M2TS Sometimes Pixelation and Artifacts, Vegas Pro 14, Build 178

Comments

hessam wrote on 11/9/2016, 1:26 AM

After long hours of testing different settings and conditions, as a long time vegas user I gave up and went back to latest build of VP13. and since vp13 doesnt open vp14 projects I had no choice but to start my project from scratch.

Here are my findings:

- most h264 mp4 files will have that block artifacts in vp14 (trimmer, preview, render) and it doesn't relate to preview quality setting.

- It is most likely to have those artifacts when working on low bitrate h264 clips.

- If the original low bitrate clip is re-encoded with Adobe Media Encoder to something like H264 / mp4 / 12Mbps then the vp14 build 189 will play the clip with no problem.

- I had some crashes in vp14 build 189 while rendering and by disabling GPU Acceleration I could prevent that.

 

apvv wrote on 11/9/2016, 3:08 AM

Fair enough VP.14.161 seems ok and draft is only preview, but how would you explain the artifacts being visible in the Trimmer Window in VP 14.178 and not in VP13.453? To me it seems a software flaw not related to any project properties and/or render settings...

Yes it`s bug/flaw not related with gpu,project or render properties.

Message received from MAGIX:

Hello

Thank you for your message.

I recommend installing the latest update of Vega Pro 14.  This will require running the trial installer again to obtain the latest build of the app. 

[Moderator edit: Name of Magix staff removed in accordance with community rule #9]

 

This implies that it would solve the issues. Apparently build 189 is the latest version, but reading the comments on that page it also has its problems. I am sticking to VP13 and not take the trouble to do another install until I see more positive reactions...

https://www.vegascreativesoftware.info/us/forum/vegas-pro-14-update-2-build-189--104313/#ca645063

I tested latest build (189) already and has the same behaviour regarding this bug/flaw.

apvv wrote on 11/9/2016, 3:27 AM

After long hours of testing different settings and conditions, as a long time vegas user I gave up and went back to latest build of VP13. and since vp13 doesnt open vp14 projects I had no choice but to start my project from scratch.

Here are my findings:

- most h264 mp4 files will have that block artifacts in vp14 (trimmer, preview, render) and it doesn't relate to preview quality setting.

- It is most likely to have those artifacts when working on low bitrate h264 clips.

- If the original low bitrate clip is re-encoded with Adobe Media Encoder to something like H264 / mp4 / 12Mbps then the vp14 build 189 will play the clip with no problem.

- I had some crashes in vp14 build 189 while rendering and by disabling GPU Acceleration I could prevent that.

 

My clip is H264 AVC (mts) at 16 mbs.

Happy wrote on 11/9/2016, 3:50 AM

Fair enough VP.14.161 seems ok and draft is only preview, but how would you explain the artifacts being visible in the Trimmer Window in VP 14.178 and not in VP13.453? To me it seems a software flaw not related to any project properties and/or render settings...

Yes it`s bug/flaw not related with gpu,project or render properties.

Message received from MAGIX:

Hello

Thank you for your message.

I recommend installing the latest update of Vega Pro 14.  This will require running the trial installer again to obtain the latest build of the app. 

[Moderator edit: Name of Magix staff removed in accordance with community rule #9]

 

This implies that it would solve the issues. Apparently build 189 is the latest version, but reading the comments on that page it also has its problems. I am sticking to VP13 and not take the trouble to do another install until I see more positive reactions...

https://www.vegascreativesoftware.info/us/forum/vegas-pro-14-update-2-build-189--104313/#ca645063

I tested latest build (189) already and has the same behaviour regarding this bug/flaw.

 

Good to know 189 is the same, thank you, I feel I made the right decision sticking with VP13 and also had to start my projects again in VP13 like 'hessam', doesn't help that VP14 projects don't open in VP13.

---

"[Moderator edit: Name of Magix staff removed in accordance with community rule #9]"

I would not like to have my name mentioned either, being in costumer service and presenting solutions like this...

Nick Hope wrote on 11/9/2016, 5:54 AM
"[Moderator edit: Name of Magix staff removed in accordance with community rule #9]"

I would not like to have my name mentioned either, being in costumer service and presenting solutions like this...

You broke a community rule and now you are insulting the support staff who are trying to assist you. The advice you received from support is the logical first step in trying to resolve your problem. They cannot be expected to support an old version when there is no good reason for you not to install the later versions. Please follow the community rules in your future postings.

Happy wrote on 11/9/2016, 6:54 AM

Sorry for breaking a rule I missed. It was not meant as an insult.  I merely feel this is not trying to assist, but cheap advice when it is already known there are issues with the latest buid as well. Also, I am not expecting support for an old version, as VP13 works for me. I came here because I like the new features and considered an upgrade for VP14. VP does not come cheap and for that money one may expect some quality, no trial-and-error, and surely not having to assist codevelop MAGIX software, which should be reason enough to not install later versions...

Nick Hope wrote on 11/9/2016, 7:28 AM

... it is already known there are issues with the latest buid as well.

We have just 2 users (apvv and hessam) who claim to experience this issue in the latest build (189). Can you be sure that they have carefully tested the most likely variables that might cause this? Can you be sure that they made support requests to Magix themselves and that Magix have since had time to analyze and correlate those requests and conclude that this is a bug?

VP does not come cheap and for that money one may expect some quality, no trial-and-error, and surely not having to assist codevelop MAGIX software, which should be reason enough to not install later versions...

All software of this complexity has bugs, and VP14 is still in its infancy. If you're not prepared to work with support to help resolve the issue you are facing then please stop complaining as it benefits nobody.

Now let's use this thread to analyze the problem and see if there is a common, repeatable factor that causes it. That can only be done with careful, methodical testing and sharing of the information I listed in this post, which nobody has bothered to supply yet.

Kinvermark wrote on 11/9/2016, 7:36 AM

@hessam,  @appv

Are these interlaced or progressive h264 files?   Can you link to a sample?

@happy

You don't have to debug the software. In fact, you (we) shouldn't - leave that to the pros!  Support HAS to follow a fairly ridgid / methodical approach or they could never manage the backlog of service requests efficiently. This is normal for all software support departments.

Happy wrote on 11/9/2016, 7:50 AM

@Nick Hope

Are you on the MAGIX payroll? I can not see how you can defend VP13 working and VP 14 not working for me.

"If it ain't broke fix it anyway"?, One may expect software to keep performing standard functions...

I was working with build 178, 189 is just a couple of days old. I am not 'complaining', I noticed things not working in VP14 anymore and only wanted to know if this was a known issue...

To be honest, I am done with this.  MAGIX just lost themselves my support.

Have it your way, you can close this thread, as ar as I am concerned... 

apvv wrote on 11/9/2016, 7:56 AM

@hessam,  @appv

Are these interlaced or progressive h264 files?   Can you link to a sample?

@happy

You don't have to debug the software. In fact, you (we) shouldn't - leave that to the pros!  Support HAS to follow a fairly ridgid / methodical approach or they could never manage the backlog of service requests efficiently. This is normal for all software support departments.

Thank you all for your questions,answers,support and participation in discussions!

H264 AVC (mts) at 16 mbs,interlaced.

I already notified Magix.They know and expect a solution with a new build soon regarding this issue and others.

hessam wrote on 11/9/2016, 8:17 AM

@hessam,  @appv

Are these interlaced or progressive h264 files?   Can you link to a sample?

@happy

You don't have to debug the software. In fact, you (we) shouldn't - leave that to the pros!  Support HAS to follow a fairly ridgid / methodical approach or they could never manage the backlog of service requests efficiently. This is normal for all software support departments.


Progressive - H264 - mp4

A project finished in VP13 has good quality but in VP14 build 189 has this issue.both GPU acceleration ON and all same settings. all drivers updated. win10

rendered demo using vp13 :

https://drive.google.com/open?id=0BxpdhyFfpxcFend6UzZGejRIRTA

rendered demo using vp14 Build189 : (pay attention to the sky and ground)

https://drive.google.com/open?id=0BxpdhyFfpxcFRm9vSkJsTkxTbFE

Happy wrote on 11/9/2016, 9:03 AM

@hessam,  @appv

Are these interlaced or progressive h264 files?   Can you link to a sample?

@happy

You don't have to debug the software. In fact, you (we) shouldn't - leave that to the pros!  Support HAS to follow a fairly ridgid / methodical approach or they could never manage the backlog of service requests efficiently. This is normal for all software support departments.


Progressive - H264 - mp4

A project finished in VP13 has good quality but in VP14 build 189 has this issue.both GPU acceleration ON and all same settings. all drivers updated. win10

rendered demo using vp13 :

https://drive.google.com/open?id=0BxpdhyFfpxcFend6UzZGejRIRTA

rendered demo using vp14 Build189 : (pay attention to the sky and ground)

https://drive.google.com/open?id=0BxpdhyFfpxcFRm9vSkJsTkxTbFE

Good job, confirms my findings...

Nick Hope wrote on 11/9/2016, 9:34 AM
Are you on the MAGIX payroll?

No

I already notified Magix.They know and expect a solution with a new build soon regarding this issue and others.

To be clear, have Magix support acknowledged by email that this is a bug and that they expect it to be solved in a new build?

hessam wrote on 11/10/2016, 2:25 AM

A project finished in VP13 has good quality but in VP14 build 189 has this issue.both GPU acceleration ON and all same settings. all drivers updated. win10

rendered demo using vp13 :

https://drive.google.com/open?id=0BxpdhyFfpxcFend6UzZGejRIRTA

rendered demo using vp14 Build189 : (pay attention to the sky and ground)

https://drive.google.com/open?id=0BxpdhyFfpxcFRm9vSkJsTkxTbFE

I see the difference, but when I test this myself I'm unable to see any difference in picture quality, file size or properties at MediaInfo.
Can you give us a screenshot of your rendertemplate in VP 14?


As I said before, it doesn't relate to render settings because I have this issue in preview and trimmer windows while editing. here are 2 screenshots of vp13 and vp14 Build 189 workspace:

EDIT : added screenshots

 

hessam wrote on 11/12/2016, 12:53 AM

Hi. I mostly see this flaw in rendered clips from Vegas and Aftereffects or downloaded from youtube. My GH4 and BMCC and 6D footages look good. I guess this is due to compressed and low bitrate footages that this build of vegas behaves differently.

arthur-h wrote on 11/12/2016, 12:30 PM

A project finished in VP13 has good quality but in VP14 build 189 has this issue.both GPU acceleration ON and all same settings. all drivers updated. win10

rendered demo using vp13 :

https://drive.google.com/open?id=0BxpdhyFfpxcFend6UzZGejRIRTA

rendered demo using vp14 Build189 : (pay attention to the sky and ground)

https://drive.google.com/open?id=0BxpdhyFfpxcFRm9vSkJsTkxTbFE

I see the difference, but when I test this myself I'm unable to see any difference in picture quality, file size or properties at MediaInfo.
Can you give us a screenshot of your rendertemplate in VP 14?


As I said before, it doesn't relate to render settings because I have this issue in preview and trimmer windows while editing. here are 2 screenshots of vp13 and vp14 Build 189 workspace:

EDIT : added screenshots

 

Same here.

Artifacts seen in preview too.
After render to mp4 (mainconcept and sony template) artifacts present.

:(

apvv wrote on 11/13/2016, 4:29 AM

A project finished in VP13 has good quality but in VP14 build 189 has this issue.both GPU acceleration ON and all same settings. all drivers updated. win10

rendered demo using vp13 :

https://drive.google.com/open?id=0BxpdhyFfpxcFend6UzZGejRIRTA

rendered demo using vp14 Build189 : (pay attention to the sky and ground)

https://drive.google.com/open?id=0BxpdhyFfpxcFRm9vSkJsTkxTbFE

I see the difference, but when I test this myself I'm unable to see any difference in picture quality, file size or properties at MediaInfo.
Can you give us a screenshot of your rendertemplate in VP 14?


As I said before, it doesn't relate to render settings because I have this issue in preview and trimmer windows while editing. here are 2 screenshots of vp13 and vp14 Build 189 workspace:

EDIT : added screenshots

 

Same here.

Artifacts seen in preview too.
After render to mp4 (mainconcept and sony template) artifacts present.

:(

Welcome to the club!

Toto_Vegas wrote on 11/13/2016, 9:04 AM

Hello,

I have got the same problem:

With Vegas Pro 13:

Withe Vegas Pro 14:

  • Windows version :
    Windows 7 64
  • Vegas versions:
    Vegas Pro 14 built 189
  • GPU model:
    ATI HD 6700 driver Catalyst version 15.7.1
  • Source media format:
    General
    ID                                       : 0 (0x0)
    Complete name                            : E:\Acquisition CX700\2016\2016-09-03_13-36-00.mts
    Format                                   : BDAV
    Format/Info                              : Blu-ray Video
    File size                                : 44.7 MiB
    Duration                                 : 14 s 395 ms
    Overall bit rate mode                    : Variable
    Overall bit rate                         : 26.0 Mb/s
    Maximum Overall bit rate                 : 28.0 Mb/s

    Video
    ID                                       : 4113 (0x1011)
    Menu ID                                  : 1 (0x1)
    Format                                   : AVC
    Format/Info                              : Advanced Video Codec
    Format profile                           : High@L4.2
    Format settings, CABAC                   : Yes
    Format settings, ReFrames                : 2 frames
    Format settings, GOP                     : M=1, N=12
    Codec ID                                 : 27
    Duration                                 : 14 s 400 ms
    Bit rate mode                            : Variable
    Bit rate                                 : 24.7 Mb/s
    Maximum bit rate                         : 26.0 Mb/s
    Width                                    : 1 920 pixels
    Height                                   : 1 080 pixels
    Display aspect ratio                     : 16:9
    Frame rate                               : 50.000 FPS
    Color space                              : YUV
    Chroma subsampling                       : 4:2:0
    Bit depth                                : 8 bits
    Scan type                                : Progressive
    Bits/(Pixel*Frame)                       : 0.239
    Stream size                              : 42.5 MiB (95%)

    Audio
    ID                                       : 4352 (0x1100)
    Menu ID                                  : 1 (0x1)
    Format                                   : AC-3
    Format/Info                              : Audio Coding 3
    Mode extension                           : CM (complete main)
    Format settings, Endianness              : Big
    Codec ID                                 : 129
    Duration                                 : 14 s 400 ms
    Bit rate mode                            : Constant
    Bit rate                                 : 256 kb/s
    Channel(s)                               : 2 channels
    Channel positions                        : Front: L R
    Sampling rate                            : 48.0 kHz
    Frame rate                               : 31.250 FPS (1536 spf)
    Bit depth                                : 16 bits
    Compression mode                         : Lossy
    Stream size                              : 450 KiB (1%)

    Text
    ID                                       : 4608 (0x1200)
    Menu ID                                  : 1 (0x1)
    Format                                   : PGS
    Codec ID                                 : 144
    Duration                                 : 13 s 855 ms

  • Project Properties:
  • Render settings:
    Debugmod Framesever. Same settings that project.
  • Confirmation of whether GPU acceleration:
    GPU processing Off. The same when ON.

 

MAGIX_Eric D wrote on 11/14/2016, 9:21 AM

Try setting the full resolution rendering quality to "good" and then initiate the same render. 

We have not been able to reproduce this issue as of yet, and are looking into determining the specific conditions under which the issue occurs. 

Toto_Vegas wrote on 11/14/2016, 2:42 PM

Hello,

I try what you said but no change. The issue is present in the previsualisation window then it's present in the rendered file.

When the default occures (not very often on a file) it's present each time at the same moment of the file.
There is something in the file that the internal decoder can't decode correctly. On the same file Vegas 13 have no problem.

I hope you understand what I say because I'm French.

FYI : My files came from Sony CX700. It's h264 codec.

Regards.
 

Toto_Vegas wrote on 11/14/2016, 2:56 PM

Hello,

I have cut a little piece of one of my video file. I used AVIDEMUX. I have put the cutted file on the cloud. Here is the link:
https://mega.nz/#!pRkWxYqR!SvQJbbMwhCeh0lAyWKNJ1osV8rBKg_vudM0SucD1yFA

I put this file on Vegas 13 and 14 : the issue is present only in Vegas 14:

Vegas 13:

Vegas 14:

I hope that you can make a test with my file.

Regards.

Quitter wrote on 11/14/2016, 3:18 PM

Got no artefacts, at good or full preview and no after rendering

with preview settings, light blocks appearing at the preview window

only with draft settings, i can see your artefacts at the preview window

Last changed by Quitter on 11/14/2016, 4:00 PM, changed a total of 3 times.

Camcorder: Sony CX 520 VE
Hardware:   Acer NG-A717-72G-71YD, Win 10 Home 1903, i7-8750 H, 16GB, GTX 1060 6GB, 250GB SSD, 1TB HDD
NLE:  Sony Vegas Pro 13.0 Build 453
           Vegas Pro 14.0 Build 270

Cornico wrote on 11/14/2016, 3:49 PM

Here the same results as Quitter, no problem in Vegas 13 and no problem in Vegas 14, both not in the trimmer nor in preview, nor in renderresult on laptop in my signature.

Toto_Vegas wrote on 11/14/2016, 4:23 PM

Hello,

Incredible. I have always the default :

Can you tell me what version of Vegas Pro 14 do you use? For me it's built 189.

Can you tell me what's the button "Original" on the preview widow? I don't have it.

Regards.