an issue on both my 3 year old computer... and my brand new top-of-the-line laptop. Guess I should buy a lottery ticket.

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Response Eric D. via Email 03/27/2012 10:35 AM Hi Greg,

Thank you for contacting Sony Creative Software.

There is a specific known issue a small number of users is experiencing where if the encode mode is set to automatic or GPU, the application will crash. Setting the encode mode to CPU only in the customize menu will allow you to render AVC AAC.

Sincerely,

Eric D.
Customer Service & Technical Support
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Still crashing immediately while trying to render AAC mp4 Response Eric D. via Email 03/26/2012 05:06 PM Hi Greg,

Please disable Startup applications and Background Services. To disable these items from starting, you can go to the Start menu and select Run. Then type msconfig into the field provided and press Enter or OK. In Windows Vista, there is a field at the bottom of the Start menu that you can type directly into.

Open the Startup tab, press the “Disable All” button and then Apply. Then go into the Services Tab, check the box next to “Hide All Microsoft Services” at the bottom of the window and choose Disable All. Then press Apply and OK and reboot the computer.

** Note: This measure is for testing purposes. If you are disabling these services, none of these services are critical for your computer to start or function. We recommend this troubleshooting step to remove as many variables from the problem as possible; though you may also be disabling desired services like anti-virus or portable device recognition services like iPod Service, etc. If this solves your issue, you may want to repeat the steps above to open the MSCONFIG dialog so that you can re-enable most of these services. You may want to spend some time re-enabling these one at a time until you find the culprit. Most likely there are just one or two services that are causing the conflict.
Sincerely,

Eric D.
Customer Service & Technical Support
Sony Creative Software Inc
www.sonycreativesoftware.com
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03/26/2012 01:11 AM
I did everything you suggested and it's running a little better... but it's still having a ton of problems. It's only allowing me to render in certian formats like WMV. When I try to render to the same AVC mp4 format I've rendered to in vegas 9 probably 100 times... it crashes within second on Vegas 11. This is very irritating to spend money on an upgrade that is soooo flawed... and not even as good as the version 9 I was using up until "upgrading" a few weeks ago.
I just finished another project in Vegas-11 on Saturday for a client who needs it in that specific Mp4 format and it crashed like I mentioned. So I tried to open the project in my trusty o;d version 9 and it wouldn't let me. Said I had to upgrade to 11. Then I tried to fix the problem by simply copying the items in the timeline and just pasting them in the timeline of 9. It works fine copying and pasting from 9 to 9... but won't do it at all from 11 to 9.

So... either I need a fix to a stable version of 11... or my money back. I did not sign up to be a beta tester for this faulty product.
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Response Eric D. via Email 03/19/2012 04:09 PM Hi Greg,

Try installing the software on a newly created Windows user account. This helps create a fresh install environment for the application.

Go to Control Panel > Programs and Features and uninstall the application if it is currently installed.

Now go to My Computer and browse to "C:\Program Files\Sony Setup" and delete the folders within.

Next, it's time to create a new user account with administrative privileges. Go to Control Panel > User Accounts. Select "Add New User" and type in a new name for the new user account. When asked what permissions level to assign to the account, select Administrator.

Then go to Start menu and choose "Logoff" or just restart the computer to switch users. Be sure to log into the new user account, reinstall the program, and register the application.

Once the application is up and running you can log back to your normal user account. Now go to Control Panel > User Accounts and remove the test account from your computer.

If you still have a follow-up question on this particular incident, please feel free to update it. If you have a completely different question, please create a new incident.

Sincerely,

Eric D.
Customer Service & Technical Support
Sony Creative Software Inc
www.sonycreativesoftware.com

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